Reviving some old W2's

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RAMM

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Earlier this summer I was sent these heads from a FABO member to work over. These open chamber heads had been previously worked on by another shop and they were reportedly flowing somewhere in the high 270's. First thing I do is a flow test to see where we are starting.

4.06" bore @ 28" H20 2.02/1.6

.100 62.4 51 w/pipe
.200 131.5 116
.300 191 154
.400 231.7 186
.450 250.5 192
.500 256.6 198.5
.550 253.4 201.6
.600 252.1 202.6
.650 252 204.3

Keep in mind these are previously rubbed on a little. An untouched W2 goes a paltry 231-232 @ .450-.480" lift then stalls hard. J.Rob

IMG_20170713_140844.jpg
 
So what are you pointing out? That somebody's flow bench is way out of cal? I barely understand some of this stuff, what is the first and second set of numbers?
 
67Dart273 said:
So what are you pointing out? That somebody's flow bench is way out of cal? I barely understand some of this stuff, what is the first and second set of numbers?
Click to expand...

Just pointing out that a flowbench is a comparison tool-nothing more nothing less. You compare before vs after on the SAME bench. Second set of numbers is exhaust. J.Rob
 
67Dart273 said:
So what are you pointing out? That somebody's flow bench is way out of cal? I barely understand some of this stuff, what is the first and second set of numbers?
Click to expand...
Intake/exhaust Flowed @28 inch depression, the standard for comparison these days.
Flow all the intake port, you usually find the one that does the number, which is typical of a lot of lesser known shops to do... port one to the target number, mirror the rest. I had been done like that a couple times wondering where the mph was... till I got my own bench and caught what was going on. **** like that attributes to as cast Eddie's making such drastic improvements over even ported factory iron, uh yeah...being one port flows 245 and the rest 218 and gping turbulent at .450...
They can look about the same and still flow 15 or so cfm apart.
Looks like a seat cut was made. Before or after initial test idk.
More to be had for sure.

I'm tuned in.
 
This set of heads still used the 3/8" stem and the guides were wasted. A chat with the customer and the decision was made to install bronze guide liners and move to a set of 2.055"/1.6" Ferrea valves with a 11/32" stem. This makes guide sizing easy and accurate. It also makes moving the valve seat "up" possible and lightens the valve up and provides flow increase potential.

It had been awhile since I ported on iron and wow was it slow removing metal. The final flow results were a little lower than what the customer was hoping for I think but I am not of the "Hog it out and make it bigger crowd". I know what a W2 can do with these flowrates and its impressive. J.Rob

New flow

.100 68.6 52
.200 136.3 113
.300 193 163
.400 236 191
.450 255
.500 270 201.2
.550 282
.600 286 209.3
.650 274
.700 276 212.5

IMG_20170801_100139.jpg
 
RAMM said:
Just pointing out that a flowbench is a comparison tool-nothing more nothing less. You compare before vs after on the SAME bench. Second set of numbers is exhaust. J.Rob
Click to expand...

OK, it SEEMED like you were comparing your numbers to the other flow bench "reportedly flowed" so much, you said. Some of you guys might be a bit more "wordy" and explain for those of us who "ain't" flow bench experts. I AM interested, I'm just not good at reading between lines which are not there....
 
I would love to see the Dyno results.
Ryan at Shady Dell is porting my W2s ... I find the relationship between CFM / Velocity and Dyno outcomes fascinating.

There is SO much to learn about the dynamics at play.
 
RAMM said:
This set of heads still used the 3/8" stem and the guides were wasted. A chat with the customer and the decision was made to install bronze guide liners and move to a set of 2.055"/1.6" Ferrea valves with a 11/32" stem. This makes guide sizing easy and accurate. It also makes moving the valve seat "up" possible and lightens the valve up and provides flow increase potential.

It had been awhile since I ported on iron and wow was it slow removing metal. The final flow results were a little lower than what the customer was hoping for I think but I am not of the "Hog it out and make it bigger crowd". I know what a W2 can do with these flowrates and its impressive. J.Rob

New flow

.100 68.6 52
.200 136.3 113
.300 193 163
.400 236 191
.450 255
.500 270 201.2
.550 282
.600 286 209.3
.650 274
.700 276 212.5

View attachment 1715104745
Click to expand...
Nice work
 
mbaird said:
I would love to see the Dyno results.
Ryan at Shady Dell is porting my W2s ... I find the relationship between CFM / Velocity and Dyno outcomes fascinating.

There is SO much to learn about the dynamics at play.
Click to expand...

no dyno #'s just 1/4 mile #'s. these W2's will go on a stock stroke 360'' with a solid flat tappet cam.
 
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My Econo W-2's flowed 280'ish when done in '93. Flow doesn't always translate into drivabilty and HP but is a good benchmark. They can go 300 cfm with some serious work.

My engine is a .020 over, 3.79 stroke deal with 13 1/2 compression and a 750 methanol carb on a ported M1 intake. Did 575HP with a Isky cam of early 90's vintage. I'm hoping that my new cam and a more modern carb will get me around 625HP... we'll see.
 
