Help with some wiring for 1968 Dodge Dart

[Nidhögg]

Hi, Im currently working on my cars wiring, preparing to drop the engine in with new alternator, distributor, electric SPAL fan etc, and also checking through what works in the car.
So far I have bought a relay that seem to fit for the headlights (probably got installed by dealer when imported to Sweden, long dark winter nights here), but the relay was missing when I got the car so I´m a little lost as to which connection go where.

Now, this is the relay:



Update: I got the wrong relay, its supposed to be 30 -> 87a (low beams), when triggered 30 -> 87 (high beams), se pic.
Now I just need to find where to triggered it so its permanent triggered (stick button is spring loaded and will release)

There were 4 cables in the same sleeve and then another that lay close to them, the first 4 are connected as follows:
30: Power
87/87: To high/low beams
86: Dont know where this one goes, probably light selector switch?

And then there is the fifth cable, connected to 85, that seems to go to the turn signal stick button, picture:


Is that cable supposed to be connected to the relay? If not, what is it for?
I guess it´s supposed to be spring loaded, but the spring was broken, so I need to get a new one.
I guess the button is not for the high beams since it wont stay pressed in, so where do I turn on the high beams?
The light selector switch has three positions, off, parking lights and low beams, but I cant find any button for high beams.

Update: I found the button for the washer motor, its the knob to the right of the light switch, so In the wrong position but at least I found it
Also, I cant find any buttons for the windshield washer motor. I have a windshield wiper knob with three settings (off, slow, fast) which works, and I can push it in (springloaded), but when I push it in I dont get any voltage to the motor (washer motor works and I´ve checked with a voltmeter). But the pump motor wont start no matter where I push.
Any idea where that could be?

 

[RedFish]

First thing I would do is go to any parts yard and cut a quality relay connector from whatever OEM harness you find. How these relays are wired is found on the web easy enough.
The hi/lo dimmer switch should be mounted in the floor. I have no clue what that button in the signal wand is for. The washer pump uses a brown wire which is sometimes mistaken for a neutral safety or other ignition related brown wire. Factory wiring diagrams would surely help.

 

[67Dart273]

Really there is no way to know.......without openin up the harness and checking.

I don't see how just one single pole relay could be used for headlights.

Understand "original:"

The light switch receives power from TWO sources. One comes from the tail fuse, and provides power ONLY for tail, park, and the dimmer control

The second source is tapped off the "welded splice" off the black ammeter lead up under the dash. This goes DIRECTLY to the light switch and powers ONLY headlights.

So with the light switch out, so power to the headlight "wire"

that wire then goes to the dimmer switch (floor) and selects high or low beam. These two wires, high and low, then go through the bulkhead connector, and run directly out to the headlights.

To properly support high low beam, the "normal" thing is to tap into the high and the low beam feed wires out in the engine bay, use those sources to trigger two relays and feed the output of those two relays to the high and the low beam lamps

If you do not have.......wander over to MyMopar and download a free factory service manual:

MyMopar - Mopar Forums & Information - MyMopar Tools/Reference

From the same page, you can find NON factory wiring diagrams, sometimes not complete, but sometimes easier to follow

Please read this MAD article:

Catalog

And while you are at it:

MadElectrical.com - Electrical Tech

They also have an article on headlight relays

Catalog

And member on here "Crackedback" has a relay kit he sells. If you can find the thread I believe there's a diagram for them

[FOR SALE] - Plug and play - Headlight Relay Kits

 

[67Dart273]

And then there is the fifth cable, connected to 85, that seems to go to the turn signal stick button, picture:


Is that cable supposed to be connected to the relay? If not, what is it for?
but I cant find any button for high beams.

Also, I cant find any buttons for the windshield washer motor. I have a windshield wiper knob with three settings (off, slow, fast) which works, and I can push it in (springloaded),

If there is a switch on the signal lever it is not factory in the U.S. so no idea what it might be. Does your country require a high beam "flash" function? The original dimmer switch is/ was a large metal button mounted on the left side of the drivers floor

Something like this

Your washer switch IS the wiper button which you push in. If you are not getting power there, it's right there in the switch, or the wire continuity out through the bulkhead to the washer unit. You must have the key in run or accessory

 

[Nidhögg]

First thing I would do is go to any parts yard and cut a quality relay connector from whatever OEM harness you find. How these relays are wired is found on the web easy enough.
The hi/lo dimmer switch should be mounted in the floor. I have no clue what that button in the signal wand is for. The washer pump uses a brown wire which is sometimes mistaken for a neutral safety or other ignition related brown wire. Factory wiring diagrams would surely help.

Well, the problem is that I live in Sweden, so there arent really a great deal of american cars at our parts yards, at least nowhere near where I live. Believe me, I have looked ;)

No dimmer switch on the floor, I looked and theres no switch, no hole in the mat, no screw holes in the floor under the mat, no indication what so ever to a dimmer switch..

