Integral Valve Guide (Broken Boss) Repair Options

Small Block Mopar Engine

  1. thomasfouraker

    thomasfouraker Member

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    Purchased some R/T heads and noticed when I got home and looked them over a few broken guide bosses in the intake ports. (3 out of the 8). Took them by one cylinder head shop and the owner said they would probably be ok just cleaning up the edges of the broken guide to avoid chipping but suggested liners as well.

    Another shop said at least those 3 (and preferably all 8) intake valve guides need to be drilled out and False Guides put in.

    Both shops agreed new seats would need to be machined if liners were placed.

    Another said it should be fine as is.

    I don't want any unnecessary expense but more so want a reliable head and will pay for the proper warranted repair, whatever that might be.

    I am fairly new to this and don’t want the machine shops to notice and take advantage of it!

    The seller has been solid, accommodating, and helping me anyway they can to get the heads right and on the truck.

    Thanks for any advice!

    Thomas

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    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020 at 9:09 AM
  2. thomasfouraker

    thomasfouraker Member

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    I can get better pictures later with valves removed and measurements of remaining guide length. I think the average length remaining was around 1.3"
     
  3. PRH

    PRH Well-Known Member

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    Drill and ream for 1/2” OD guides.
     
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    • Wyrmrider

      Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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      prh gives the proper fix
      couple of things
      new guides will not be concentric with the stock ones so bvvc
      what kind of shape are the guides in?
      do you need new guides anyway?
      you could do what the porters do and cut the guides down
      and put in inserts if you need guides
      does it need ex seats
      valves sunk?
      magnum heads crack check

      lots of conflicting advice you have to sort it out
      are these heads worth putting money in for the long term or for long enough to get better heads
      if so just clean up and run it
       
    • thomasfouraker

      thomasfouraker Member

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      Thank you both for the advice. These heads were purchased to rectify oem cracked heads with an exhaust valve problem and were intended to be a long term solution for a truck that gets driven 6-8k miles a year. An expected upgrade with a lesser financial obligation that EQ Heads prepped by PIE or Hughes.

      The heads were fresh from a machine shop, deck looks perfect. A good looking valve job had been done on all valves and they were literally still in the machine shop plastic bags when I purchased them. According to casting numbers these heads started their life as 1.92 intake valve and at some point were machined to a 2.02. Looks like some port work had been done too to smooth things out.

      I will probably go ahead and get all 8 bored out with inserts put in as long as its not too costly. I think the guy told me $20 to replace a guide if I were having multiple done and $10 to cut a seat which would be required for any guide that was replaced. A $250ish investment for piece of mind I suppose.
       
    • Wyrmrider

      Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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      For your kind of build I'd clean up those broken guides and run them- fresh valve job and I would hope that the machine shop checked or did the guides
      maybe blend the bottom cut while you have them apart
      want to spend a little money I'd cut the guides for viton seals or did you say you have teflon
      Teflon's too dry for me and unleaded but YMMV
      Is this a roller cam magnum motor? or what
      machine shop set up the springs? or new springs?
      If it ain't broke don't fix it
      RT is a nice head
       
    • RustyRatRod

      RustyRatRod Weenie idiot loser. FABO Gold Member

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      I agree ^^^^^^
       
    • thomasfouraker

      thomasfouraker Member

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      I thought the heads were really nice, especially compared to the OEM heads. Not sure how much attention from a die grinder these heads have had but I was impressed with how clean smooth the ports are.

      One valve was slightly bent. Hard time coming out of the guide but other valves went in and out quite easily. The drill motor runout eyeball test indicated a good bit of wobble to that valve but other valves were seemingly fine.

      It appears an OEM style seal was used, a slip over the guide type.

      The motor is a roller cam, the heads came with Hughs 1110 Springs that should be good for .550 lift. As far as I know they are new(fish) springs. Don't think I will get that aggressive but would like to throw in a Cam that would compliment the truck and its uses (Towing, Hauling......Idle-5000) without having to get a tune right away. Haven't fixated on cams at this point until the heads are resolved but would love to hear suggestions as to what may suit me. Would like to stay with OEM pushrods and the OEM rockers right now

      Hughes suggested this cam:

      View attachment 1715470203

      SER0814ALN14.jpg
       
    • nm9stheham

      nm9stheham Well-Known Member

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      For that use, that is the type of cam I'd go with. 114 LSA, not a ton of duration. Keep your low end range hood and not hurt fuel mileage .
      Is this a carb system? Or FI?
       
