Now I'm bein effed by the EP effin' A

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67Dart273

67Dart273

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So the estate didn't sell, my sister is a POS and the realtor 'mentioned' that some of the property had been classified wetlands. She didn't seem to know much. Long story short, I found a map showing whatever faceless personality-less jerkoffs sit in front of software all day and "declare" this to be so. The photo pretty much encloses what used to be a 40 acre place. There is a 5 acre square at bottom left where Gramps built his retirement home (SW corner) and now belongs to my Aunt. Mom and Dad's old house and barn are at bottom right. The whole thing amounts to about 34 acres which is almost 1/2 mine. Look at this crap

wetlands.jpg


What they are showing as a waterway is basically a "part time" drainage creek. It dries up most summers. "I could see" a small area around parts of it being "wetlands." The way the rest is classified, it could be anywhere on the face of the earth for Chris sakes. Your front lawn? It's a ******* wetlands. It rains on your lawn sometimes, right? It's green sometimes, right? THAT'S RIGHT!!! It (should) be a wetlands!!!
 
Do you have to pay taxes on a 'wetland'? F 'em back and reassess your property with the tax board with these wetland exemptions? Only time my 'lawn' is green her in So Cal is after it rains....and its weed (not the expensive kind).
 
pishta said:
Do you have to pay taxes on a 'wetland'? F 'em back and reassess your property with the tax board with these wetland exemptions? Only time my 'lawn' is green her in So Cal is after it rains....and its weed (not the expensive kind).
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Yea....I heard that weed was legal in Cali....:rofl:
 
pishta said:
Do you have to pay taxes on a 'wetland'? F 'em back and reassess your property with the tax board with these wetland exemptions? Only time my 'lawn' is green her in So Cal is after it rains....and its weed (not the expensive kind).
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Yup
 
67Dart273 said:
Yup
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Del, here in Georgia, we can apply for an agricultural tax break past X amount of acres and that cuts property taxes by a LOT. You might look into something like that. I forget what it's called.........farm exemption........**** I caint remember. It would seem like most every state ought to have something like that available. Worth lookin into.
 
Here too, Rob but this is not the problem. Most of what is on the map is NOT what any reasonable person would consider wetlands. This has "got" to go.
 
67Dart273 said:
Yup
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Thats Bogus.....Here's what you do: Run for office, or donate to a candidate that will give you an exemption. Its the American way! (actually, its the way of the world, were just a little behind the curve)
 
Here the department of natural resources will pay you to "manage" the wetlands you own. Lot of hoops to jump thru but a good way to reverse F them. Buddy of mine planted a bunch of trees and threw down some wildlife grain producing plants and created his own hunting preserve on their dime.
 
67Dart273 said:
Here too, Rob but this is not the problem. Most of what is on the map is NOT what any reasonable person would consider wetlands. This has "got" to go.
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Is there something you can do about it?
 
Don't know yet, Rob. If you Google this it is difficult to get meaningful info because Google has turned into such a shithole. In other words "their software sucks."
 
Try going to the EPA website. They have complete information regarding wetland classification. Those numbers on your map are the classifications for each area.
 

It's not EPA directly ..... this was handed off by Congress to the Army Corps of Engineers to manage under the acts concerning inland waters. This above mapping is maintained by the Fish & Wildlife Service, and they set up the wetlands classifications.
Wetlands Mapper

The 'inland waters' definition got reinterpreted in recent decades to go beyond flowing/standing waters and include the areas feeding the flowing/standing bodies of water. Wetlands and the above mapping came about from that. In the west, it often even includes things like irrigation ditches.

And the EPA and state DEQ's may get involved if there is any pollution or possibility of such.... So it can be a big confusing mass of agencies getting involved. Del if you have not found this already, this is a link to an Idaho resource that, if you dig through it, gives you some idea of what agency is involved in what.
https://www.aswm.org/pdf_lib/state_summaries/idaho_state_wetland_program_summary_111615.pdf

I was looking at 10 acres in ID to buy, 9 of which was wetlands, and trying to figure out the permissions process to modify parts for a house, and figuring out a foundation system for the house. It just became too iffy so I dropped it. That parcel is still for sale, and realtors all over are becoming more sensitized to this. By most (or all) state statutes covering their work, they have to mention this as 'material knowledge' to prospective buyers. So, it can effect the value and saleablility of land.

