Is sears Joking??

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Just realized the PRV (temp/pressure relief valve) doesn't even have a down tube Rani. That can't be correct either? Even without going outside, most codes require it goes down to within 6" of the floor.
 
Just chuck it thru their window and buy one from lowes.

Sounds like very disappointing service from a company that should be going the extra mile to take care of things.

I would call every number I could at sears until they sent a professional that got the job done and I would demand a refund on the piss poor wast of time and money you already expended.



Amazing.
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
Who installed this to start with? The TPR valve doesn't even have a drain tube on it. This is a diaster waiting to happen.
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i really dont know who installed it ...it was installed over thanksgiving 2008 and i wasnt here .......it may have been either my uncle or sears themselves ...not sure ......i actually just live here and try to take care of the house in exchange for rent free living....but my uncle is the actual owner of the house.

i didnt want to bother my uncle with the problem ...thats why i called sears and tried to handle it myself big girl style ...so he didnt have to worry about it......but that didnt work out very smooth
 
RaniDart70 said:
i really dont know who installed it ...it was installed over thanksgiving 2008 and i wasnt here .......it may have been either my uncle or sears themselves ...not sure ......i actually just live here and try to take care of the house in exchange for rent free living....but my uncle is the actual owner of the house.

i didnt want to bother my uncle with the problem ...thats why i called sears and tried to handle it myself big girl style ...so he didnt have to worry about it......but that didnt work out very smooth
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Sometimes you just can't win. Did you pay with a credit card, check or cash? If it wasn't cash I would stop payment if I could.
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
Nice job.

One question? Why do you use a gate valve instead of a quarter turn ball valve?
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I've used ball's on almost all i've done before. Only reason i didn't here was i lived in Va. when we bought the house and just did the install on a weekend not knowing if the code here would allow it. The original was a gate, so i just went with it, you know how the code crap goes...lol. Was lucky enough to find out they required the expansion tank that wasn't originallly here, and i was unaware it was needed, by code, when the heater was replaced.
 
OldmanRick said:
I've used ball's on almost all i've done before. Only reason i didn't here was i lived in Va. when we bought the house and just did the install on a weekend not knowing if the code here would allow it. The original was a gate, so i just went with it, you know how the code crap goes...lol. Was lucky enough to find out they required the expansion tank that wasn't originallly here, and i was unaware it was needed, by code, when the heater was replaced.
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Lol, yeah.

Is the expansion tank another saftey device or a water hammer prevention device?
 
trapster said:
I would cut a new hole for that dryer vent and run it straight out. unless you like dryer fires :)
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That's on the agenda. It's a foreclosure under total renovation so i had to get a temp vent in for now and it gets checked monthly. Finally found some replacement siding, so not to long before it gets rectified. Should have seen the one in a house i bought in FL. years ago........8' straight up to the attic and 15' on a 45* out the back roof. Completely blocked shut. I ran a gas blower thru it and covered the whole back yard like snow.
 
Rani, You need to install a tube like is shown in this photo. If you are walking around that water heater and the TPR valve was to pop you could easily get seriously burned. This one is shown with a bucket under it.
 

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think about it , it ran before just fine without the cut in the side right id call that sears talk to a tech and tell them they sent some 1 out and now i smell gas some 1 will be there in a hurry and by the way tell them you want it replaced now that they cut it up
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
Lol, yeah.

Is the expansion tank another saftey device or a water hammer prevention device?
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Bill, the tank that's here is because of backflow prevention. With the cold water coming in and the heating process, as you know, expands the volume. In the old days, that pressure was able to push back against the whole city service which was no problem. Now they have replaced the meters with check valves to prevent backflow and contamination to the service. So now, instead of pushing back against the city, it can only push to the meter at the house. The expansion tank takes the pushback when needed and prevents the PRV from seeping water all the time. I thought it was crap at first, but until i installed it, the valve went off all the time.
 
3rd on the bad thermocouple. I replaced one in my house furnace a couple years back, in that capacity its called a "flame sensor". Same idea. Basically, it senses if the pilot is lit or not. If the thermocouple is bad, it doesn't detect the flame, and it cuts the gas off. Really helpful if its working properly as it keeps your house from blowing up, but when they fail they just turn your gas off for no reason. :banghead:

Thermocouples are usually in the $5 to $10 range, and take about 5 minutes to change in most applications. And I'm not a furnace/AC guy, contractor or even a handy man when it comes to household appliances.

Not saying that Sears shouldn't make good, but there's no way I'd be taking two weeks worth of cold showers on their account. I bet with your internet skills you could have the proper flame sensor/thermocouple sourced in all of about 10 minutes, and on your doorstep by Tuesday/Wednesday at the latest, and that's only if you can't get it locally.

Also, I know California code is all kinds of more restrictive, but there's no way that install is to code.
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
Rani, You need to install a tube like is shown in this photo. If you are walking around that water heater and the TPR valve was to pop you could easily get seriously burned. This one is shown with a bucket under it.
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yes sir, i will get it handled ...thanks for telling me about that .....i am an average person when it comes to water heaters ...i had no idea that it is set-up wrong.......i didnt even know what that valve is for....i messed with that valve before long time ago, having no idea what its for and water came out so i left it alone after that.
 
OldmanRick said:
Bill, the tank that's here is because of backflow prevention. With the cold water coming in and the heating process, as you know, expands the volume. In the old days, that pressure was able to push back against the whole city service which was no problem. Now they have replaced the meters with check valves to prevent backflow and contamination to the service. So now, instead of pushing back against the city, it can only push to the meter at the house. The expansion tank takes the pushback when needed and prevents the PRV from seeping water all the time. I thought it was crap at first, but until i installed it, the valve went off all the time.
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Ok, I learned something new today. Thank You. As of right now we don't use expansion tanks but my water system does have a Reduced Pressure Zone valve with an air gap to prevent any back flow on the city.
 
