I may Have a major F.U.B.A.R

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Nite Moves

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Like it says, F.U.B.A.R. Trying to get stuff done around the house before winter. had sometime due to rain (thankfully not snow) I started up the dart hoping to get it out of the driveway , turned around and back in garage to do some work on the rear of it later on. WELL,All is ****. I have park and drive in every single position besides park:violent1:I have a 67 Dart with a 318 auto 904 and B&M shifter. All was fine. I put it all together, coil wire off ran through the gears and it wouldn't start unless in Park position or neutral. Locked all up awhile ago and started it today to find a mess.In Park it starts and runs fine, drop it to anything else it goes forward??????????All i did was put in the B&M shifter as well as a 6cyl 904 torque converter for a very lil stall. Tranny lines are fine and i disconnected the shifter thinking something was wrong with it but still same dam thing........At the point of givin up. Not being mechanically inclined alot i think i should have just not followed a dream. Sorry really dissapointed and in myself:banghead:Long winded sorry
 
Sounds like possibly a broken shifter cable or out of adjustment. If you have someone else that can help you, chock the wheels, climb under the car so you can see the trans lever move, and have someone else operate the shifter.
 
Thanks, i disingaged the shifter later today and started it up in Park. No problem, I got under neath while it was running (Blocked the wheels)and moved it to the neutral position and gave it some gas to find it move forward. Moved the the linkage back to Rev. i asumed to find still going forward//////////Moved it a few more times with the same result.:violent1:
 
Get a buddy over and have him shift it with it not running to make sure it is engaging in each gear. Verify in the shop manual that tranny is going thru all the gears. You may have top disconnect the shifter to double check. Good luck Ed, get another set of eyes on it, sometimes it helps
 
Thanks, i disingaged the shifter later today and started it up in Park. No problem, I got under neath while it was running (Blocked the wheels)and moved it to the neutral position and gave it some gas to find it move forward. Moved the the linkage back to Rev. i asumed to find still going forward//////////Moved it a few more times with the same result.:violent1:
Sounds like a good way to run over yourself
 
Sounds like something in the tranny is messed up if you're getting park and some version of forward.. Rather than chock wheels for testing, I'd suggest using stands under the car. There are enough of us dropping dead from natural causes already.

Saint Peter: What brings you here today, pilgrim?

Nite Moves: I drove over myself with my Dart.

Saint Peter: You go to hell.

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Put the car on jack stands. Period. Disconnect the shifter cable at the transmission. With someone in the car and holding firmly on the brake, move the shift lever by hand at the transmission from park to each individual detent. If the wheels still try to turn forward in every detent but park, then something is causing the front clutch pack to stay engaged. End of story.
 
So you had the trans out to put a converter in and a shifter at the same time? It worked fine after the install or is this after the install?
 
Put the car on jack stands. Period. Disconnect the shifter cable at the transmission. With someone in the car and holding firmly on the brake, move the shift lever by hand at the transmission from park to each individual detent. If the wheels still try to turn forward in every detent but park, then something is causing the front clutch pack to stay engaged. End of story.

Thats what i would do.
 
Get a buddy over and have him shift it with it not running to make sure it is engaging in each gear. Verify in the shop manual that tranny is going thru all the gears. You may have top disconnect the shifter to double check. Good luck Ed, get another set of eyes on it, sometimes it helps

Steve, the shifter is completely un hooked. I was shifting the trans lever buy hand with no luck. A good buddy is coming over later today,,,,,,,heres hopoing and fingers crossed
 
Sounds like something in the tranny is messed up if you're getting park and some version of forward.. Rather than chock wheels for testing, I'd suggest using stands under the car. There are enough of us dropping dead from natural causes already.

Saint Peter: What brings you here today, pilgrim?

Nite Moves: I drove over myself with my Dart.

Saint Peter: You go to hell.

