Lower control arm pivot shaft woes

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gerty

gerty

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I'm trying to install the lower control arm on the Duster and the shaft is spinning in the bushing. It starts to spin with no more than 50 lbs ft of torque applied. They're new Moog bushings and were installed at a machine shop. First time rebuilding a front suspension for me, am I missing something?
Bob
 
Hmmm...does it look like the shaft is fully installed into the bushing? Have you talked to the shop to see how they got the old inner bushing sleeve off of the shaft (hopefully no damage to the shaft)? Or if they lubed the shaft into the new bushing inner sleeve? (They shouldn't.) And are you sure it is the shaft spinning in the bushing, not the bushing in the LCA?

BTW.....When installing the LCA's, you only want to lightly tighten the LCA's shafts into the K member (my '62 Shop manual says finger tight), and only torque them to final spec when the car is on the gournd and the T-bars have been adjusted for proper ride height.
 
Do you have the thick washer that goes on the lca shaft before the nut ?
 
I did have the thick washer under the nut. There did seem to be some oil or grease on the back side of the shaft. I may have messed up in that I was tightening the nut with no load on the t-bar, car was on jack stands. Thanks for responding, guess I need to take it all back apart tomorrow

Bob.
 
gerty said:
I did have the thick washer under the nut. There did seem to be some oil or grease on the back side of the shaft. I may have messed up in that I was tightening the nut with no load on the t-bar, car was on jack stands. Thanks for responding, guess I need to take it all back apart tomorrow

Bob.
Click to expand...

Or mabe try a little sideways pressure on the control arm (up, down, in, or out)
Whatever you can do to increase the resistance on the pin turning.
It's def worth a try.

Personally, I would put a small jack under the pivot point and put a little pressure on it to see if it would hold till the nut pulled in down tight.
 
Your machine shop did something wrong with the installation of the bushings, and pivot shafts.
If they are properly installed, there should be no reason why the shaft should be turning in the LCA, when you try and tighten down the nut.
The shaft is quite a tight press fit into the bushing, and then the bushing itself is a very tight fit into the LCA, needing a hydraulic press to get the job done.
You sure your using regular rubber bushings, and not poly bushings?
 

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^^^ Right...something is wrong if the shafts turn in the bushings, or the bushings turn in the LCA's. If they are Moog parts, I wouldn't imagine they are poly....
 
I always use poly so it doesn't matter to me what position the LCA is in when the nut is tightened. (Don't twist the rubber after one tightens the nut and the arm position is changed.. Same with the UCA).
That being said, I've also never had a problem tightening the nuts.
That has a shoulder on it, right? It draws up as the nut is tightened.
You said it's got oil on it. I bet if you clean it. and help it get in the hole from the rear as you draw it in, you problem will go away.
 
I just change the ones in the Demon.
Something I did notice was the quality of parts was bad.
I bought two Moog bushings from Rockauto, looked to be older stock.
These were great, I screwed one up when pressing the pivot pin in (forgot which socket to use on the back side).

So, went to my local O'rielly's. Picked up a replacement (MOOG) at 10 dollars more, & the rubber was rolled where the inner sleeve was installed.
Ordered a second, same thing, not as bad.
Third time was a charm.

Once the lower pivot is in place on the K-frame & the Torsion bar is knocked bank into place, that nut should tighten down. Just get it close to seating & tighten it after the front end height is set.

How do you guys get the shell off of the old pivot pin?
I lay mine on the anvil of my vise & strike it with a two pound hammer on 4 sides until it slides off.
 
mikedevore said:
How do you guys get the shell off of the old pivot pin?
I lay mine on the anvil of my vise & strike it with a two pound hammer on 4 sides until it slides off.
Click to expand...

I wire wheeled them smooth, lubed it all up real good and used poly bushings.
Nice and snug in there unlike plain loose poly's, and worked out just fine.
 
Mine did the same thing with the poly bushings. I have to take them back out. I haven't figured it out yet.
 
I think the guy who put them on greased them and they just spin. They are not supposed to be greased correct?
 
With a poly bushing, you can tighten the pin to the K without the LCA being installed. Once the pin is tight, you can slide the LCA onto the pin.
 
burdar said:
With a poly bushing, you can tighten the pin to the K without the LCA being installed. Once the pin is tight, you can slide the LCA onto the pin.
Click to expand...

Ahh good call. How would you hold the pin from turning when tightening it?
 
nm9stheham said:
That sounds pretty clever.....I assume it does not distort the shaft?
Click to expand...

An old machinist showed me that trick 30 years ago.
No dings at all, just make sure you hit the sleeve only.
Alot of times, all it takes is doing it twice on opposite sides & it slides off.
Probably did twenty in my lifetime.
 
mikedevore said:
An old machinist showed me that trick 30 years ago.
No dings at all, just make sure you hit the sleeve only.
Alot of times, all it takes is doing it twice on opposite sides & it slides off.
Probably did twenty in my lifetime.
Click to expand...

It expands the size of the tube by spreading the metal.
(When you hit the metal it moves toward the sides of the impact point effectivly making the tube bigger around.)
Have you ever seen a small hard rubber tire with a lot of weight on it when it rolls and the rubber part gets bigger around till it looks too big for the rim?
Same idea.
 
Well, tell us what was wrong with your LCA's.
Get it figured out yet? :dontknow:
 
Sorry for the delay had some health problems. I just now got to get the control arm off and here are some pics. There was grease on the pivot shaft and to me it doesn't look like it is pressed all the way in.
 

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I was just down near Burkesville all last week, working at Dale Hollow SP Marina.....wish I had noticed before.

BTW, there is a machined stepdown in the shaft's diameter where it goes into the bushing and the shoulder of that step stops the pivot shaft from going in further: see here: http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/tipstricks/155_0306_control_arms/photo_03.html


So does it look like there is grease on the shaft past the wide shoulder, where it goes into the bushing? If so, it needs to come out and then be cleaned thoroughly with something like brake cleaner and re-installed; but the inner bushing sleeves may be opened up now......probably best to start over with fresh bushings. If these turn much in the bushings while in the car, then it may damage the pins/shafts.
 
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