Por 15 vs. KBS Rust Seal

Mopar Body and Trim

  1. augiepaw

    augiepaw Well-Known Member

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    Has anyone heard of KBS Rust Seal and how does it compare to Por 15? The guy at the paint store said Por 15 is the same as it was in the beginning. No inprovments. KBS is from the same people that made the first Por 15, But went out on there own, made inprovements and started their own company. So it it any better? It is cheaper.
     
  2. 67Dart440GT

    67Dart440GT Seriously Long Member FABO Gold Member

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    I don't know about the Rust seal but I personally think POR should be called POS. It was one of the worst products I have ever used. I tried Eastwood's version of the product and it worked much better.
     
  3. Map63Vette

    Map63Vette Well-Known Member

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    What exactly didn't work well with the POR for you? I was just curious since I painted my floor pans and roof with it and haven't really noticed any issues yet. Wondering what I might want to look for.
     
  4. 67Dart440GT

    67Dart440GT Seriously Long Member FABO Gold Member

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    POR was a bit weird as far as how it worked. I used it as a brush on on the inside of my fenders and such. It was very streaked and was almost like it was oil based. Seemed like you had to keep wiping back and forth several times to get coverage. I kept the can sealed up as recommended came back and the remaining 50% of the can was solid as a rock. Lid was tight. I tried the eastwood stuff and it worked much better. Seemed about the same but was much easier to work with and seemed to self level itself showing very minimal brush strokes. It also has stayed in the can with no problems for several months now.
     
  5. Map63Vette

    Map63Vette Well-Known Member

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    Hmm, I think I sort of know what you mean. When I brushed mine on it did seem to have a few streaks and brush strokes not to mention it was almost like painting on glue. It leveled out the brush strokes okay, it just took a long time to do it. The dry time on this stuff is pretty long. I had my can seal shut when I went to get some more later. I ended up putting the rest in a mason jar since I could wipe the top off better to keep the paint from sealing it, lol.
     
  6. ryansiki

    ryansiki Well-Known Member

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    KBS is much better.I spent some time on a couple of truck forums. Most people said KBS was like POR-15 on steroids.
     
  7. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod 30 Degrees Outta Whack FABO Gold Member

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    Eastwood sells a product called rust Encapsulator. works really well and does not break down in ultra violet light.
     
  8. dgc333

    dgc333 Well-Known Member

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    All I can say about POR 15 is I used it on my Barracuda back in 98/99 and no new rust has developed where I put it on, it's never pealed or shown any signs of breaking down. I had some left over and used it on the steel bulkhead to my basement then top coated it with red hardware store enamel. I have not had to touch it since in 11 years of New England winters. Prior to that I was wire wheeling the bulkhead every spring and putting a new layer of rustolium on it.
     
  9. Map63Vette

    Map63Vette Well-Known Member

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    I've had pretty good luck with POR so far, but then again I haven't tried anything else. Everything I buy for the car gets a coat now, lol. Bought it for the floor pan and underside of roof and have also painted the K frame and new rear end housing with what I had left over. Only problem is it keep self sealing all the cans / jars I put it in, lol. It seems like pretty tough stuff. It's got a funny slick texture to it, but it doesn't scratch up easy, so I've been pleased so far. We'll see how it holds up once I drive on the new rear end.
     
  10. gerahead

    gerahead Glutton for Punishment

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    What I have done is before putting the lid on, put a piece of plastic over the opening (sandwich bag works for small cans), push down a little in the center of the opening and then put the lid on and seal it. If the paint dries between two pieces of metal, it will bond them together really well. Store the cans upside down to prevent air from entering the can (this works for all paint cans). If you have a place where you can do it without initiating a civil war, store an opened can in a refrigerator. I have done this successfully with open cans for over a year.

    Jim
     
  11. Map63Vette

    Map63Vette Well-Known Member

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    Hmm, not a bad idea. I've been using old jelly jars, on the second one now, lol. The jar worked fine the first time I had to reopen it, but the last time resulted in a bit of an explosion and some black hands for a few days.
     
