Engine vibration

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Hey guys I saw a thread with a similar problem but it ended up being a problem I know isn’t similar to mine. I have a 1972 dodge dart 225 with an exhaust pump and a “valve” between the intake and exhaust manifold. Since I rebuilt the engine it has a little bit of a “jitter” but lately due to summer temps it’s been running a little more rough.

The first thing I did (that I saw from that past thread) was block off the valve from the exhaust to the intake (since it said that valve can cause tuning issues and rough running). However I did notice more a burnt gas smell inside the cabin following this, is this a common thing or should I look for another source of the issue.
My next step which I’ll probably do this Saturday would be readjust the valves and clean the plugs. I would appreciate any advice or suggestions on this thank you!
 
I’ll check it out a little later and keep you posted, I really hope it isn’t since I had to redo the valves on it earlier this year
 

This is not a Honda. It is 70 year old technology. Did you replace your motor mounts? Sometimes those are rock hard and transmit vibrations.
 
id investigate the smell of exhaust
in theory the only place it can come out is the tail pipe, so with the boot/tailgate and rear windows shut you should not smell it

check your inelt/exhaust gasket and mounting of manifolds for leaks
check the junction between the cast iron manifold and exhaust
when you are happy your car won't gas you...carry on with the investigation regarding exhaust gas recirculation

unless of course you exhaust fume smell is caused by incomplete block off of that valve.
 
Have someone plug the exhaust with shop cloths while running, or similar while you quickly listen front and around the car.
Any exhaust leaks will be loud and clear .
The person holding the cloths likely will have very hot hands, might need a coupla tries.
 
I have a 1972 dodge dart 225 with an exhaust pump and a “valve” between the intake and exhaust manifold.

Okeh, so the underhood configuration is non-stock. That valve, called the EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) valve, did not appear until 1973. There was no provision to mount it on 1972 intake manifolds.

The presence of the air pump says your car was built for sale in California; non-CA '72s did not have the air pump. They did have a seriously awful full-time exhaust gas recirculation system with no valve, described here. Those cars were not happy runners, particularly not at their high-and-rough idle.

But your intake obviously has provisions for an EGR valve, which has clearly been removed and a blockoff plate installed. With a new gasket, it's to hope. Very fine. What (specific) carburetor do you have? Not just "Holley" or "Holley 1920", but which exact one? The number is stamped on the carb body above the float bowl, which is the rectangular part at the front.

Since I rebuilt the engine it has a little bit of a “jitter” but lately due to summer temps it’s been running a little more rough.

The rhythmic (rather than randomly lumpy) roughness in the vid suggests a couple of possibilities. Top of the list: at least one of your valves could be set a bit too tight. Follow the valve adjustment procedure. Next on the list: one or more single-cylinder vacuum leaks; this usually means a faulty seal at the manifold-to-head gasket junction. It is very much worth your while to get the good gaskets for the manifolds-to-head and intake-to-exhaust junctions. Take a careful look at your spark plugs when you pull them (and take/post a clear, sharp, close pic of all six of them lined up in 1-2-3-4-5-6 order); if there's a vacuum leak in a cylinder or two, it'll show up on the business ends of the plugs.

Another possibility is an incorrectly-chosen or stuck-open PCV valve. Many differently-calibrated ones look and fit alike; an incorrect, faulty, or poor-quality one can cause shaky idling.

Your idle speed sounds like it's set too high, perhaps to the high speed specced for California '72s to prevent them stalling with that no-valve EGR setup. Go set your idle speed and mixture and your basic ignition timing as described here in this post and see if that also helps smooth things out.

Beyond that, Carburetor operation and repair manuals and links to training movies and carb repair/modification threads are posted here for free download, and you'll want to look at the tune-up parts and technique suggestions in this post.

I'd recommend deleting (removing) the air pump and its associated plumbing and brackets. You'll need to plug the holes at the rear of the cylinder head. This will greatly reduce underhood temperatures, which will help numerous aspects of driveability. Consider doing the fuel line mod and the HEI upgrade to further improve how the car runs.

I did notice more a burnt gas smell inside the cabin following this, is this a common thing

No. You should not smell exhaust inside the car, full stop. If you do, that is dangerous. Find and fix the exhaust leaks and the body leaks. Make this your top priority so you get to stay alive. The first link earlier in this comment describes some common leak points, including one specific to '70-'72 exhaust manifolds (which your car might still have despite the '73-up intake).
 
Take a compression test. How even are the cylinders?
Sorry for the late reply everyone, it’s been a busy week at work and a couple projects prevented me from working on the car. I checked the compression
1.)115, 2.)113, 3.)115, 4.)113, 5.)110, 6.)110, which it seems pretty normal and not too different

I’ve been looking for that exhaust smell as well but i haven’t been able to deduce anything from it as of yet I’ve just been driving with all the windows down haha

Okeh, so the underhood configuration is non-stock. That valve, called the EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) valve, did not appear until 1973. There was no provision to mount it on 1972 intake manifolds.

The presence of the air pump says your car was built for sale in California; non-CA '72s did not have the air pump. They did have a seriously awful full-time exhaust gas recirculation system with no valve, described here. Those cars were not happy runners, particularly not at their high-and-rough idle.

