EFI Conversion

Discussion in 'Fuel and Air Systems' started by gabe380, Jul 10, 2018.

  1. gabe380

    gabe380 Member FABO Gold Member

    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2015
    Location:
    Portland, Or
    Local Time:
    11:20 AM
    I'm seriously considering switching to an EFI system for my 67 Dart. I've pretty much narrowed it down to the Fitech Go EFI 4, or the Fitech Go Street EFI. The only real difference between the two systems (other than $150) is that the EFI 4 has the option of controlling ign/timing as well as electric fans if desired.

    My car is strictly a cruiser, and will never see the track, so I'm not really sure that I would benefit from the ign/timing control. It isn't a self-learning system, and I don't really have the patience (or the knowledge) to set-up the timing correctly. Quite honestly, I'm just trying to make the car as turn-key as possible. I want to be able to fire it up after sitting in the garage all winter, check the fluids, and take off on a weekend trip without any hassles. FYI - It's a freshly rebuilt (1500mi ago) '68 318, .030 over, MP stock 340 cam, dual exhaust with OEM 340 HP manifolds, and an old-school LD340 intake.

    Not only am I on the fence between the two systems, but also about the ignition setup. Fitech says that any 2-wire ignition will work, as long as there is no ballast resistor being used on the car. The Fitech support guy said that the ideal way to go (if the EFI isn't controlling the ignition) is a GM style HEI distributor. I understand his point, but they don't make an air cleaner big enough to hide that big ugly Chevy HEI distributor cap. I currently have a simple $35 mopar ign box, powered through a ballast resistor, connected to a simple vac advance $35 NAPA electronic distributor. Obviously this has to go, but what to replace it with?

    Any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. 65 Dartman

    65 Dartman FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

    Messages:
    9,000
    Likes Received:
    1216
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2006
    Location:
    Strasburg, VA
    Local Time:
    2:20 PM
    I will be using a regular Mopar electronic dizzy with a HEI module fastened to an adapter that fastens to the bottom of the dizzy. No ballast resistor required so I can run timing control if I chose whenever I get to assembling the wagon

    Edit: here is the Mopar dizzy HEI adapter. Once fastened on the bottom, you’ll never see the HEI module AC53FEDF-2EE9-46C8-B175-390F8BE07058.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    • BigBlockMopar

      BigBlockMopar BigBlockMember

      Messages:
      1,381
      Likes Received:
      358
      Joined:
      May 1, 2011
      Location:
      Netherlands
      Local Time:
      8:20 PM
      You're wrong about timing control not benefitting a street car. Timing is way more important on a street car than on some straightline limited use car. Dragracers are the ones that usually don't care/know/need how to properly set timing because something around 36° degrees advance is all they'll usually care about.

      But if one doesn't care to get involved with the engine's timing needs and the current distributor is running 'fine', then don't opt for timing control.

      You also don't need such a (stupid) large GM-style distributor to be able to use a HEI-ignition.
      A simple Mopar electronic distributor can trigger a HEI-module just fine and run without a ballast resistor with a more modern (better) coil.
       
      • Agree Agree x 4
      • Like Like x 1
      • Early a body

        Early a body New Member

        Messages:
        3
        Likes Received:
        2
        Joined:
        Jun 25, 2018
        Location:
        Nevada
        Local Time:
        11:20 AM
        I added the Fitech kit without timing control. I have had it installed and going for a little over a year. I used an MSD box and bypassed the ballast resistor. I am also using a Mopar distributor. I was having trouble with the unit running properly. It turned out to be a worn reluctor on my distributor and the tach wire from the FiTech unit receiving signal interference from the spark plug wires. The Blue tach wire needs to be isolated. Fitech said I should use an MSD distributor too. Tired that and it would not turn run , ran like crap, changed to a new mopar distributor and the problem was solved. I have had 2 issues with the Fitech system so far after I got everything running smoothly. I am on my third fuel pump. I used the frame mounted kit they provide. The first one would not seal properly due to a uneven surface where one of the fittings go in, the second pump went out on me this week end. If I were to do it over again, I would change to an in tank pump ( see tanks inc). When this fuel pump dies, I likely will do the switch. The second issue is the system drains my battery if the car is not in use. So I keep a battery tender on it until I figure out what to do, I plan to call Fitech back on this and ask them what could be causing this. As far as reliability, its great, gas mileage on my 65 dart with a 318, 302 heads 340 exhaust manifolds and a 4 speed with overdrive is 19.5 with 2.94 gears. I will be going to 3.23 when I get the 8 3/4 installed. I noticed on steep climbs this system gave me more power over the 4 barrel eddy carb and did not require a downshift, where the car I had to downshift. I don't know how long these self learning systems have been around, but it does seem we are the guinea pigs on working out the problems.
         
        • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
        • dusted

          dusted Well-Known Member

          Messages:
          114
          Likes Received:
          67
          Joined:
          Sep 24, 2006
          Location:
          Creedmoor, NC
          Local Time:
          2:20 PM
          I hear good things about the Holley sniper kits also and they have great texh support. Just my opinion
           
          • Like Like x 1
          • Agree Agree x 1
          • jrcr_15

            jrcr_15 Active Member

            Messages:
            39
            Likes Received:
            4
            Joined:
            Jan 3, 2006
            Local Time:
            1:20 PM
            I am working on installing a fitech unit on my car now and am trying to figure out the wiring.. namely where to run the white
             
          • myduster360

            myduster360 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

            Messages:
            376
            Likes Received:
            265
            Joined:
            Oct 8, 2009
            Location:
            Central IL
            Local Time:
            1:20 PM
            Absolutely. If anyone can add digital timing control DO IT!

            On my Holley EFI, I used a LEAN BURN distributor since its a solid shaft without any timing advance. Then just ran its reluctor signal to an HEI module mounted to a heat sink on the firewall.

            65 Dartman's $25 HEI mount looks even easier than a firewall heat sink
            Mopar HEI Conversion

            upload_2018-7-10_17-28-13.png
             
            Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
            • Like Like x 1
            • Hellrats

              Hellrats Still wrenching after all these years

              Messages:
              465
              Likes Received:
              250
              Joined:
              Jan 24, 2012
              Location:
              Hartville, Ohio
              Local Time:
              2:20 PM
              Damn, sounds like a lot of work and money. Carburetors work really well when you get them set up correctly. You did say it was "strictly a cruiser". Just add the HEI module, tune it and cruse.
               
              • Agree Agree x 1
              • Caco2120

                Caco2120 Well-Known Member

                Messages:
                133
                Likes Received:
                42
                Joined:
                May 30, 2015
                Location:
                Marion
                View My Photos
                Local Time:
                2:20 PM
                I’d Recommend getting ahold of @Johnny Mac from Blueprint engines. He helped get tons of guys straight in the fitech thread. He is very experienced with the fitech, and the sniper. He sells the sniper at Blueprint, and I know he has distributors that work with both units. I’d get with him, especially being a forum sponsor that sells them, and helps us all, before doing anything. He’ll get ya what you need.
                 
                • Like Like x 2
                • Johnny Mac

                  Johnny Mac www.blueprintengines.com FABO Vendor

                  Messages:
                  2,255
                  Likes Received:
                  702
                  Joined:
                  Jul 10, 2010
                  Location:
                  OHIO
                  View My Photos
                  Local Time:
                  2:20 PM
                  Glad to help anyone I can. Shoot me a PM. I regularly see incorrect assumptions about these units, and the equipment they require. I sell inexpensive distributors that already contain the HEI if you aren't running timing control. I will correct one point made above. You cannot run timing control with a 4 pin module. You need a 2 wire pickup, preferably in a pro-billet type distributor, so we can properly phase the rotor. PM box is open :)
                   
                  • Like Like x 3
                  • cannucky

                    cannucky The Guy With No Birthday

                    Messages:
                    5,498
                    Likes Received:
                    511
                    Joined:
                    Sep 25, 2008
                    Location:
                    Victoria BC
                    View My Photos
                    Local Time:
                    11:20 AM
                    I've been toying with the same idea for my stroker but I will run the MSD dizzy with the adjustable rotor in it and use the timing control in the FiTech unit which to me is the best reason to make the jump to EFI , a self learning system with full timing control fed by a Tanks set up is my plan .Carbs a great if you don'y mind going through them every year .
                     
