Miss to Sputter to Cut Out...

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70DusterBob

70DusterBob

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Hey,

I am new to this forum. Looks exciting with all the areas to post in and lots of people here!

Yesterday I was driving my 1970 Duster/360 with Electronic Ignition, (basically stock from later year models) and it started missing here and there but run fine between misses, like once every 5-10 miles. Then it started sputtering, longer periods of missing every 5-10 miles, but would run fine between episodes. It started getting worse, as in more frequently and sputtering longer, but still ran fine between sputters. Then it just cut off, for a good 3-4 seconds. Sounded like when your running out of gas how it sputters, but is mostly not firing. I was driving 60 so it started running fine again before I came to a stop. Then it drove fine for a good 10 miles, only sputtered maybe 3 times in those ten miles, then it cut out on me again. Then it ran fine for a while, sputtering every 5-7 miles or so, but I barely made it home. I made it 20 miles after the last cutout and I got it home and in the garage, but I have no idea what to look for or what it could be. I doubt it is a fuel problem, though I guess it could be, I'm thinkin' maybe the spark plug wires, but it doesn't make sense why it would be sporadic like that, then run perfectly fine between missing. From the first miss to the first cut out was approximately 90-100 miles. Then I made it probably 30 more miles with one more cut out to get it home.

Any ideas? I would love some help on this one!
Bob
 
what ignition box are you running? orange, chrome, black or aftermarket? sounds like fuel or ignition to me...probably ignition box....but yes, check your plugs and wires first...also check cap, rotor, & reluctor gap with non magnetic brass feeler gauge.....should be .008
 
On the ignition side, in this approximate order or probable failure and/or ease of checking:
- Ballast resistor
- Ignition module ground to chassis
- Rotor button
- Distributor cap
- Coil
- Wiring
- Pickup coil and connection
- Ignition switch

On the fuel side:
- Dirt/crap in carb
- Filter clogged
- Sock in tank clogged
- Fuel pump failing
- Line clogged

Start on the spark side by pulling the wire from the coil to the distributor cap at the cap end, put a screwdriver in the end and place the screwdriver 3/8" from metal. Crnak the engine and see if it jumps this gap with a solid, blue spark.
 
It is a factory electronic distributor with a PB Blaster Coil. I "just" replaced the distributor cap before the trip. I got about 70 miles into the trip before the first misfire. I'm thinkin' maybe the coil wire didn't get put in there all the way?? But I will check the other components listed too.

About the fuel, I "just" siphoned out about 7 gallons of old gas from sitting too long, maybe 6 months, then dumped some new Premium in it before the trip. It started acting up after I refueled, during the trip, now that you mentioned it. I will check the fuel filter as well. I'm thinkin' that could be it because it sounded like it ran out of gas, then got gas back in it when it started running right again. But maybe it is both the coil wire and the fuel filter??

I will keep ya'll posted. Thanks for your input.

Bob
 
Check the plug for the distributor while you are there just in case.
I have had two cars have intermittent running issue's with temperature changes.
Just crimp it a little and plug it back together.

This sounds like an electrical issue to me also, if it isn't a failing fuel pump.
Doubt it is a filter problem.
 
If you just missed the fuel truck they stir up all the crap on the bottom of the tanks and I have seen cars get up to two gallons of water from filling up while the truck is there or shortly after. Then you end up with little puddles in the bottom of the carb that play hide and seek with the jets....
 
Well the fuel filter was super crapped out! I mean "chunks" of rust came out. I guess my fuel line between the tank and pump is getting old.

I have yet to try it again, but I did unplug the distributor and plugged it back in. I should probably clean the male terminals, they are not shiny to say the least. I do have a small file I can get in to clean the female ones, if that is a safe thing to do.

How can I get the female terminals clean without using a small file?

The coil wire was solid in there, checked all other ignition connections and everything seems snug. If it does it again, I will dig a little deeper, but I did replace the filter and it seems to be running better, I just haven't had the chance to get out and drive it 10 miles or more to see if it misses again or not yet.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate it!
Bob
 
mguner said:
If you just missed the fuel truck they stir up all the crap on the bottom of the tanks and I have seen cars get up to two gallons of water from filling up while the truck is there or shortly after. Then you end up with little puddles in the bottom of the carb that play hide and seek with the jets....
Click to expand...

I have heard of this before. I always avoid filling or getting any fuel when the truck is there. Good thing to note.
 
It could be the line, but more likely your tank is full of rust chunks. I would be dropping it and inspecting it and be ready to replace it. Rusty tanks are a chronic problem and it will keep messing things up. The hose used for siphoning might have knocked a bunch of rust scale loose.

Try some Scotchbrite on the spark terminals, rather than a file.
 
70DusterBob said:
Well the fuel filter was super crapped out! I mean "chunks" of rust came out. I guess my fuel line between the tank and pump is getting old.

I have yet to try it again, but I did unplug the distributor and plugged it back in. I should probably clean the male terminals, they are not shiny to say the least. I do have a small file I can get in to clean the female ones, if that is a safe thing to do.

How can I get the female terminals clean without using a small file?

The coil wire was solid in there, checked all other ignition connections and everything seems snug. If it does it again, I will dig a little deeper, but I did replace the filter and it seems to be running better, I just haven't had the chance to get out and drive it 10 miles or more to see if it misses again or not yet.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate it!
Bob
Click to expand...

