Saginaw Power Steering Pump Conversion problems.... AGAIN!

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J

Judge Mills

1971 Plymouth Duster
Joined
Jan 6, 2009
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Location
Westport, Washington
Finally got the bolt situation under control.....


I had the local industrial hydraulic shop make me a new high pressure line.. a little spendy ($40 bucks), a little too long, but I can make it work... As I try installing it today, A NEW problem arises!

I was going to use the fitting that originally came with the pump (yanked from a late 70's/early 80's Ram) to save a little money... The curvature of the line bumps into the engine bracket.. BAHHHHH! I'm about :cheers: this close to selling this car and buying the complete and running Mustang down the street :)

Just kidding...


Here are my pictures... Do you think I could just buy a 90 degree fitting, (size 5/8", right?) the end of the hose has a crush sleeve thingymabobber.. the intent was so i could use the old fitting/tubing.. i could theoretically get that new fitting, use some of the old tubing, and be done, right? RIGHT?

I drew an arrow showing where it would hit if the fitting was installed...

fitting.jpg


Here is my new shiny hose...

hose.jpg
 
Judge Mills said:
Finally got the bolt situation under control.....


I had the local industrial hydraulic shop make me a new high pressure line.. a little spendy ($40 bucks), a little too long, but I can make it work... As I try installing it today, A NEW problem arises!

I was going to use the fitting that originally came with the pump (yanked from a late 70's/early 80's Ram) to save a little money... The curvature of the line bumps into the engine bracket.. BAHHHHH! I'm about :cheers: this close to selling this car and buying the complete and running Mustang down the street :)

Just kidding...


Here are my pictures... Do you think I could just buy a 90 degree fitting, (size 5/8", right?) the end of the hose has a crush sleeve thingymabobber.. the intent was so i could use the old fitting/tubing.. i could theoretically get that new fitting, use some of the old tubing, and be done, right? RIGHT?

I drew an arrow showing where it would hit if the fitting was installed...

fitting.jpg


Here is my new shiny hose...

hose.jpg
Click to expand...

I don't want to speak for anyone else, but I don't understand your exact problem. Is it that you want to use the fitting and tube that came with the pump on the pressure side, but mate it with the pump end of your new hose?
 
You will have to carfully bend it by hand to get a tighter 90 degree than you could with a tubing bender. You might even fill the tube with sand while bending it to prevent the tube from kinking. I made a "J" shaped fitting to clear the motor mount bracket on my 69 Dart. NOT very attactive, but functional.
 
dartley said:
I don't want to speak for anyone else, but I don't understand your exact problem. Is it that you want to use the fitting and tube that came with the pump on the pressure side, but mate it with the pump end of your new hose?
Click to expand...


Yes, I want to use the fitting and tube that came with the pump because the Hydraulic places in my town find it extremely difficult to find a piece that will work for me.

When I first mocked up the pump, it looked like the tubing would clear no problem, and the house the Hydraulic shop made would fit perfectly. I stupidly didn't mock up the pump in the correct position (where it would be with a belt on it).
 
DARTFREAK said:
You will have to carfully bend it by hand to get a tighter 90 degree than you could with a tubing bender. You might even fill the tube with sand while bending it to prevent the tube from kinking. I made a "J" shaped fitting to clear the motor mount bracket on my 69 Dart. NOT very attactive, but functional.
Click to expand...


Sand, eh? Never thought of that! So, in order to get the tighter "j" bend, what did you use? Something like a small jack handle?
 
Judge Mills said:
Yes, I want to use the fitting and tube that came with the pump because the Hydraulic places in my town find it extremely difficult to find a piece that will work for me.

When I first mocked up the pump, it looked like the tubing would clear no problem, and the house the Hydraulic shop made would fit perfectly. I stupidly didn't mock up the pump in the correct position (where it would be with a belt on it).
Click to expand...