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│ ^LMAO,,,,,,,,,thanks man, Actually reading this just made my day......trust me she was idling and not going anywhere. Block and tackle are a great thing
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LMAO,,,,actually needed that. No offense takin just a good laugh. She wasn't goin anywhere, Block and tackle are a great thing
 
So you had the trans out to put a converter in and a shifter at the same time? It worked fine after the install or is this after the install?

no, motor and trans were out to clean up engine compartment they were all put back in together, the shifter was a add on later on. The shifter installed seem to go through all gears with out a hitch. Yes just me, id shift it not running the motor check uner to see if the lever was moving and all seemed great. Coil wire off and tried starting it in park and all gears. I got a roll over in park and neutral nothing else. so I tightened and check all. Now this
 
I should clarify my statement above. I didn't mention to have the engine running while underneath the car because it's unnecessary. All I was suggesting was to verify the shifter and cable are operating properly; the engine running is not needed for that. As mentioned by other members, please don't climb under a car and shift the transmission while the engine is running without the car being up on jack stands. Once you've verified the shifter is operating properly, please follow the steps provided by other members on how to verify the trans is functioning properly.
 
Put the car on jack stands. Period. Disconnect the shifter cable at the transmission. With someone in the car and holding firmly on the brake, move the shift lever by hand at the transmission from park to each individual detent. If the wheels still try to turn forward in every detent but park, then something is causing the front clutch pack to stay engaged. End of story.

Bingo either linkage inside or a bad pack that welded itself together.
 
all good mechanical advice.... bu t le t me say, " all of us weren't born with " born in" mechanical abilities. some of us knew how to rebuild a carb BEFORE every doing the first one! how??? don't know. not me!!!
I have found if we have a desire to learn and an interest in it, we can learn. takes time and helps to have a f reind with ability to help exlain what the manual doesn't tell us!! good luck and persevere!
 
I have a question that I didn't see any indication of a sure sign yet.

When it's in park and running, does it act like it's in gear?
I realize it starts in park as said.

I am thinking the manual valve lever missed the valve and it just wasn't driven and caught yet.
 
This could be a real poser.
-Your description, to me is hard to follow.Lets see if I got it right.In paragraph one, I understand that A) the car was parked in the driveway.Then B)you started it up and drove the car forward to turn it around,but C) could not engage reverse to back it up into the garage.So at this point;Basically, you have no reverse.
-Then in same paragraph you say; "Has Park and Drive in every single position besides Park".Implying that the the vehicle does no longer move forward in any selected gear(being in Park) even though you can feel the engine idle come down(when you select a gear) as the tc/trans attempt to move the car. So now, D)you have no movement at all.
-Am I understanding this correctly, so far,
-Then in paragraph 2, you say"drop it to anything else it goes forward", taking us back to "basically you have no reverse"
-So which is it:Has Park and Drive in every single position? or just no reverse?
-These are two very different descriptions with very different solutions.
-Where is your N-start sw located? still on trans? or now on shifter?If on the shifter, this could be a simple fix.If still oem, different fix.
-You must verify that by manually shifting at the trans lever,all the gears(engine running,wheels off the ground) can still be engaged, and is proven by a change in speed or direction of the driveshaft. Or at the very least; low,neutral and reverse. And that the driveshaft rotates in all positions except park.This will prove the trans is ok, and the new tc is functioning.And the fix could be relatively simple, even to just synchronizing the Trans Neutral to the Shifter Neutral.
-If the trans was working correctly before, and now fails the above test, and the pan was never removed, (except for inspection), then I would suspect the tc to input interface.If the pan was removed for more than inspection, all bets are off.If the front pump was removed during the interim,There are other scenarios.
-So long story short, before launching into possible fixes, I would need a more clear understanding of the problem.Others may be smarter.
- and btw;Unless you have a Manual valvebody, even though you may select Drive or Second or Low,the tranny always starts in low, either with the band, or with the sprag.
-And one other thing;You already told us at one point, that the car moved in Drive("drop it to anything else it goes forward"). Well that tells us that the forward(called rear by Ma) clutch is working, and also the sprag.The fix COULD be as simple as a failed L/R (rear )band circuit.
 
Is it possible that the shift lever is slipping on the shaft and not moving the drop down shaft? There is a bolt and nut on the side of the shift arm that tightens down the arm. Perhaps it is loose?
 