Had a similar problem with a gas water heater I bought ftom Lowes. It cost $100 to have a local plumbing / heating guy come put and clean the burner and igniter. It worked a couple days and quit again. I took my original sales receipt to Lowes to see if there was any warranty left. I was given a newly designed burner/ igniter (no charge) that I insalled myself in a half hour.
It has worked perfect ever since. Tmm
 
RaniDart70 said:
yes sir, i will get it handled ...thanks for telling me about that .....i am an average person when it comes to water heaters ...i had no idea that it is set-up wrong.......i didnt even know what that valve is for....i messed with that valve before long time ago, having no idea what its for and water came out so i left it alone after that.
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The TPR valve is made so it will discharge if the tank gets too much pressure on it. Without it the tank could explode if something went wrong. Go to Lowes or a similar store and the part you need should cost less than $10.00. Put some pipe dope or teflon tape on it and screw it in. If it is too long you can just cut it off. I normally cut all mine on 45* angles to prevent something from clogging up the end of the tube.
 
Sorry Rani I cant help with the heater problems. The reason I rent and like I said its $20 a month...for me its insurance. Its heated by NG, everything in my house is, dryer, stove, furnace..Im even thinking nat gas insert in the fireplace...but might go wood insert(free burn). Oh yeah and BBQ...no more running outta propane!!! NG for me is the most effecient. We cant do anything to NG appliances without a "ticket/license" . How much cheaper is it to run NG vs Electric?? That $20 for me to be hassle free is well worth the $$. This one was replaced this past year. Called the 800 # and had it replaced within 18 hours no questions asked. Hopefully you get this resolved within a phone call or 2!!
 

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Oklacarcollecto said:
Ok, I learned something new today. Thank You. As of right now we don't use expansion tanks but my water system does have a Reduced Pressure Zone valve with an air gap to prevent any back flow on the city.
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That's the way ours was done years back in Md. Also, i mispoke earlier and didn't mean the meters were replaced with check valves, they were just a addition to the meter.
 
To begin with, did Sears install your hot water heater? When I saw the pic it looked like it wasn't installed by code. The I looked up Colorado code and it seems to be the same as our local code. It should be installed 18" off the floor because if you have a gas leak it fills from the floor up. Thats why the garage has or should have vents to bleed the gas outside. If not, the first time there's a gas leak and the heater fires up, you will have an explosion.

Here is the codes for installing a hot water heater: [ame]http://www.pprbd.org/inspection/MechWaterHeater.pdf[/ame]

You should call Sears again and give them an ultimatum. Tell them that your next call is to the Sears main headquarters, then the better business bureau and last the health department unless they immediately come out. If they installed the HW heater mention that you are going to check with the buildings codes people on their installation.
 
Besides the TPI drain, it might be that the gas pipe is improperly supported, can't really see

Here's what I'd do. Go to "whereever" an appliance parts outfit, plumbing supply, Lowes, etc, and buy yourself a thermocouple. Honeywell makes "universal" ones. I haven't priced one lately, around 15 bucks I'd guess.


Pull the pilot out and blow it out with compressed air, etc, be careful if the orifice comes out (right at the pilot, if removable, will be in the fitting with the tube end)

Install everything, try to light it, and pay attention to the pilot. It should have a nice "quiet" flame, not "blowing" so you can hear it. If it "blows" the orifice is still dirty. It can have a LITTLE yellow at the tip, but should not have much. If it's a "lot of yellow" the pilot burner air passages are dirty, or the gas pressure is way too high, or the pilot valve (screw adjust in the combo valve) is adjusted too high.

Standing pilots are normally VERY reliable with a good clean pilot burner and a good thermocouple.

Be sure to find out what "code" is for that TPI. Some can be near the floor, IF there's a floor drain. Think about how badly you want a basement full of water. Some can be run into a sink (er used to be) but generally outdoors is what they do around here. You want the outlet through the wall to be away from "where people" are, IE sidewalks, etc, put an el on the end, and "fix" it so a fitting cannot be added to plug it. In this area, a small saw cut is required on the bottom elbow (yeah, it leaks!!) to keep water from stagnating from leakage in the relief tube.
 
x3 on the thermocouple. x2 on call sears and let them know that you will be contacting the appropriate agency to have the install checked for code violations and by the way your guys cut my drain pan, now you are going to replace it. I do appliance repair so I know about working around drain pans, it can be done. Don't bother threatening to call corporate, let them know that they will have to explain themselves when there license is in jeopardy. If that is as big a violation there as it is here someone will have lots of 'splaining to do. I wish you success dealing with sears.

We try to get out to the customer within 24 hours unless it is more than 15 miles out of town, then it's 72 hours, however a refrigerator, freezer, or in summer an ac get priority and usually are dealt with in less than 6 hours. The place I work is an independent sales and service company, and we go 50-75 miles from the store if the customer requests. We don't do water heaters, but if we did they would be just below refrigeration in priority.
 
Hi Rani,
I would contact your uncle and explain to him the problem.
I would allow him to make the needed repairs and desicions
regarding his house.
If you follow though with the suggestions to call about code violations,
you could end up costing your uncle untold amounts of money and
possibly lose your free home.
I know you like being self sufficent, but in this case, I think the prudent
step to take would be to allow the homeowner to make these desicions
and not take the advise of armchair mechanics that have diagnosed
your problems from a fuzzy picture.
Just my advice.
Good luck,
Carl
 
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