But your intake obviously has provisions for an EGR valve, which has clearly been removed and a blockoff plate installed. With a new gasket, it's to hope. Very fine. What (specific) carburetor do you have? Not just "Holley" or "Holley 1920", but which exact one? The number is stamped on the carb body above the float bowl, which is the rectangular part at the front.



The rhythmic (rather than randomly lumpy) roughness in the vid suggests a couple of possibilities. Top of the list: at least one of your valves could be set a bit too tight. Follow the valve adjustment procedure. Next on the list: one or more single-cylinder vacuum leaks; this usually means a faulty seal at the manifold-to-head gasket junction. It is very much worth your while to get the good gaskets for the manifolds-to-head and intake-to-exhaust junctions. Take a careful look at your spark plugs when you pull them (and take/post a clear, sharp, close pic of all six of them lined up in 1-2-3-4-5-6 order); if there's a vacuum leak in a cylinder or two, it'll show up on the business ends of the plugs.

Another possibility is an incorrectly-chosen or stuck-open PCV valve. Many differently-calibrated ones look and fit alike; an incorrect, faulty, or poor-quality one can cause shaky idling.

Your idle speed sounds like it's set too high, perhaps to the high speed specced for California '72s to prevent them stalling with that no-valve EGR setup. Go set your idle speed and mixture and your basic ignition timing as described here in this post and see if that also helps smooth things out.

Beyond that, Carburetor operation and repair manuals and links to training movies and carb repair/modification threads are posted here for free download, and you'll want to look at the tune-up parts and technique suggestions in this post.

I'd recommend deleting (removing) the air pump and its associated plumbing and brackets. You'll need to plug the holes at the rear of the cylinder head. This will greatly reduce underhood temperatures, which will help numerous aspects of driveability. Consider doing the fuel line mod and the HEI upgrade to further improve how the car runs.



No. You should not smell exhaust inside the car, full stop. If you do, that is dangerous. Find and fix the exhaust leaks and the body leaks. Make this your top priority so you get to stay alive. The first link earlier in this comment describes some common leak points, including one specific to '70-'72 exhaust manifolds (which your car might still have despite the '73-up intake).
I have a 12R5153B Holley 1920 HOWEVER I did have to block off the upper diaphragm (pic below) since it was ripped and causing a vacuum leak.
IMG_0131.jpeg

Also I have already upgraded to electric ignition and added a little extra gap to the spark plugs to compensate for that, however they are still copper plugs so I’m not sure it that’s what’s causing my jitter and I should just upgrade.
Tomorrow I’m going to redo the lash in the valves since that’s what I believe to be the most likely culprit but I don’t know if I should do factory lash or change it since I do have the electric ignition. According to my handbook inlet should be 0.010 and exhaust 0.020 so if you guys have any recommendations I’d really appreciate the help!

Also I didn’t explain myself properly but it’s not necessarily a “valve” but rather a direct access from exhaust to intake with this “valve” opening and closing depending on the throttle level. It has a little tube (which I plugged up) which leads directly from the exhaust into the intake manifold, which after I plugged it I started getting the exhaust smell.
IMG_0130.jpeg


Final thing I did accelerate it a little just to prevent it from dying in the morning when I try to warm it up, it not something that bothers me too much or is it at the tip of my priority list at the moment.

Thank you all for the help!!
 
Your compression is fine; that's not the problem.


I have a 12R5153B Holley 1920

That's not the carb type number, that's its casting number, on the passenger side of the carb. The type number is on the front, above the float bowl.

I did have to block off the upper diaphragm (pic below) since it was ripped and causing a vacuum leak.
That's your choke pull-off. It needs to work correctly or you'll waste a ton of gasoline, foul your spark plugs, and the car will behave poorly until it's all the way warmed up. You need a new choke pull-off.

Also I have already upgraded to electric ignition and added a little extra gap to the spark plugs to compensate for that

Which (specific) electronic system did you install? Some of them do merit a wider plug gap, and some do not. The Chrysler-type system does not.

however they are still copper plugs so I’m not sure it that’s what’s causing my jitter

It's not. Copper plugs are fine (though they should be carefully chosen (read that tune-up link i posted), and they need to be installed without the metal ring washers).

Tomorrow I’m going to redo the lash in the valves since that’s what I believe to be the most likely culprit but I don’t know if I should do factory lash or change it since I do have the electric ignition.

Electronic ignition has nothing to do with the valve adjustment specs. Read the valve adjustment link in my previous comment.

Also I didn’t explain myself properly but it’s not necessarily a “valve”

Your car does have an intake manifold equipped for an EGR valve, and it has been blocked off.

but rather a direct access from exhaust to intake with this “valve” opening and closing depending on the throttle level.

That's the manifold heat control valve. It's supposed to be there, and it needs to be working (and it sounds like it is, by your saying it moves when you rev the engine).

It has a little tube (which I plugged up) which leads directly from the exhaust into the intake manifold, which after I plugged it I started getting the exhaust smell.
I think you mean the flex duct that goes from the sheetmetal shroud surrounding the central part of the exhaust manifold, to the underside of the air cleaner snorkel. About 2" diameter. It's missing, now I look again at your video. Put it back after you fix the exhaust leak which (going by your newly smelling exhaust after removing the flex duct) is either at the intake-to-exhaust manifold junction, or at the exhaust-manifold-to-headpipe junction, or both.

Also, you do have a '72 exhaust manifold with the leakprone choke cup gasket setup.
 
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