Is it possible that the shift lever is slipping on the shaft and not moving the drop down shaft? There is a bolt and nut on the side of the shift arm that tightens down the arm. Perhaps it is loose?

Thanks Greg and all. I did triple check that today and all is good. Car is up on blocks in the rear. Put the trans in Park and all locked up. Perfect. Started it and stayed that way. Turned off engine and put in neutral. Started fine with a touch of rear wheels rolling but stopped with some slight preasure with the foot.(81(4 sure grip.. Gave it a bit of gas and spun more that couldn't be stopped with just a foot in neutral. All was being done with a good buddy and now the 2 of us are stumped.Hes thinking maybe valve body,,,,,,im thinking he could be right on the money
 
Does it have reverse?

Rob,,,,,,,No. Other than park thats it. Forgot to mention the shifter itself is not in play. Totally disingaged. All linkage movement is done from underneath by hand. BTW ROB! The carb, it works fanflickin tastic. not one tool has touched that thing since the day i got it from you Thanks man:prayer:
 
Oh, so now it drives forward in Neutral, and Reverse as well? And all forward selector positions?
-Oh, I think I get it: "It has Park and Drive in every position", should read "it has Park(comma)and Drive in every position".
-Well that changes everything.
-To make reverse requires the L/R band and the High clutch to work.To make Low work in position D, requires the Forward clutch and the sprag to work.To make Low work in position L requires the Forward clutch and L-R band to work. You also say that it drives forward in all selected positions(assuming you proved the shifts by increasing the mph to something like 30 mph, and felt all the shifts or saw them on the tach).
-So all this means; the forward clutch is working and so is the sprag, and the front band and high-drum are working as well.We cant prove that the L-R band is working at this point because the trans would still drive the wheels in position L, through the sprag. Only two things we dont know; 1)Is the L/R band working? and 2)why is it driving in Neutral.
-Lets examine the Neutral driving first.Well, when the manual shift valve,controlled by the roostercomb,via the external lever is in Neutral,all the trans pressures are dumped except the convertor charge circuit and the lube circuit.This means that for the trans to transmit torque through it in Neutral,(witnessed by the N-drive), with no hydraulic pressure, the problem would have to be mechanical.With a factory-type non-manual valvebody, this means the forward clutch is mechanically jammed on, or mechanically driven by the TC.
-Now, moving to the no reverse. If the F-clutch were to be jammed on, then when you select reverse,and the working L/R band applies along with the Hi-drum,Essentially the tranny should be locked up. This is because it is trying to go both forward(locked up F-clutch,and sprag, plus the L-R band), as well as reverse(L-R band and Hi-drum). At this point everything is engaged except the front band, and the vehicle should not move, and the engine rpm should not increase beyond the TC stall point.
-But if the L-R band is not working, then it will drive,fully locked up, in the forward direction, in any selector position except Park, which mechanically locks the output shaft to the case AND dumps the convertor charge pressure.
-Now heres the big question.If the tranny was working fine before the TC swap, what changed, to lock up the F-clutch, and to cause the failed L-R band? And since you didnt respond to my earlier post, Im going to assume that the TC is the culprit, and the band was near its limit beforehand.Somehow(and I dont know how), the TC is driving the Forward-clutch, or it is jammed up.
-Some assumptions have been made to arrive at this diagnoses, your results may vary.
-Remember that little comma.....
 
We thought maybe (well my good friend thought) It had something to do with the kick down since it wasnt on the carb or lever. I checked it and wired it full forward to make sure it stayed there Yes graspin at straws so to speak to see if there was a chance of a change ,,there wasnt. I have a couple of pics of the linkages on the tranny. Sorry there not the best. Hard to get the camera in there. Still baffeled.I really APPRECIATE everyones input and help no matter what the comments or ideas......Im woundering if i have something linkage wise wrong......Running out of ideas. I have park and ingaged and a bit of gas is all good. All other gears is all forward, yes even reverse. It is hard to get out of park buy hand sometimes, Dont know what else to say. Thanks Edd
 

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I stick by my original guess that the front clutch pack is hung up engaged somehow.......or melted together.
 
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