  12. Lone Yankee

    Lone Yankee Well-Known Member

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    I have had enormous success with POR-15. However...

    First thing with POR-15 is the damn prep work. It is one of the most demanding coatings I have ever used. It wants a surface that is not only bare and dry but also free of scale and properly micro-etched. The ideal surface, imho, is steel blasted with xxx-fine media, painted with salty water, allowed to take a light rust, re-cleaned and THEN apply the POR.

    POR is also a respiratory hazard so I only use it outdoors and you must mind the temp and humidity gridlines for applications.

    Lastly, POR is NOT UV stable, it MUST be top coated if it is going to be in contact with sunlight.

    Once properly applied and top coated, I swear it will stop an anti-tank missile. I have never had to re-paint a surface coated with POR ever again thus far.

    Also:

    1) once you open the can, you kind of have to use the rest of it up, it does not re-cork well.

    2) If you get it on your hands you need to remove it with acetone IMMEDIATLY. It says right on the can that POR that dries on you hand will never come off, you have to wait for it to wear off.

    3) Apply POR with disposable brushes, don't bother trying to clean and re-use anything that touches it and that goes for clothing too.

    My two cents on the stuff. -LY

    I have never used KBS.
     
  13. jefflock

    jefflock 69 Dart 408 10.008 best pass so far

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    I used wax paper under the lid to seal mine up. It lasted quite a while doing that with several uses and reseals.
     
  14. dartndodge

    dartndodge Member

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    I have used KBS "Blacktop" straight out of the can, on my vintage 750/4 frame. Prepped the frame, no rust etc, made sure it was clean and grease free. Just used a paint brush. The paint levels out nice and is very gloss. Unfortunately I got too excited and used too thick a paint on the brush and had runs. But i'll put up with a few drops here and there. Has a powder coat like appearance and feel. Suppose to be UV safe (it is Ozzy :)) but havent tested as Im still building the bike. Seems a tough coating. Never tried Por15 to compare.
    Next frame I will thin it a little with their thinner, but still brush it, tho spraying may work better. Still got plenty left over from 1 ltr can and used clingwrap to cover b4 lid on.
    Give it a go.
     
  15. Map63Vette

    Map63Vette Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I probably should have prepped my stuff better, but it seems to be holding well for what I did so far. I pretty much just took a wire wheel on a drill to everything to get most of the junk off and then wiped it down with thinner and painted on top after it dried. It seems to be holding on well enough so far. I wanted to sandblast stuff but didn't have the patience. Bought a spot blasting gun with a hopper on top to do my floor pans, but even after taping and bagging the whole inside it started raining for a week, so I got lazy and just got the drill. I didn't want to blow the whole car apart either like I really needed to.
     
  16. Lone Yankee

    Lone Yankee Well-Known Member

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    Nice! I'll give it a try next time around. Thanx.
     
  17. EddyLucast

    EddyLucast New Member

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    I know this is an old thread and I AM a KBS Distributor. I won't mention my company or list any links to my sites. I am not here to spam you.

    I wanted to respond to several of the replies in an effort to get the users the best outcome regardless of the product they choose to use.


    First both POR-15 and KBS RustSeal are closed cell urethanes, never shaken, always stirred. The fact that they are closed cell paints means you have to use thin coats, why? because the paint has to cure throughout it's thickness before the surface seals over unlike a conventional automotive paint where the solvents leach to the surface and evaporate leaving behind a pore in the surface.

    The good thing is a closed cell paint leaves a thicker effective layer of paint. With either product you need to end up with 4 to 4.5 mils of paint for automotive applications. If it's applied to thick the solvents won't have enough time to dry out before the surface seals over and the paint will lift from the metal.