                  • gabe380

                    gabe380 Member FABO Gold Member

                    Messages:
                    21
                    Likes Received:
                    2
                    Joined:
                    Nov 4, 2015
                    Location:
                    Portland, Or
                    Local Time:
                    11:20 AM
                    I've already ordered the Tanks, Inc. EFI Tank ($206 @ Summit), and a new sending unit. Will order the Fitech in-tank pump when I order the system.

                    The fuel side of the Fitech EFI is self learning, but the timing side is not - and I think I just have a mental block about what's involved to dial it in correctly.

                    I agree - carbs are great...but I live in Oregon, and don't take this car out in the rain - so it stays in the garage from Nov - Mar. and always needs the carb gone through each spring.
                     
                  • gabe380

                    gabe380 Member FABO Gold Member

                    Messages:
                    21
                    Likes Received:
                    2
                    Joined:
                    Nov 4, 2015
                    Location:
                    Portland, Or
                    Local Time:
                    11:20 AM
                    Good advice. This is why I posted. After everyone's comments, I am now leaning toward the better unit with the timing control.
                     
                  • Hellrats

                    Hellrats Still wrenching after all these years

                    Messages:
                    465
                    Likes Received:
                    250
                    Joined:
                    Jan 24, 2012
                    Location:
                    Hartville, Ohio
                    Local Time:
                    2:20 PM
                    Man i must be missing something. I live in Ohio and have many a cars sit with fuel in them. I don't even add anything to the tank when I put them away. Most sit in unheated garages some heated. But I also always put the best fuel without ethanol I can find in them. I don't take my carbs apart every year. Not even in my lawn tractors. You could just put a fuel shut off in the line and run it out of fuel when you put it away. Just trying to save you a lot of money on that "strictly a cruiser" car.
                     
                  • Coyote Jack

                    Coyote Jack Member #55, I'm old FABO Gold Member

                    Messages:
                    8,074
                    Likes Received:
                    1405
                    Joined:
                    May 22, 2004
                    Location:
                    Baxters Corner N.B. Canad
                    View My Photos
                    Local Time:
                    3:20 PM
                    I have had the 2x4 1200 PA system on my blown 340 for about 400 miles so far. I tend to lean toward the K.I.S.S. way of thinking. I have had MSD ignition all along and it works great so I stayed with it and bypassed the timing control. My engine is locked out at 31 degrees. When installing the FiTech I shielded all the wires and left the handheld programing module unplugged after initial setup. I have always been a carb guy and learned to adjust carbs long ago. I have to say, that after running this FiTech, as long as it doesn't crap out on me, I will never run another carb. It IS that much better.

                    Jack
                     
                    • Like Like x 1
                    • cannucky

                      cannucky The Guy With No Birthday

                      Messages:
                      5,498
                      Likes Received:
                      511
                      Joined:
                      Sep 25, 2008
                      Location:
                      Victoria BC
                      View My Photos
                      Local Time:
                      11:20 AM
                      if I lived in a flat state and didn't drive my car every weekend year round I might agree with you but I don't .I live on an island of rock with thousands of feet if elevation change every time I go anywhere out of town , when I go cross country in it every summer it goes through tens of thousands of feet of elevation changes .Plus if I only drove it once in a rare while and let it sit in the garage looking pretty I probably wouldn't care about the tuneup either .
                       
                      • Agree Agree x 1
                      • jrcr_15

                        jrcr_15 Active Member

                        Messages:
                        39
                        Likes Received:
                        4
                        Joined:
                        Jan 3, 2006
                        Local Time:
                        1:20 PM
                        I am putting together a very similar set up on my Duster, do you mind if I pick your brain at somepoint?
                         
                        • Like Like x 1
                        • JoeSBP

                          JoeSBP RLTW!

