Need help, Dart won't start...

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LivewireBlanco

LivewireBlanco

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1971 Dart Swinger I just finished putting in my 318 (original /6 car). I checked the coil and it's good, ballast resistor is good, battery is good. I have new spark plugs and wires. It will turn over but won't fire, doesn't even try. Gas is pumping and I tried priming the carb, no fire.

Some background: The car then I got it wasn't running took out the 225 and put in a 1971 318, still has points ignition. I put new points and gapped it to correct gap and new condenser. My guess is something isn't right in electrical. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
did you verify you have spark?
if so, turn the distributor 180 degrees and check again

and any clue why the 225 wasnt running?
it may still be the same issue
 
^^Yup above^^

Basics........Compression, enough to run the engine

Ignition......enough spark and at the proper time

fuel...........FRESH fuel

Run a compression test? That will give you a chance to look at the plugs and see if they are oil/ fuel fouled or dry

Check spark: Get a spark tester at any parts store. "Rig" it to the ocil tower so you can see it through the hood gap, crank the engine USING THE KEY. Should have at least 3/8" long nice not snappy blue spark

Timing: You can check this "on the starter." Do you understand how to static time? And that you must have no1 on compression stroke?

Fuel......Is it fresh? The right kind? You check for accel pump shot at the carb?
 
Run a wire from the + battery to the + side of the coil. And crank. If it fires then its in the wiring from coil to ignition switch or the switch or the ballast resister or wiring from switch to batt. If not then coil, dist, rotor, cap, points, timing etc.
(Dont leave the wire on the coil for too long or you will damage the coil)
 
If all the above fails to start it, check your bulkhead connections. I bought a B-Cuda a year ago that sat for a while cause it wouldn't start, and thats what it was on that one. Let us know.
Dave
 
barracudadave67 said:
If all the above fails to start it, check your bulkhead connections. I bought a B-Cuda a year ago that sat for a while cause it wouldn't start, and thats what it was on that one. Let us know.
Dave
Click to expand...
How should I test this? Also it has a new cam so I can't crank it too long without it starting.
 
Dana67Dart said:
Cam 180 out?
Click to expand...
Going to check this and also verify voltage at coil with key in run. Static time it with starter again. Car has fresh gas, new plugs and wires. I'll also have my wife bump the starter to make sure #1 is on compression stroke.
 
Check the wire with the fusible link (link is lt brown color, or blue) that goes to light blue, or dark blew, and the wires on the starter relay (nut) trace them to where they go thru the bulk head connector.
Also check the back of the AMP gage (if still connected) make sure they are tight.
Green wire on coil goes to NEG on coil. Dk blue on coil goes to POS.
Hope this helps I am not the best with electrical stuff. I can get buy doing it but not writing it.
Dave
 
First things first, did you LOOK into the carburetor and verify that it's got fuel? Accelerator pump is your friend. Try to catch some and inspect. It's not water is it?

Second, pull a plug wire, hook up a spark plug and ground it, crank motor? Spark?

Is the distributor rotor turning when you crank it? Did the 318 run when it was pulled?

When I see this:
LivewireBlanco said:
1971 Dart Swinger I just finished putting in my 318 (original /6 car). I checked the coil and it's good, ballast resistor is good, battery is good. I have new spark plugs and wires. It will turn over but won't fire, doesn't even try. Gas is pumping and I tried priming the carb, no fire.

Some background: The car then I got it wasn't running took out the 225 and put in a 1971 318, still has points ignition. I put new points and gapped it to correct gap and new condenser. My guess is something isn't right in electrical. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

The first thing I think is, "ok, HOW did you check these things??" you looked at it, it hasn't been stolen and is still present?

Did you break out a multimeter? If so, what values did you get? Where do you have voltage, and when, and how much? or did you merely touch and squeeze these components to insure that they aren't simply illusions?

SOooooooooooo many times..."yeah the battery is good. I checked it." ok. What is the voltage? "Oh it has plenty of that."

?? really? How much? "oh, plenty. I looked at it and it's fine"....

measure it. "Oh, it's got eleven, and about 6 when I crank it...."

BTW, 'new' does not mean "good". VERIFY that thepoints and related parts are functioning correctly. Got voltage at the points?
 
jos51700 said:
First things first, did you LOOK into the carburetor and verify that it's got fuel? Accelerator pump is your friend. Try to catch some and inspect. It's not water is it?
Second, pull a plug wire, hook up a spark plug and ground it, crank motor? Spark?

Is the distributor rotor turning when you crank it? Did the 318 run when it was pulled?

When I see this:


The first thing I think is, "ok, HOW did you check these things??" you looked at it, it hasn't been stolen and is still present?

Did you break out a multimeter? If so, what values did you get? Where do you have voltage, and when, and how much?

SOooooooooooo many times..."yeah the battery is good. I checked it." ok. What is the voltage? Oh it has plenty of that.

?? really? How much? "oh, plenty. I looked at it and it's fine"....

measure it. "Oh, it's got eleven, and about 6 when I crank it...."

BTW, 'new' does not mean "good". VERIFY that thepoints and related parts are functioning correctly. Got voltage at the points?
Click to expand...
Voltmeter, battery has 12.4 volts checked with load and has over 650 CCA, coil has 10,000 plus ohm and 2 ohms resistance, distributor is rotating.
 
I'll post back when I've checked distributor isn't 180 out and if the coil is getting voltage and plugs getting spark. It's 106 outside now so I'll have to tryto break in the cam in the morning.
 