Can you get a slightly different length belt then ... 1/2" one way or the other might be all you need to get it to fit.
 
dartley said:
Can you get a slightly different length belt then ... 1/2" one way or the other might be all you need to get it to fit.
Click to expand...


This may be the route I go.... Will have to wait a week or two... I work nights, and my next weekend will be filled with family in town :cheers:
 
bump: Anyone ever do the slant six/V8 swap? Did you run into this problem? Can I see how your pump's lines are routed? Fishing for answers. Thanks in advance!
 
Judge Mills said:
bump: Anyone ever do the slant six/V8 swap? Did you run into this problem? Can I see how your pump's lines are routed? Fishing for answers. Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...



when i did the swap i used the pump that was on the slant. just changed the brackets to v-8 brackets. 73-up used the saginaw pump. 73-up also used the spool mounts so that line didn't interfere at all like that.
 
I had the same problem. I dont see you bending that with out ....ing it up. I have a 67barracuda with the same k member. they didnt put those pumps on those cars. I ended up putting the outher stile pump from a 67 that has the hose conection on top.If you find out how to plum it up id like to know how to. those older stile pumps are as scarce as hens teeth.I do have a set of mounting brackets on anouther car that mount the pump up high enough to clear but i dont know what the brackets came from. good luck Im going to be watching this thread to see what i can learn.
 
cudaman51 said:
I had the same problem. I dont see you bending that with out ....ing it up. I have a 67barracuda with the same k member. they didnt put those pumps on those cars. I ended up putting the outher stile pump from a 67 that has the hose conection on top.If you find out how to plum it up id like to know how to. those older stile pumps are as scarce as hens teeth.I do have a set of mounting brackets on anouther car that mount the pump up high enough to clear but i dont know what the brackets came from. good luck Im going to be watching this thread to see what i can learn.
Click to expand...

Oh man.... Well I still have my old pump.. I'm not sure where I'd find brackets, though? I'll keep this place informed as I go... I won't be able to work on it until next Monday....

abodyjoe said:
when i did the swap i used the pump that was on the slant. just changed the brackets to v-8 brackets. 73-up used the saginaw pump. 73-up also used the spool mounts so that line didn't interfere at all like that.
Click to expand...

Time to trade my 71' for a 73' :D
 
Judge Mills said:
Oh man.... Well I still have my old pump.. I'm not sure where I'd find brackets, though? I'll keep this place informed as I go... I won't be able to work on it until next Monday....



Time to trade my 71' for a 73' :D
Click to expand...


put a want ad up on all the mopar sites. you need the ps brackets from a 70-72 a-body with a 318/340. they are out there.


or you can just stick a 73 k-frame in it..lol
 
abodyjoe said:
when i did the swap i used the pump that was on the slant. just changed the brackets to v-8 brackets. 73-up used the saginaw pump. 73-up also used the spool mounts so that line didn't interfere at all like that.
Click to expand...

Not all did. I have a 75 /6 Valiant with orig equip federal pump. I had a 75 Dart Sport /6 that had a Saginaw pump.
 
abodyjoe said:
what about the v-8 cars. thats what i'm talking about.
Click to expand...

Did not realize that you meant V8s specifically - thought the OP was talking /6 to V8 swicheroo, sorry. So no I don't know about the v8s, but I know enough about Mopar to know that you can really never say either never or always on just about anything ;-)
 
dartley said:
Did not realize that you meant V8s specifically - thought the OP was talking /6 to V8 swicheroo, sorry. So no I don't know about the v8s, but I know enough about Mopar to know that you can really never say either never or always on just about anything ;-)
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i should have made it more clear i guess. but yes the 72-down v-8 mounts don't allow the use of a saganaw pump without some kind of modification. its all because of where the high pressure line exits the pump. thats his problem now. going to a v-8 with the older k-frame and saginaw pump.
 
abodyjoe said:
i should have made it more clear i guess. but yes the 72-down v-8 mounts don't allow the use of a saganaw pump without some kind of modification. its all because of where the high pressure line exits the pump. thats his problem now. going to a v-8 with the older k-frame and saginaw pump.
Click to expand...