    • thomasfouraker

      thomasfouraker Member

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      Retaining the factory MPI. Hughes Air Gap, Shorty (Cheap) headers, 52mm TB
       
    • replicaracer43

      replicaracer43 Old school member

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      So your saying your "fresh from the machine shop heads" had a bent valve? If so I would NOT trust any of the work done to them.
       
    • thomasfouraker

      thomasfouraker Member

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      Its not grotesquely bent. Enough to notice pulling out of or pushing into the guide.

      The seller is sending some other valves that may work, like I said, he's been real good at helping me get the heads right to be ready to bolt on.
       
    • replicaracer43

      replicaracer43 Old school member

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      Then you should have those heads gone over by a REPUTABLE shop, they DEFINITELY dont sound ready to run
       
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      • thomasfouraker

        thomasfouraker Member

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        I agree and that is my plan, and was my plan even before visual oddities presented themselves.

        I don't think it was anything malicious, just an oversight.
         
      • Wyrmrider

        Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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        sorry
        did not know you had a magnum Hyd roller and factory MPI
        WHAT YEAR COMPUTER which truck
        what gears? OD trans?
        I have the 92-95 one and it is a POS
        That hughes cam is to big for you tow/ haul 0-5000 usage
        figure your compression ratio with the new heads
        with a couple of different gasket thicknesses
        if under 9:1 think of the short Howards
        Hydraulic Roller Camshaft; 1992 - 2002 Chrysler 5.2L - 5.9L Magnum 800 to 5000 Howards Cams 770225-14 | Howards Cams
        with the shorter duration you can squeeze the lobe centers somewhat
        but you need to explore carefully with factory computer
        figure out what you are going to fix the heads first
        do they have a modern multi angle valve job
        valves back cut
        etc
        lots of good options suggested depending on your budget
        SlantSix64 put a regrind in his and it worked out well but that cam might be too big for you
        There were several one is the MP RT cam and another is called the "sausage"
        both are too big for what you want to do
        an early 5.2 cam would work or just use the stock 360 cam- this is a 360 or a 318? oh sorry
        5.2 or 5.9>
         
      • Wyrmrider

        Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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      • Wyrmrider

        Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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        Wife's watching jeporady
        so I figured the Howards closes the intake at 57 ABDC
        It appears that comp wants their cam installed at 108 ICL Howards at 110
        Looks like the howard for a computer controlled motor
        do a timing diagram and figure the overlaps
        114 LCA vs 112 and 8 degrees shorter duration is going to make a big difference
         
      • thomasfouraker

        thomasfouraker Member

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        I should probably do a little reading up on camshafts. All that is foreign to me and should probably familiarize myself with it to a greater degree before making a decision. It seems like manufactures have slightly different ways of labeling their cams.
         
      • Wyrmrider

        Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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        I'd get on some of the forums for your kind of Truck
        Mine would be gen 1 Dakota
        find out what year computer you have and what it will put up with without a tune
        Many HR's out there are meant for someone who has converted to carb (and headers)

        What we had above was both giving the Lobe Centers LCA
        both giving the durations at .006
        one giving the intake centerline
        which given the duration you can figure the timing
        one giving the timing, from which you can figure the intake centerline
        now you can compare timing- which is only thing that is important

        Problem with Hughes is that they do not give you enough information to compare with anything else
        any questions we can walk you through it
        but it's like juggling three balls at the same time and keeping your eyes on all of them
        you want the intake to close early with that low compression
        but the computer wants a good vacuum signal and low overlap (IMHO)
        changing the LCA moves both
        here you'd think that moving from 114 to narrower would set the intake closed earlier and increase overlap (course you can set intake closed anywhere you want it but can't change overlap)
        but here the shorter duration enabled booth intake closed to come out about the same even with the 114 LCA
         
      • nm9stheham

        nm9stheham Well-Known Member

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        Wyrm, that is why I agree with the 114LSA..... The stock computer is not going to like much overlap. And even a carbed towing use will be better at low RpM with a wider LSA. I have not checked the overlap on the Howard's vs Hughes however. Good thought to lay it all out.
         
      • Wyrmrider

        Wyrmrider Well-Known Member

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        right nm
        but as you said you have to plot it out with the seat timing
        that short duration 108 lca actually looks good with little overlap
        both would have the same dynamic compression
         
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