New Small Block Stroker Engine Noise

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bobscuda67 said:
If you used stainless steel valves,they are heavy and will slam shut causing a noise.
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Bob aftermarket stainless valves are not heavier than stock valves. I've weighed a few sets of SS valves and the only ones I weighed that weighed more than stock valves were a set of cheap rebuilder types for BB Chevy heads.
 
This has been going on long enough that I don't remember if this was mentioned. Any chance the bottom of a rocker is hitting a retainer? You've been pretty thorough so you've probably checked it. I just don't remember & don't want to read through 9 pages of posts. Damn!! I really want to know what this is.
 
340sFastback said:
I took the rockers off the right side today. All rockers and shafts look like new. The push rods on that side do contact the head some. Some of the paint was rubbed off but none were scraped beyond that. All 16 push rods are completely straight.
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This is more likely than not your problem...

The rods are levering on the interference points into and out of the cups at either end causing the clatter.

What do I win? :toothy10:

Ede's with SBM hyd rollers are a huge problem with this. You think you clearance enough and you find you need more material removed.
 
crackedback said:
This is more likely than not your problem...

The rods are levering on the interference points into and out of the cups at either end causing the clatter.

What do I win? :toothy10:

Ede's with SBM hyd rollers are a huge problem with this. You think you clearance enough and you find you need more material removed.
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I am thinking the same also. Even though the pushrods don't show much sign of problem they could be bouncing out and back into the cups when they contact the head.
 
fishy68 said:
I am thinking the same also. Even though the pushrods don't show much sign of problem they could be bouncing out and back into the cups when they contact the head.
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And if they're doing it just before the valves are fully closed there will be a split second of clearance as they're bouncing back into the cups which could cause the valve to smack it's seat a little harder than normal. All it takes is one doing it to give you the clack. I was also going to suggest that you rig up an arm so that you can exercise each valve one at a time to make sure that the valve stems aren't "slightly" tight within the guide.

Terry
 
I believe the push rods were binding in the heads and snapping free causing the noise. I'll pull both heads and carefully increase push rod clearance. I will be spending many hours making sure this issue is corrected. I clearanced those holes on the bottom during engine assembly but apparently I didn't clearance them enough.

I think I'll pull all the lifters and look them over. I don't think there are any issue there but they should be checked. I know they all pumped up and I know there is no oil hemorrhage issues.

Oil flow to the heads was great, rockers and rocker shafts all look like new, lots of space between rocker arm and retainer, roller tip to valve stem geometry looks good, springs do no coil bind, and retainers don't bottom out on guide. There are no issues up in the rocker arm area of the engine I am sure of that.

The bottom end looks beautiful. I am very confident no issues exist there. I spent a lot of time yesterday double checking everything down there and it all looks great.

Once I get it back together I plan to put it on the engine dyno. I am tired of mickey mousing around with this engine.
 
demon seed said:
I was also going to suggest that you rig up an arm so that you can exercise each valve one at a time to make sure that the valve stems aren't "slightly" tight within the guide.
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I had thought about that too, a valve stem binding on the valve guide. The heads are Edelbrock Stage 2 ported from Shady Dell Speed and he went over all the valve guide clearances. I have a lot of faith that he did the job correctly.
 
I like the idea of opening up the holes... I'd think they shouldn't make that kind of noise. But at this point, anything that isnt perfect should be suspect and made perfect.
 
moper said:
I like the idea of opening up the holes... I'd think they shouldn't make that kind of noise. But at this point, anything that isnt perfect should be suspect and made perfect.
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I am going to keep looking, especially at the lifters. But I believe the push rods could have been binding and snapping free causing the noise.
 
I agree. It might be enought o make the pushrod snap into the cups when there's enough force on it as the lifter rides up the lobe. You'll never hear just the sound of a valve closing on a running engine.
 
moper said:
I agree. It might be enough to make the pushrod snap into the cups when there's enough force on it as the lifter rides up the lobe. You'll never hear just the sound of a valve closing on a running engine.
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I would think the engine would run like total crap if it were binding that much .
 
John, I think only two push rods showed significant contact with the head, another some contact, and maybe two more lightly touched. I would say 12 of the 16 had no contact at all. I think the ones that did contact the head still allowed the valve to open but binded in the hole and caused noise. The engine did seem to run fairly well but had a noise that should not have been there.