    Because these are moisture cured products, it's the moisture in the atmosphere that cause the paints to cure. If it's really dry out it will take a long time to cure. Moisture soaked newspapers under your project will solve this. If the humidity is high they can cure so fast, especially with 1 mil or less coats, they may not have time to level out. Humidity levels are important when you apply it.
    This is why directions tell you not to paint out of the can!!! Everytime you dip your brush into the can you are introducing oxygen and moisture into the paint in the can which starts the curing process. Rather stir the paint well, use a coffee scoop, so the rim stays clean, and dip out what you need into a glass jar and work from that.

    There are a couple of tricks to keep both of these from setting up in the can and lets face it our projects are expensive enough already. I restore old trucks.
    1. As mentioned wrap a piece of sarah wrap over the can, then push it down so it touches the paint in the top of the can and then come up over the side of the can and replace the lid
    2. My Favorite --Put a self tapping screw with a rubber washer in the lid. Take the lid off and stir well. Replace the lid. Remove the screw and pour out what you need. Go over to your welder and put a puff of argon gas in the hole and replace the screw. The argon is heavier than oxygen so it settles into a layer seperating the moisture containing oxygen from the paint in the can. Body shops keep open cans for two to three years this way. Unopened cans can be put in your freezer for long term storage.

    If you have streaks, stir stir and stir some more!

    Whats the difference between POR-115 and KBS RustSeal,
    • RustSeal is based on about 25 years newer chemistry.
    • POR-15 has 0 UV stabillity, RustSeal in all 10 colors has 90% UV stability
    • POR-15 always needs a UV stable top coat and RustSeal used somewhere not in direct sunlight, floorpans, chassis, etc has all the UV stabilty it needs and won't need a topcoat. But in direct sunlight, it too needs a 100% UV stable topcoat.
    • RustSeal has a custom polyner used to elminate adhesion issues that POR-15 does not have.
    • Rustseal huch higher solids content 70% vs 20%.
    • RustSeal cost is about 20% less
    The difference between RustSeal and Blacktop mentioned in one reply is, RustSeal like POR-15 will give you protection from rust but neither has 100% UV stability. Blacktop is a 100% UV stable chassis topcoat.

    I have a truck given to me by a dear friend just before he passed away. A rust encapsulator was used on the bed and it turned out to have an effective life of about 5 years. I don't know whos product it was or how it was applied.
     
  18. memike

    memike Super Moderator Staff Member FABO Gold Member

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    Thank you for this insight :glasses7:
     
  19. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod 30 Degrees Outta Whack FABO Gold Member

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    That's good insight and all.....and much appreciated most certainly. But why on earth aren't all these tips included with the product? Might be something to think about.
     
  20. barbee6043

    barbee6043 barbee 6043 FABO Gold Member

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    thanks EddyLucast for the info!!!!! there are probably other questions he could answer, but I hate to take advantage of his time.

    no doubt, dealing with rust takes up half our time and consideration!
     
  21. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod 30 Degrees Outta Whack FABO Gold Member

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    Yeah but when an automaker like Ford addresses the problem and starts making trucks out of aluminum, all we can do is bitch about it and talk about what a bad idea it is. Funny had it been Chrysler it would have been most innovative.
     
  22. 1967 'cuda

    1967 'cuda Dropped on Head as a Baby

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    EddyLucast, Thanks for the detailed write up on the 2 products. I've successfully been using POR-15 for several years and had not seriously considered other brands before. After reading your post I think I'll start checking into KBS Rustseal.
     
  23. RustyRatRod

    RustyRatRod 30 Degrees Outta Whack FABO Gold Member

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    Rustoleum oil based paint from Lowes gets my money from now on. Works GREAT.
     
  24. memike

    memike Super Moderator Staff Member FABO Gold Member

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    My thoughts exactly :glasses7: there are some good points he brought up :glasses7:
     
  25. EddyLucast

    EddyLucast New Member

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    One thing that confuses a lot of people is UV protection. There are two different UV ratings
    • UV Stability
    • UV Block
    UV Stability refers to whether UV light will damage the coating
    UV Block is how much UV light will pass thru the coating.

    Products that lack 100% UV stability need a top coat that offer both 100% UV Blocking and are 100% UV stable if it's going to see direct sunlight.
     
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