r&r cluster, now it won't start, need help

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hinkdart

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I should start off by mentioning that I'm a bit of a newbie but I follow directions well and usually don't run into trouble. I left my haynes manual outside and it rained so it is pretty useless until it dries out.

I have a 72 dart swinger, auto on the column. I went online and got directions that stated to drop the column and I did. I removed the 3 bolts that hold the support to the column and removed it ( it wasn't even bolted in the back. I then removed the two smaller bolts that hold the column up to the dash and 2 at the bottom. The column turned to the right and went down a little. Enough so that I was able to let it turn to the right and slide the cluster out with much annoyance.

I've reinstalled everything and now it doesn't start. The car is a bit jury rigged from the previous owners. The radio is powered by a single wire which also powers the tach but they won't turn on even though that wire is connected always hot. Its just a spade connector and I slipped it into the fuse box to both of the fuses that are always hot. The radio also has another power source that must be connected because you can press a button and the time pops up even with the main power not hooked up.

2 fuses are hot all the time and the rest are not powered no matter which position I put the key. The steering column turned to the right and I loosened everything back up and turned it more to the left so it is perfectly plumb. I had the neg battery terminal disconnected so I don't think I popped anything and all the fuses appear to be good, besides I'm not getting power to any except those two.

Also my steering only locks to the right. I can turn it to the left and it locks but allows you to turn left further just not right. Is that normal or did i knock something out doing this "quick" job. Thanks, in advance
 
Did...........you.........hook.........up.........the............ammeter?


Does it have any power anywhere? Do the headlights work?
 
yes, I hooked up the ammmeter, i'll pull it again but I took a picture, red on the right, black on the left.

headlights do work

Does it have a neutral safety switch? I tried to start in every gear but no change
 
hinkdart said:
yes, I hooked up the ammmeter, i'll pull it again but I took a picture, red on the right, black on the left.

headlights do work

Does it have a neutral safety switch? I tried to start in every gear but no change
Click to expand...

The NSS is on the transmission. But you said:

hinkdart said:
got directions that stated to drop the column and I did...........The column turned to the right and went down a little................. now it doesn't start. .............


2 fuses are hot all the time and the rest are not powered no matter which position I put the key.

Also my steering only locks to the right. I can turn it to the left and it locks but allows you to turn left further just not right. Is that normal ................
Click to expand...

I assume that by "not starting" you mean it does not crank, IE does not turn over?

The thing about the fuses seems to indicate a wiring disconnect. Do you know if the additional fuses worked BEFORE you removed the column?

You may have multiple problems, IE speaking of the hacked up wiring, the dead fuses, and the way the switch seems to work.

Look at the bottom of your fuse box. Find the BUSSES where the 2 fuses and the 3 fuses are jumpered together. These are the power coming IN. One buss is always hot from the ammeter, the other buss is ONLY hot when the key is in either "accessory" or "run."

The way you describe the action of your ignition switch does not sound correct. There should be a definate lock position, BUT

In moving the column around you may have screwed up the linkage. There is a transmission lock linkage that is supposed to prevent you from locking the switch except when the transmission is in "park." Also, you may (probably did) change the relationship of the column to transmission linkage. There is an adjustment

Go here and download a free factory service manual:

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?p=1970088617

You can thank AbodyJoe for the 72 manual

and more stuff and more manuals here

http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=31

Also here are simplified, sometimes easier to follow electrical diagrams. NOTE these are not always complete with all options, they do not show all the connectors, and are sometimes in error

http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=24
 
sweet, thank you. I'm going to take it apart again and see if I can see anything that maybe fell out etc or was loosened in the process. It usually is something simple.

Yes all my fuses had power before. Everything works on the car except the horn and the ammeter guage doesn't really move much. It moves but I never with any accuracy. I will mention that when I put on the headlights it went down below 0 or to the left of center. I'm going out there now to give it a shot.
 
Since it worked earlier, check the connector at the column for the ignition switch. It may have come loose, or have been damaged from, say, heat, and when you moved the column, now connections are poor

You need to detail exactly what does and does not work

Does it crank?

What has power?

What does not?

This is from page approx 8-150 of the 72 manual, the column connector and the fuse panel. The three fuses hooked together at top left are the "accessory" buss and get power only when the key is on. The next two hooked together at the top are "hot" at all times. The last fuse is a trick. It only gets power from the dash lamp dimmer control.