I need to look things over more closely because the ones I think binded badly should have some marks in the lifter seat and/or rocker pocket. There will also be wear marks in the heads push rod holes where they contacted. I'll be taking the entire top end apart soon for a total inspection to be sure all the problems are found. I am confident the bottom end is good but the top end still needs to be looked over more closely.
 
I had a noise simular to this one time. I had someone install bronze wall guides on my valves and they had the valve side clearance to tight on the exhaust valves and with the new oil seals on stems didn't allow for much lubrication. It was causing the valves to stick when it warmed up and not close properly. When I took the car out and got on it hard it lacked power and after a couple passes down the track the head popped off one of my exhaust valves and spit out the headder. End of story. hope you find you noise.
 
The pushrods DO NOT bind in the hole from end to end. It hits in the tunnel during lift action. It never BINDS between two points in the head. Only one spot is contacted.. As it lifts, the pushrod makes contact with the head and the line of sight between the lifter and pushrod cups is compromised. It levers one end or the other out of the cup.

It's a line of sight issue, so to speak.

Look in the holes for shiny spots, then GRIND!

Good luck with it. Been a long battle for you.
 
So is this something that someone should only expect when running a cam with this much lift and Eddy heads? Maybe a .513" would clear ok?
 
68 Sedan said:
So is this something that someone should only expect when running a cam with this much lift and Eddy heads? Maybe a .513" would clear ok?
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It's really only an issue using lifters with increased height of the pushrod cup, like hyd rollers. It moves the lower point of the pushrods, increasing the compound angle of the already messed up 59* block.

If you are running a std Hyd or Solid, it's not an issue. Always need to check, never had one that hit yet.
 
I add room on all RPM heads... If you use 1.6 rockers, or thicker pushrods, or a higher lifter as was sasid, they will more than likely hit. So all heads get the PR holes enlarged slightly. It's part of that "check an correct" procedure. If the ehads were not looked at, the exh guides (or some anyway) may be too tight. I typically find several that are less than .0003". But I think any pressure ont he PR may allow the plunger in the lifter to do strange things...
 
Thanks to everyone for all the great suggestions. You guys have been a great help, much appreciated.

The heads were bought from Shady Dell Speed, Stage 2 Ported. It is standard procedure for Ryan to go over all the valve guide clearances. That is a well known issue with Eddie heads. I have a lot of faith he did the job correctly. His reputation is second to none.

I agree with Crackedback's opinion about what was happening. When I tear it down after Christmas there should be strong evidence the push rod was being forced out of the rocker adjuster and/or lifter seat. That was a pretty loud noise so marks should exist. The push rod is also a harder metal then the head so there should be some significant marks inside the push rod holes. One push rod has a really big rub mark on it so I believe that is the one that was making all the noise. I would say 12 or more of the push rods did not hit at all. I plan to pull both heads and increase push rod clearance where needed. Some might not rub at idle but could at high RPM which could cause serious problems later. The lifters all need to be removed and carefully looked over too. A lot more checking needs to be done to make sure when this engine goes back together the problem is solved.
 
340sFastback said:
Thanks to everyone for all the great suggestions. You guys have been a great help, much appreciated.

The heads were bought from Shady Dell Speed, Stage 2 Ported. It is standard procedure for Ryan to go over all the valve guide clearances. That is a well known issue with Eddie heads. I have a lot of faith he did the job correctly. His reputation is second to none.

I agree with Crackedback's opinion about what was happening. When I tear it down after Christmas there should be strong evidence the push rod was being forced out of the rocker adjuster and/or lifter seat. That was a pretty loud noise so marks should exist. The push rod is also a harder metal then the head so there should be some significant marks inside the push rod holes. One push rod has a really big rub mark on it so I believe that is the one that was making all the noise. I would say 12 or more of the push rods did not hit at all. I plan to pull both heads and increase push rod clearance where needed. Some might not rub at idle but could at high RPM which could cause serious problems later. The lifters all need to be removed and carefully looked over too. A lot more checking needs to be done to make sure when this engine goes back together the problem is solved.
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Any update???
 
I clearanced the push rods holes and put it back together. Been running great for years now.
 
I needed 2 full turns of preload on my hyd rollers to make them quiet.got topush that plunger down. Give it a try cos lots of guys have needed 2 full turns to make them quiet and rev
And obiously like the op make sure your pushrods are clearanced
 
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