Okay, so if I understand you correctly, then I know that is not quite true. On another topic I posted my setup - here it is again:

1. 72 340
2. converted to pwr from mnl
3. sag pmp from a late 80s Dip
4. Mounting brackets from same Dip
5. pwr steering gear from 71 dart
6. hose ? can't remember, but I had to rebend it a bit.
... the pressure hose that will work with above setup can be gotten from

http://www.bouchillonperformance.com/BPEPowerSteering.asp

... but in my case the feed to the pump is the wrong connection type. I have the hose and it matches perfectly, but I never got around to seeing if I could have the fitting changed.
 
If you go to a junkyard and look at van with a v8, you should find that the brackets make the pupmp sit up higher than the typical brackets such as BPE or stock ones.
If you go to a parts store that has an Edelmann catalog, it has a section in it that shows hose numbers by hose ends, it's after the application section. IIRC, for my car there were only 3 hoses that had the ends that my application used.
 
dartley said:
Okay, so if I understand you correctly, then I know that is not quite true. On another topic I posted my setup - here it is again:

1. 72 340
2. converted to pwr from mnl
3. sag pmp from a late 80s Dip
4. Mounting brackets from same Dip
5. pwr steering gear from 71 dart
6. hose ? can't remember, but I had to rebend it a bit.
... the pressure hose that will work with above setup can be gotten from

http://www.bouchillonperformance.com/BPEPowerSteering.asp

... but in my case the feed to the pump is the wrong connection type. I have the hose and it matches perfectly, but I never got around to seeing if I could have the fitting changed.
Click to expand...


what? not sure what the heck your trying to say.

if you use stock a-body parts the saganaw pump high pressure line will hit the motor mounts on the k-frame on a 72-down k-frame. the saganaw high pressure line will clear the 73-up spool mount k-frame.
now if you use other body pumps and brackets i don't know. i'm talking stock a-body stuff here.
 
following you link. it looks like they may have made a custome hose to fit. that would be cool.


Part # : BPE352840
This Line Will Fit:
1969-1972 A, B, & C Bodies
1970-1973 E Bodies
w/Saginaw P.S. Pumps
Can Be Used On All:
A Engines
NOTE: Can Be Used On 1962-1969 B/RB/Hemi Engines w/BPE9016F
Part # : BPE352840
Premade Saginaw Power Steering Line / Hose
Price: $33.53
Quantity:
Email a Friend
 
abodyjoe said:
what? not sure what the heck your trying to say.

if you use stock a-body parts the saganaw pump high pressure line will hit the motor mounts on the k-frame on a 72-down k-frame. the saganaw high pressure line will clear the 73-up spool mount k-frame.
now if you use other body pumps and brackets i don't know. i'm talking stock a-body stuff here.
Click to expand...

I'm obviously not talking all stock, and thus my answer was twofold in meaning:
1) To answer you that it IS possible to use the 72 K and sag pump
2) To help the OP with as many possible solutions as possible.
 
abodyjoe said:
following you link. it looks like they may have made a custome hose to fit. that would be cool.


Part # : BPE352840
This Line Will Fit:
1969-1972 A, B, & C Bodies
1970-1973 E Bodies
w/Saginaw P.S. Pumps
Can Be Used On All:
A Engines
NOTE: Can Be Used On 1962-1969 B/RB/Hemi Engines w/BPE9016F
Part # : BPE352840
Premade Saginaw Power Steering Line / Hose
Price: $33.53
Quantity:
Email a Friend
Click to expand...

I don't know if it is custom or not. I saw it first on another fella's 70-71 Duster at a local show and then got the one from the company I linked to. Prolly if I just got an older sag pump it would have the matching fittment.
 
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