                          Messages:
                          961
                          Likes Received:
                          424
                          Joined:
                          Jun 16, 2015
                          Location:
                          NC
                          View My Photos
                          Local Time:
                          2:20 PM
                          it's the hand held. Fitech has stated they didn't think anyone would want the handheld to stay plugged in and visibly mounted, so it's not designed with that in mind. Simply unplug it when you know it will be sitting. It won't lose anything, mine hasn't anyway, and no longer drains the battery
                           
                          • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                          • JoeSBP

                            JoeSBP RLTW!

                            Messages:
                            961
                            Likes Received:
                            424
                            Joined:
                            Jun 16, 2015
                            Location:
                            NC
                            View My Photos
                            Local Time:
                            2:20 PM
                            I consider myself to be fairly dumb, but I was able to get it installed. When you are ready, you can just give me a call and I can talk you through setting it all up
                             
                            • Like Like x 1
                            • jos51700

                              jos51700 Well-Known Member

                              Messages:
                              3,996
                              Likes Received:
                              854
                              Joined:
                              May 24, 2009
                              Location:
                              Bel-Ray
                              Local Time:
                              1:20 PM
                              Installing EFI with no timing control is like paying for the happy ending and only getting the massage.

                              It's warm-aide.

                              Ham with no burger.

                              Cereal without milk.

                              Going to a buffet just to look at the food.

                              Do the timing control, slap that bitch on a dyno, and get it tuned.

                              Occasional cruiser or not, proper and aggressive timing control is always worth it.
                               
                              • Agree Agree x 2
                              • Like Like x 1
                              • famous bob

                                famous bob mopar misfit

                                Messages:
                                9,434
                                Likes Received:
                                1984
                                Joined:
                                Aug 14, 2011
                                Location:
                                okla
                                Local Time:
                                1:20 PM
                                Agree, its nice to tune from the drivers seat !!
                                 
                                • Agree Agree x 2
                                • Like Like x 1
                                • Coyote Jack

                                  Coyote Jack Member #55, I'm old FABO Gold Member

                                  Messages:
                                  8,074
                                  Likes Received:
                                  1405
                                  Joined:
                                  May 22, 2004
                                  Location:
                                  Baxters Corner N.B. Canad
                                  View My Photos
                                  Local Time:
                                  3:20 PM
                                  Ask away.

                                  Jack
                                   
                                • jbc426

                                  jbc426 Well-Known Member

                                  Messages:
                                  1,480
                                  Likes Received:
                                  370
                                  Joined:
                                  May 30, 2007
                                  Location:
                                  West Coast
                                  Local Time:
                                  11:20 AM

                                  With the introduction of this latest Pro-Flo EFI conversion kits at this price point, it's seems prudent to spend a bit more and skip the throttle body EFI units. The Edelbrock Pro-Flo 4 sequential multi-port system is vastly superior in almost every regard.

                                  There seems to really be no comparison between the two styles given the low cost of Edelbrocks system. Throttle bodies are good, but they don't come close to the benefits that Multi-Point EFI systems provide.

                                  ...and yes, the are available for both big and small block Mopar's.

                                  Electronic Fuel Injection - Pro-Flo 4 - Chevy - Edelbrock, LLC.
                                   
                                • JoeSBP

                                  JoeSBP RLTW!

                                  Messages:
                                  961
                                  Likes Received:
                                  424
                                  Joined:
                                  Jun 16, 2015
                                  Location:
                                  NC
                                  View My Photos
                                  Local Time:
                                  2:20 PM
                                  I would steer clear of some obscure little boutique company like Edelbrock that is jumping into EFI now that FiTech has perfected it and demonstrated there is a huge market for it..
                                   
                                  • Like Like x 1
                                  • Agree Agree x 1
                                  • 65 Dartman

                                    65 Dartman FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

                                    Messages:
                                    9,000
                                    Likes Received:
                                    1216
                                    Joined:
                                    Sep 24, 2006
                                    Location:
                                    Strasburg, VA
                                    Local Time:
                                    2:20 PM
                                    Looks like right now they are geared towards Chevy. I did see they said a certain type of intake manifold is required for a small block Mopar, which of course, everyone has one in their garage. I’lk Wait and see how they go!