I have a service manual with electrical wiring, and also I have bought a laminated wiring diagram in color, neither can help me..

Really there is no way to know.......without openin up the harness and checking.

I don't see how just one single pole relay could be used for headlights.

Understand "original:"

The light switch receives power from TWO sources. One comes from the tail fuse, and provides power ONLY for tail, park, and the dimmer control

The second source is tapped off the "welded splice" off the black ammeter lead up under the dash. This goes DIRECTLY to the light switch and powers ONLY headlights.

So with the light switch out, so power to the headlight "wire"

that wire then goes to the dimmer switch (floor) and selects high or low beam. These two wires, high and low, then go through the bulkhead connector, and run directly out to the headlights.

To properly support high low beam, the "normal" thing is to tap into the high and the low beam feed wires out in the engine bay, use those sources to trigger two relays and feed the output of those two relays to the high and the low beam lamps

If you do not have.......wander over to MyMopar and download a free factory service manual:

MyMopar - Mopar Forums & Information - MyMopar Tools/Reference

From the same page, you can find NON factory wiring diagrams, sometimes not complete, but sometimes easier to follow

Please read this MAD article:

Catalog

And while you are at it:

MadElectrical.com - Electrical Tech

They also have an article on headlight relays

Catalog

And member on here "Crackedback" has a relay kit he sells. If you can find the thread I believe there's a diagram for them

[FOR SALE] - Plug and play - Headlight Relay Kits

Thanks for the links, I will check them out. About the relay, I noticed when I was out in the garage a moment ago that I got the wrong relay, this one is normally open, and when triggered it closes and feed power to 2 units. The one I wanted should be closed for one unit (low beams) and switched to the other (high beams) when triggered.
There is a hole and a contour in the dust for a relay, but no indication that there has ever been two. But, it appears that it would work with one relay, I have 12V Plus when I pull out the light switch to low beam mode, then I can connect the low beams so they are on.
Then when I push in the button on the stick I get 12V Plus on another cable, if I plug that one in so it moves the relay and feeds the high beams, but since the button is (or should be) spring loaded, when released it goes back to low beams.
Still doesnt explain why I cant find any switch for the high beam tho..

If there is a switch on the signal lever it is not factory in the U.S. so no idea what it might be. Does your country require a high beam "flash" function? The original dimmer switch is/ was a large metal button mounted on the left side of the drivers floor

Something like this

Your washer switch IS the wiper button which you push in. If you are not getting power there, it's right there in the switch, or the wire continuity out through the bulkhead to the washer unit. You must have the key in run or accessory

I tried researching it, and I cant find anything about a flash function being required by law, although the general importer could have fitted it on all cars due for sale here in Sweden..
Like I said earlier in this post, there is no sight of any dimmer switch, no holes in the mat or anything.. I will look around a bit more later.


About the washer, I fiddled around a bit and actually found the source for it, its the knob to the right of the light selector. I dont really know whats it supposed to be for (warning lights?), but if I turn it once right the washer motor starts, if I turn it once more it stops again.
Well, at least I know where it feeds from so I can either move it to the washer knob, or let it be for now.
See picture for which button Im speaking off:

 

[67Dart273]

No dimmer switch on the floor, I looked and theres no switch, no hole in the mat, no screw holes in the floor under the mat, no indication what so ever to a dimmer switch..

I got the wrong relay, this one is normally open, ........... The one I wanted should be closed for one unit (low beams) and switched to the other (high beams) when triggered.

From what you describe here's what I think.............

The button on the signal lever may NOT have been spring loaded. It is most likely push on / push off. Then you need what is known as a SPDT relay, (single pole, double throw) That part is easy. When a properly wired SPDT relay is off, the NC (normally closed) contacts are closed from the wiper / armature (common) to the NC.

When you power the relay it switches to the NO (normally open) contact.

So.,....................

With the relay not energized (deenergized) the NC connection feeds power to the low beams.

I'm guessing you punch the signal lever button, and energize the relay, which switches to high beams.

I realize they "do things different" over there LOL

Here's a Bosch style SPDT, just one more terminal that the one you have now, and surely what was originally there

EDIT finally re-read your original post, LMAO and "there we are"

 

[RedFish]

I have to wonder if this car came from a place like Cuba. Some owners have no options but piece mill whatever parts they can acquire to make things work. Or was a handicapped persons car ?
This bosch relay design is world standard so any junked mid 80s up vehicle could have a proper harness connector somewhere. Part stores will have too. In OEM quality ( NAPA Echlin ) aren't cheap. That gang of crimped connectors you've shown is as good , maybe better, than some of the relay connectors available from aftermarket ( ebay ).