Ok, had a chance to check voltage to the coil. With key on run, mutimeter positive post on the + coil post and negative to ground I got .63 volts. That doesn't sound good at all. I should be getting way more than that correct?
 
LivewireBlanco said:
Ok, had a chance to check voltage to the coil. With key on run, mutimeter positive post on the + coil post and negative to ground I got .63 volts. That doesn't sound good at all. I should be getting way more than that correct?
Click to expand...

Doesn't sound good EXCEPT......did you check is this actually the power wire or does this go to the distributor? And what does it read "in crank"? There are two different circuits in play

The key supplies power TO the ballast resistor, so that should be your next stop. From the ballast power goes to the coil + and then to the points.

'IN RUN' With the points OPEN you should read "same as battery" voltage at:

Both sides of ballast resistor and both terminals of coil. This is because there should not be current flow. If nothing, yank one wire off the ballast and re-measure

"IN CRANKING" Coil + should have "same as battery" during cranking and should be at least 10-10.5V. If points are opening/ closing, you should see "jumping" on the meter. But you ALSO should be getting a spark
 
67Dart273 said:
Doesn't sound good EXCEPT......did you check is this actually the power wire or does this go to the distributor? And what does it read "in crank"? There are two different circuits in play

The key supplies power TO the ballast resistor, so that should be your next stop. From the ballast power goes to the coil + and then to the points.

'IN RUN' With the points OPEN you should read "same as battery" voltage at:

Both sides of ballast resistor and both terminals of coil. This is because there should not be current flow. If nothing, yank one wire off the ballast and re-measure

"IN CRANKING" Coil + should have "same as battery" during cranking and should be at least 10-10.5V. If points are opening/ closing, you should see "jumping" on the meter. But you ALSO should be getting a spark
Click to expand...
This was to the positive post on coil, not the negative to distributor. The points were closed. I don't want to crank it unless I have to since it has a brand new camshaft. I'm thinking something isn't right coming from the ignition. The previous owner put a starter button inside but the key works also.
 
What you will see on coil+ with points closed will vary, I would say 6-9V depending on the type of coil, etc

With the points closed, move to the resistor and check it. One side of course will be same as coil, other should be very close to same as battery voltage

Have you read the MAD article? Have you wiring diagrams / shop manuals?

Your biggest suspects "IF" you can eliminate the ballast resistor, are the bulkhead connector, the switch connector, the ignition switch itself, and then bringing up the rear, if the headlights are also dim, is the ammeter connections, the fuse link and it's connections, and the harness welded splice
 
67Dart273 said:
What you will see on coil+ with points closed will vary, I would say 6-9V depending on the type of coil, etc

With the points closed, move to the resistor and check it. One side of course will be same as coil, other should be very close to same as battery voltage

Have you read the MAD article? Have you wiring diagrams / shop manuals?

Your biggest suspects "IF" you can eliminate the ballast resistor, are the bulkhead connector, the switch connector, the ignition switch itself, and then bringing up the rear, if the headlights are also dim, is the ammeter connections, the fuse link and it's connections, and the harness welded splice
Click to expand...
Headlights are bright. I have no accessories though, radio is dead and dash lights are dead except brake. Ammeter works. I'll check ballast voltage tomorrow.
 
Ok checked some voltages this morning, I guess I had my voltmeter on the wrong setting before. These are all with key in run position breaker points closed:

9.3 volts to left side of ballast blue wires
7.24 volts to right side of ballast brown wires
6.82 volts to + post on coil
 
Well I cleaned the bulkhead male connectors with contact cleaner and some sand paper and while I was cleaning I found the fuseable link connector broken. Could this be a source of problem?

20180626_125249.jpg
 
Something else I noticed is the battery is grounded to the engine and front of car by headlight but there is no firewall ground. Should I add one and if so what size wire do I use?
 
LivewireBlanco said:
Ok checked some voltages this morning, I guess I had my voltmeter on the wrong setting before. These are all with key in run position breaker points closed:

9.3 volts to left side of ballast blue wires
7.24 volts to right side of ballast brown wires
6.82 volts to + post on coil
Click to expand...

That is a LOT of drop. What does battery measure?

The "high" side of ballast should be very close to "same as battery." This indicates drop in the harness, "the path" from the battery to the ballast. so, bulkhead connector, ignition switch, switch connector

BUT CRANKING is important too, because that RUN circuit is NOT hot in "cranking."

From ballast to coil + looks "passable" in relative terms. It is the reading to the ballast "from the key" that is low
 
LivewireBlanco said:
Something else I noticed is the battery is grounded to the engine and front of car by headlight but there is no firewall ground. Should I add one and if so what size wire do I use?
Click to expand...

The rad support/ inner fenders/ firewall is all one welded piece. But even the factory battery-to-body ground was 'weak'. I like to upgrad it. One way to do that is to look at the holes in the pass side front of the head. You have the SAME holes, unused, in the rear of the driver side head. Get a short starter cable, and bolt to the rear of the head, and bolt that to the firewall securely, the master cylinder studs are good
 
67Dart273 said:
YES and it doesn't look all that great!!
Click to expand...
Ok, how do I repair this connector? I read to disconnect with a small screwdriver. Will an auto parts store have this?

Edit* I figured it out. I'm going to try Napa tomorrow and change it the connector. Hopefully this brings up the juice!
 
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