[QUOTE="]no dyno #'s just 1/4 mile #'s. these W2's will go on a stock stroke 360'' with a solid flat tappet cam.[/QUOTE]

Track makes for a good dyno...

I ran a set of Econos on a 360 in the 90s.
Just used MP templates. Ran a Comp .638 solid roller and 12.5 compression.
Hi 10s car revving to 7800. I'm hoping the stroker will outrun that with lower rpms.
I know the heads will outperform those open chamber home ported ones by quite a bit....
 
mbaird said:
[QUOTE="]no dyno #'s just 1/4 mile #'s. these W2's will go on a stock stroke 360'' with a solid flat tappet cam.
Click to expand...

Track makes for a good dyno...

I ran a set of Econos on a 360 in the 90s.
Just used MP templates. Ran a Comp .638 solid roller and 12.5 compression.
Hi 10s car revving to 7800. I'm hoping the stroker will outrun that with lower rpms.
I know the heads will outperform those open chamber home ported ones by quite a bit....[/QUOTE]

I'll likely get this engine dyno'd after it's ready to run. These dirt tracks change so much lap times don't mean a lot when you are manuvering thru traffic or face ever changing track conditions. We don't do qualifying, either.

I'm visiting the original engine builder this Friday to have him resize a few connecting rods and to see if we can get three replacement pistons made to match what I have in this engine now. This thing was built in '93, ran parts of two seasons on a 1/2 mile dirt track, then sat until '07 when it was loaned out to a friend of the PO... he blew it up not once but twice! It will be interesting to see if the heavy pistons I have can be duplicated... I believe they are from Ross. The girl who I talked to at Ross told me there would be a laser etched number on the piston top... I explained that they did not laser etch back that far... she acted like they had lasers since the beginning of time!

Any way I want to get this deal back together so I can concentrate on the chassis rehab and the body I need to build for next season...
 
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Ahhhh.... Dirt track. Right... I was thinking drag racing.

Herb Mcandless walked me thru the build on that motor over the phone. I had never heard of Norris rockers or Totally Tubular headers etc.. What a nice guy he was!
 
mbaird said:
Ahhhh.... Dirt track. Right... I was thinking drag racing.

Herb Mcandless walked me thru the build on that motor over the phone. I had never heard of Norris rockers or Totally Tubular headers etc.. What a nice guy he was!
Click to expand...

I always smile when I see some flow numbers of aftermarket SBC heads are the guys are all smiles when they see numbers like 250-260 on the intakes... not hard to do on W2/W5 heads. Even the wide bore 800 HP+ 12 and 13 degree oval track engines I have info on peak at about 310/320 or so. A Gen 3 Hemi with Apache or Eagle heads can hit those numbers without a problem...
 
My W9 go 387@750 should make some power I like the W2 heads there a great head for the money that’s for sure if anyone is looking for a set I know where there is a set of race heads Harland sharp roller rockers and a Indy intake for sale
 
Krooser said:
I always smile when I see some flow numbers of aftermarket SBC heads are the guys are all smiles when they see numbers like 250-260 on the intakes... not hard to do on W2/W5 heads. Even the wide bore 800 HP+ 12 and 13 degree oval track engines I have info on peak at about 310/320 or so. A Gen 3 Hemi with Apache or Eagle heads can hit those numbers without a problem...
Click to expand...

I would like to see an honest 310/320 cfm head make 800. My old W5's on a really trick stroker shortblock made a touch over 700 horses( and backed it up at the track) and flowed a hair more than 320. There was no way another 100 horse left on the table i can assure you. All super good machine work, spot on combination, tons of compression, thin rings, gas porting, etc,etc to get that far, and the heads were max effort and mighty thin. 140 mph at 3220 weight. You can do the math
For a head flowing in that area to make 800 would be exceptional, and something i have personally never seen nor even heard of.
 
If I get over the 600hp mark with my W5’s, I’ll be happy. They could not go the max. They’ll make a killer street head.

Fix error, “Could not” go to the max.
 
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rumblefish360 said:
If I get over the 600hp mark with my W5’s, I’ll be happy. They could go the max. They’ll make a killer street head.
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Let Ryan at Shady Dell port them, or have them CNC at Modern cylinder head.
You would have to try really hard to not make 600 with well done W5 on a stroker shortblock, unless its a very mild cam and really low on compression. And if your not going to really " use them" why pay all the money for special rocker gear and headers. You would be better off with a factory replacement head like an eddie.
 
You give advice after the fact and know no facts of the issue at hand. Conversation coming on the heads. After you clear some of your inbox out. ;)

Back to the W2’ thread.....
 
rumblefish360 said:
You give advice after the fact and know no facts of the issue at hand. Conversation coming on the heads. After you clear some of your inbox out. ;)

Back to the W2’ thread.....
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I give advice when i see it posted. I have run w5's and lived what i said i have done. Not just talk. Nothing i said isnt true
 
B3422w5 said:
I give advice when i see it posted. I have run w5's and lived what i said i have done. Not just talk. Nothing i said isnt true
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I wasn’t asking for advice.
I don’t need your advice.
I’d be happy to discuss the heads through a conversation
You assume to much

Back to the W2 thread topic
Not my heads
 
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