On the ignition switch, you can see the top wire, "start." This is what feeds to your start relay. Check for power there with the key twisted over. If you have power there, but the engine will not crank, it is probably linkage adjustment at the transmission. Read the shop manual, the transmission section.

Look at next wire down, Q2-12BK. This means arbitrary circuit no. Q2 it means it's a no 12 size wire, and BlacK in color. That is what feeds your fuse panel. This wire should be hot when the switch is in "accessory" or "run."

Look at the fuse panel, coming in from the left is Q2A-14BK. This is a wire coming off a junction coming from the ignition switch. This is power coming INTO the fuse panel in "accessory."
 

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I went back inside as the sun is still shinning right on the car. It should clear the tree in less than an hour and give me some shade. Car does not crank at all. It has an extra fuse compared to the diagram as well. 3 where ac and heat are inop all the time. next 2 are hot all the time, any key position. last 2 are inop. dome light works with dimmer switch and headlights turn on.

aftermarket **** is driving me crazy. I'm not very good at electrical but I can check power and ground. radio, tach and aftermarket guages ( oil and temp) will only work with this blue wire that gets plugged into the fuse box. I checked and the tach is lighting up but still no radio. The radio only works when the car is running but used to stay on until I turned the headlights off. I had it in the headlight plug so it only worked when the lights were on. How he wired it is driving me crazy. This is just a rant at this point but there is another aftermarket button he installed under the dash but it never did anything. Now it works with key on or off. Its the horn!

sun is right on the edge of the car, I'm going out shortly to check what I did yesterday and check ignition switch.
 
I'm going waaaay out on a limb here, but is it possible when the column moved that it bumped into gear and then the linkage separated somehow and now it's in gear against the NSS so it won't crank.

Like I said it's a stretch , but it might be worth taking a second to look.
 
Here's what I suggest you try... Reach over the steering wheel with left arm grab the column shifter and pull up hard, turn the key. If that doesn't work, take the shifter to neutral and move it slowly up and down in the neutral range/area while the key is turned to start position.
I'm betting it will start. If I win the bet, You'll need to crawl under the car and adjust the shifter linkage. Maybe not today but eventually.
 
redfish I already tried shifting in all gears and in between gears with not even a peep from the starter.

Its officially a wiring nightmare. I'll upload pics a couple minutes after this posts as I'm going to have to use photobucket. it goes into park and rolls in neutral so I'm guessing the linkage is ok.

I dropped the column and slid out the cluster. I have power on both sides of the ammeter wether on off or at start.

I found a red wire that is a pretty heavy guage coming down the steering column. It has a female connector for a spade on it. It makes ground when set to any position but off including start and acc etc. Will not supply power in any position. It was unplugged and I can not find a spade connector to put it in. I do have the blue wire spade but it is for the accessories and needs power. I plugged the 2 of them in but of course nothing.

I found several other broken wires. I untaped the wires coming down thru the column and the ones in question are all in the pics. The one with the white connector has 3 wires. 1.
green with black stripe. 2 light tan with white stripe and 3 is purple. No idea where these would be plugged into. From what I remember they were never plugged in.

There is a black wire with a maroon stripe but it is just cut off and if I had to guess probably goes to the horn.

There is a black wire with some type of male connector, never plugged in. Lastly the blue wire for the accessories but I've played with that in the past and even with it unplugged, car ran great, just no radio and aftermarket guages.

I tried to look thru the manual but I grew impatient and couldn't find the electrical section. Anybody know what that red wire is for. Its my guess as the culprit.
 
it was the red effin wire. One of those white junction block thingys had a wire missing. I was thinking it was for something aftermarket because it had a female spade connection on it. slid it right in and wipers started immediately. Didn't even realize they werent working. fired right up.

I'm going to put it back together and remind myself how much more I just learned by figuring out rather than not having the problem in the first place. and that black wire with the maroon stripe is for the horn. I found the other half and it is connected to the button. Thanks everyone for chiming in and listen to me biotch.
 
Glad you are making progress. I gave you the manual page. All chrysler manuals of this ere have the electrical in section 8. A few years later, some of the body wiring was in a separate body manual (body and chassis)
 
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