No need to do anything more than crimp each female side slightly.
(well, unless they have that white corrosion crap all over them):D

A small bit of steel wool locked into a pair of hemostats works great, and I'm surprised more people don't have them in their toolbox.
 

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Who is Miss Sputter and do you have any pictures of her in the swim suit competition???
 
nm9stheham said:
It could be the line, but more likely your tank is full of rust chunks. I would be dropping it and inspecting it and be ready to replace it. Rusty tanks are a chronic problem and it will keep messing things up. The hose used for siphoning might have knocked a bunch of rust scale loose.

Try some Scotchbrite on the spark terminals, rather than a file.
Click to expand...

I had the gas tank boiled and lined about 8 years ago. They put some kind of red sealant in there. That "should" hold right? The fuel line is out of a 72 Dart Swinger, so it is what 44 years old now? I would think it is more the line. They do sell replacement lines, but they are a pain in the a to replace. But if I have to I have to.

I put a clear fuel filter on this time, the other one was metal. I was thinking maybe the fuel filter was heating up on my and getting vapor lock on top of being clogged. When I drove it for a long distance it got hard to start, then once it cooled down after sitting a while, it would fire on right up again. Then on the way back from my destination, it started missing, sputtering and cutting out worse than on the way up there when it was cool in the morning. It was warmer warmer on the way back, like 80 degrees outside.

I got some steel wool handy. I will try that on the connections.

Thanks!
 
TrailBeast said:
No need to do anything more than crimp each female side slightly.
(well, unless they have that white corrosion crap all over them):D

A small bit of steel wool locked into a pair of hemostats works great, and I'm surprised more people don't have them in their toolbox.
Click to expand...

Thanks!!
 
If you put a clear fuel filter on it, that means it's plastic! Get rid of it and go back to the metal ones. The plastic filters are a fire waiting to happen. You probably have a rusty tank and varnish clogging up the sock in the tank, if there is one. If it is gone, then you are getting the same crap to the filter and stopping it up. Sounds like it is time to pull the tank. Be pep aired to replace it and the sending unit. Welcome to the junk we are getting today called gasoline!

70DusterBob said:
I had the gas tank boiled and lined about 8 years ago. They put some kind of red sealant in there. That "should" hold right? The fuel line is out of a 72 Dart Swinger, so it is what 44 years old now? I would think it is more the line. They do sell replacement lines, but they are a pain in the a to replace. But if I have to I have to.

I put a clear fuel filter on this time, the other one was metal. I was thinking maybe the fuel filter was heating up on my and getting vapor lock on top of being clogged. When I drove it for a long distance it got hard to start, then once it cooled down after sitting a while, it would fire on right up again. Then on the way back from my destination, it started missing, sputtering and cutting out worse than on the way up there when it was cool in the morning. It was warmer warmer on the way back, like 80 degrees outside.

I got some steel wool handy. I will try that on the connections.

Thanks!
Click to expand...
 
70DusterBob said:
I had the gas tank boiled and lined about 8 years ago. They put some kind of red sealant in there. That "should" hold right? The fuel line is out of a 72 Dart Swinger, so it is what 44 years old now? I would think it is more the line. They do sell replacement lines, but they are a pain in the a to replace. But if I have to I have to.
Click to expand...
OK good, I have a tank lined like that that was done only 3 years ago, so I don't know how long that lasts. I'd still drop the tank and investigate; it is not that hard. And the filler neck, as well as the fuel line, are possible areas of rust. Replacing is easier than waiting for a tow truck and then replacing!

You may have point with the vapor lock, especially if it is hard to start hot.
 
I used the steel wool and some bailing wire with about 1/4 of a cut in about 8 places so the steel wool would sort of stick to it. I couldn't get the hemostats in there, but I spun the wire with the steel wool around several times and it cleaned the connectors up nicely. Then I checked the connectors on the ballast resistor. They were dirty too. I used some sand paper on the female sides, the males were okay because the resistor is only a few years old. But the females did have that white build up on them. After doing that I took it for a 40 mile drive. It did not miss once!

Woo HOOO!

Thanks ya'll! I appreciate the help.

About the plastic filter, they do make glass ones, but I don't know how good the filter element is. Are they any good? I would like to use the plastic for now so I can see how fast, and how much rust is building up. That last steel filter was only 1-1/2 years old, with maybe 2,000 miles on it max! That's not good. After my next long trip, I gotta do the 300 mile round trip again, I will drop the tank and inspect it.

But your right, the so-called gasoline these days lasts maybe a month before it is garbage. Self Destructing Gasoline!

Have a great one!
 
I would not be too afraid to use the plastic ones for a while until you know the rust problem is solved.
 
nm9stheham said:
I would not be too afraid to use the plastic ones for a while until you know the rust problem is solved.
Click to expand...

I "think" the metal ones cause vapor lock more than the plastic ones, I know I have had that problem with the glass ones too before, but that was mid summer, around 100 degree outside.

I don't know if I got junk in my tank from a gas station or if it was my line/tank/filler tube because I haven't seen one flake of rust in there in about 70 miles or more since changing filters. I guess it may have just come from a station, I don't know yet.

But thanks for the input.

Have you ever used a glass filter? If so, are they safe? They don't seem to have much filter element to them.
 
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