Engine rattle on fresh start up

[Kern Dog]

I think that I know what is the problem but I want to quiz you guys to see if we come up with the same thing...
The engine is a '78 or '79 360 from a van that I parted out in 2007. I slipped a 340 cam in it, a Weiand intake and 340 manifolds and stuffed it into a 72 Duster after replacing the rod bearings. The engine had been gone through sometime before I got this van but who knows when....There were a couple of bearings that had some wear. I had some standard size bearings here so I used them.
Here we go....It starts and runs fantastic but after sitting awhile or a cold start, it has what may be a valvetrain rattle/tapping/knocking sound for less than 2 seconds before going completely silent as the engine is running, even at idle. I have no oil pressure gauge in the car but I can rig one up to test, maybe after Christmas.
The car was a project between my Brother in law and myself. I got the car in 2007 and after awhile, he lost interest and I bought him out. The oil level is full but has not been changed in quite awhile. The last oil change could easily have been more than 10 years ago. There is no slop in the rocker arms or pushrods though it does have an exhaust leak.
I suspect the oil filter isn't maintaining any pressure in it, I'm going to change the oil and filter and report back.

 

[Gator]

It sounds like your lifters have bled down and are dry. First thing I would do is definitely change the oil and filter and then before starting remove the coil wire and turn the engine over for about 5-10 seconds allowing the oil pump to supply the engine with fresh oil then reinstall the coil wire and start up the engine. You should not hear your lifters chattering. I hope that when you installed your new cam you included new lifters so that the two can marry themselves together.

 

[Darter6]

your lifters have bled down and are dry.

Quality of todays parts. Had a woman bring in a 73 Cadillac 500 ci with lifter tap. She couldn't stand the constant noise.
We replaced all the lifters. You guessed it. Lifter tap for a few seconds after every cold start. Only driving it on occasions, She was ok with that.
Yes we checked the cam and also put a new timing chain. Still I wish it was cured

 

[Newbomb Turk]

Depending on the lifter, the oil you are using and how much preload you have on the lifters it can be normal.

 

[dano]

Manual or Auto? I've had throw out bearings make funky noises.

 

[drodg58]

Correct if I am wrong but didn't a lot of the small blocks have some lifter clatter at first start up. My 340 in my 72 Demon doesn't but I have had a few 318's that did or I should say between my dad and I we have.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Without hearing it, it will be difficult to tell. Sometimes, valve train can sound like bottom end and bottom end can sound like valve train, so anything said here is only a "guess".

 

[PRH]

Here we go....It starts and runs fantastic but after sitting awhile or a cold start, it has what may be a valvetrain rattle/tapping/knocking sound for less than 2 seconds before going completely silent as the engine is running, even at idle.

While I wouldn’t enjoy a little lifter clatter on a cold start…….. if that was the only complaint…….. I’m not going to devote a bunch of time trying to rectify it.

 

[Hellrats]

New cam and lifters? Hope you broke it in correctly. If so it should be fine. They will rattle a bit after sitting. The lifters bleed off and it takes time to get the oil up there.

 

[TF360]

Wait, am I reading this properly? You are using oil that's 10 years old after replacing some parts? Am I wrong? Also, are the rocker shafts on correctly?

 

[missing linc]

I would sometimes get that slight 'lifter rattle' in my 360 when it wasn't run in a few weeks, never really worried about it and it never seemed to be a problem. Change the oil and filter and drive on.

 

[Hellrats]

Even my 5.9 magnum rattles after sitting for more than a few days. Come to think of it so does my 3.2 in my Jeep

 

[72bluNblu]

Lifters in my 340 have done this since new. I’ve even changed and upgraded lifters since then because I had one that wouldn’t pump up. On a cold start I always get a couple seconds of lifter clatter, it goes away immediately and that corresponds with the oil pressure gauge hitting full pressure.

 

[Hellrats]

Remember when STP was sold to eliminate dry start ups and valve noise?

 

[PRH]

A lifter tick and oil tale……

New 2004 Chevy 2500 with 6.0 LS.
Owners manual calls for 5/30.
First oil change…….5/30 & filter.
Next morning……. Tick tick tick on start up.
Hmmm, never did that before.

Did it again a few more mornings.
Checked out the BITOG site……. General consensus for 6.0 ls at the time there was mobil 1 4qts 10/30 & 2 qts 10/40.
Never ticked again.

 

[Hellrats]

That engine is nothing like a Mopar LA engine though. Wait, aren't those engines recalled or something like that?

 

[jimjimjimmy]

If i understand this right it ticks for 2 seconds on start up and your worried ?

 

[PRH]

I still have it, and it’s never made any valvetrain noise since going to the slightly thicker oil.

The 10/40 Mobil one has gotten hard to get here, so it’s straight 10/30 now.

My old 3.9 magnum in my Dakota thrashed away with thinner oil after it got some miles on it.
Used some oil too.
Nice and quiet on 20/50……. And stopped using oil.

 

[MidnightSwinger]

A lifter tick and oil tale……

New 2004 Chevy 2500 with 6.0 LS.
Owners manual calls for 5/30.
First oil change…….5/30 & filter.
Next morning……. Tick tick tick on start up.
Hmmm, never did that before.

Did it again a few more mornings.
Checked out the BITOG site……. General consensus for 6.0 ls at the time there was mobil 1 4qts 10/30 & 2 qts 10/40.
Never ticked again.

I inherited my dad’s 2004 Silverado with the 4.8 3 years ago with 170,000 miles. Now has 203,000. It’s ticked on startup the whole time. 10/40 cured it but mpg noticeably suffered. I run 5/30 now and deal with it.

 

[72bluNblu]

Honestly I think it’s more to do with lifter quality than anything else. Although on my 340 I am running a Lunati cam with fairly fast ramps and higher spring pressures for a hydraulic flat tappet.

But I’ve run multiple different oil weights, 10-30, 10-40, 20-50 and various combinations of those 3 with no changes, all the high zinc Brad Penn. And it stayed the same after upgrading lifters as well, I went from the Lunati’s with the spring clip to the higher performance c-clip version and had the same thing. Hasn’t changed in over 10 years and almost 45k miles.

As long as it stops when the pressure tops out and only does it on a cold start I’m not too worried about it.

 

[340six]

Remember when STP was sold to eliminate dry start ups and valve noise?

Motor Honey (STP) in my day was okay. But I was a Marvel Mystery Oil guy.
That and SeaFoam in da gas.

 

[Kern Dog]

New cam and lifters? Hope you broke it in correctly. If so it should be fine. They will rattle a bit after sitting. The lifters bleed off and it takes time to get the oil up there.

The cam and lifters were new when I installed them in 2007.

Lifters in my 340 have done this since new. I’ve even changed and upgraded lifters since then because I had one that wouldn’t pump up. On a cold start I always get a couple seconds of lifter clatter, it goes away immediately and that corresponds with the oil pressure gauge hitting full pressure.

That describes it exactly, just a momentary clatter that clears up immediately after starting. It never rattles any other time.

If i understand this right it ticks for 2 seconds on start up and your worried ?

I don't think that I mentioned being "worried", just curious to learn if others have had a similar situation.
I have 3 other hydraulic cam Mopar V8s in cars out back that start up and are as silent as new. Even the 383 in Jigsaw, an engine I rebuilt using a Mopar Performance 280/474 cam. That dude just starts and rumbles.
I'm heading out back to tinker. I'll report my findings....