Things like pasture use don't seem to get effected. That is not 'modifying' the wetlands. Putting in a permanent roadway or a structure is where the problems crop up; that is 'modifying' the wetlands. That infamous case about 12-15 years ago in Idaho over a couple filling in part of their lot to build a house, and getting fined 10's of millions of $$, stemmed from this type of stuff.
 
nm9stheham said:
That infamous case about 12-15 years ago in Idaho over a couple filling in part of their lot to build a house, and getting fined 10's of millions of $$, stemmed from this type of stuff.
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This is nothing short of land confiscation without due process. I guess I assumed that people who were affected had things like a creek or river bordering their property, and "an actual wetlands" not some rainwater runoff like EVERY SINGLE FRONT LAWN IN THE COUNTRY experiences!!!
 
In Alabama if you want to modify wetlands you will have buy or use other property to create the same acreage of wetland. There is some wetland property a couple miles above me that just sold and I was approached about draining it and making it suitable for homesite but I told them "not me". I also told them they had better tiptoe around and check into what could be done to them if they did drain it. They got another guy to build a road across it while it was dry and then when it rained it has been under water for the past three weeks and it is just now getting into rainy season. I am just sitting back watching to see what happens. The guy that sold it may get in trouble for selling it under the pretense that it could be used as home site.
 
You can do anything you want on "wetlands " as long as you get the proper permits . the problem is getting the permits . That takes a good lawyer . As far as "wetlands" are concerned you can do anything you want without a permit if it is for "agriculture". If the property , at one time , was a farm you can get assistance from the U.S.D.A. to restore it for farm use . Then ,you can put the property in conservation and get a really good tax break . After that ,you can do any f***ing thing you want on the property and tell the local/county to go pound sand . You just gotta be smart, informed and active .
 
Looking at some acreage with two man made ponds, guss I will have to go to the state and see if I can fill them in now, before the purchase.
 
383Scampman said:
You can do anything you want on "wetlands " as long as you get the proper permits . the problem is getting the permits . That takes a good lawyer . As far as "wetlands" are concerned you can do anything you want without a permit if it is for "agriculture". If the property , at one time , was a farm you can get assistance from the U.S.D.A. to restore it for farm use . Then ,you can put the property in conservation and get a really good tax break . After that ,you can do any f***ing thing you want on the property and tell the local/county to go pound sand . You just gotta be smart, informed and active .
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This sounds long, drawn out and expensive. That is NOT the definition of "do anything you want" Like I said, this is nothing short of confiscation without due process
 
67Dart273 said:
This is nothing short of land confiscation without due process. I guess I assumed that people who were affected had things like a creek or river bordering their property, and "an actual wetlands" not some rainwater runoff like EVERY SINGLE FRONT LAWN IN THE COUNTRY experiences!!!
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Del, read this webpage. It does a better job of defining wetlands than I can do, and make the distinction on what is regulatory and what is not. Per this, the mapping that you found is from the FWS, and FWS uses is one of the broadest definitions of wetlands, and so their mapping is the worst case. And the states can and do have their own definitions. So it is very confusing.
History of Wetlands in the Conterminous United States

FWIW, the current Federal administration is pushing the as much as they can for determination by the states, and trying to minimize and streamline the federal involvement. Thank goodness.... but that can be reversed with any enviro-friendly administration.

The good news IMHO in your case is that there is plenty of land in your 40 acres that is NOT wetlands, and if anyone wants to use it, they can make good use. IMHO, that factor should be emphasized for the realty sale; the realtors need to be open about this, but nothing stops them from pointing out this positive aspect of the situation. Plus that particular classification makes it OK for general ag use; I have seen hundreds and hundreds of acres of the PEM1C wetlands being used for cattle grazing up in the Stanley Basin area, for example.

I've looked seriously at 3 of pieces of land in ID that were partly wetlands. One was 90% wetlands and where you could build was just in one corner of the 10 acres. Another was over 95% wetlands and has only a few small spots on which to build in 17 acres. A 3rd has a several acre area that is high and dry and so would have a great place to build. So, comparatively speaking, your 40 acres is not badly off.
 
If you think it's "long, drawn out and expensive " think of the alternative . If you don't want to invest your time then let it go . I know what I would do with the property . I have wetlands on my property and I'm thankful for it . That means some f.a. isn't going to put a "starter castle" on it and ruin it . I wish I had 40 acres .
 
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