STARTING A RESTORATION BUSINESS

-
WAYNE0

WAYNE0

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2019
Messages
811
Reaction score
794
Location
milton pa.
Has anyone started a business from scratch ? Did you get financial help ? Business loan ? Ive been told you can get government help. Here is my situation. I have been doing body & paint for about 20 plus years part time. I have been doing it full time for 3 years. When i was doing it part time i did out of my dads garage. When he past away we had to sell his house & garage. I bought a house with a 16x30 garage. I have been doing body & paint in it for 3 years. I hate painting in the same bay that i do welding, cutting & body work. I am swamped with work. It is awesome ! I would love to expand & start a business. There is so much more i can do if i had the room. I have turned down complete restorations because i dont have the room. I have heard go get a loan, go get a business loan. My credit is **** only because its been a long time since i have had a loan or credit card. Ive always paid cash for things. I cant show any income because most of the people pay me in cash. As of right now i have 10 people in waiting just for body & paint. I know there are people out there that would love to have my problem. For those of you that have done alot of cutting , grinding, welding & body work in a one bay garage & then try to do a nice paint job know what i am talking about.
 
Keep your overhead as low as you can. Have you looked for a bigger place you might be able to rent?
Keep in mind you will have rent and all the utility's to cover.
Dont forget about security. Crime in on the rise.
Do you have room to build where you are?
 
Subscribed...... Night and day difference between your current business model and a legit business as an entity by the SCC. Both can earn a living. But your current model does not cover the true cost of everything needed to run a legal entity.....

With that being said getting a small business loan is next to impossible. It all comes down to collateral and your earning power. A bad credit rating and no real history in regards to employment (you are earning a living but it's not legitimate according to the taxpayers and the IRS) is stacking the deck against you.

You basically need the cashflow and be liquid. It will be interesting to see what others say on the topic but if you are looking for a Bank or SBA to help you expect it to fall mostly on deaf ears....

JW
 
SLOPAR72 said:
Subscribed...... Night and day difference between your current business model and a legit business as an entity by the SCC. Both can earn a living. But your current model does not cover the true cost of everything needed to run a legal entity.....

With that being said getting a small business loan is next to impossible. It all comes down to collateral and your earning power. A bad credit rating and no real history in regards to employment (you are earning a living but it's not legitimate according to the taxpayers and the IRS) is stacking the deck against you.

You basically need the cashflow and be liquid. It will be interesting to see what others say on the topic but if you are looking for a Bank or SBA to help you expect it to fall mostly on deaf ears....

JW
Click to expand...
Spot on here. You are better of flying under the radar if you can keep it up.
You go legit, do not forget the epa cost. Paint booth. hazmat disposal, insurance.
any loan you get will be at least a 10/10.
10 year payoff and 10 percent interest. At best
 
I have no problems going LEGIT paying a loan, insurance & what ever else i need. I have the room to expand my garage. The lady that lives beside me has a 30x 60 garage "as a guess" that was her late husbands body shop. He pasted away 10 years ago. She is no sure if she wants to sell yet. I have friend who teaches auto restoration at a tech school & he keeps me informed about the laws, the dos & donts. I have checked it out & in PA. you are aloud to do 2 full paint jobs a year with the right exhaust & intake filters. I do alot more than that. Also i am in a commercial zone. My credit sucks because i havent had a credit card or a loan for many many years. Ive always saved up the money & paid cash.
 
Last edited:
Would the lady next door rent to you?
That would be great deal.
 
Yep, rent the neighbor lady's garage. You can carry on her husband's dream.

So handy right next door, just extending your service without breaking the bank.

And the neighbor lady gets a few bucks to help her get by and be able to hire the lawn mowed.

Win, Win . . .

☆☆☆☆☆
 
dowboy1970 said:
Would the lady next door rent to you?
That would be great deal.
Click to expand...
I got to know her late husband brother "i bought the house he grew up in " & he told me that she thought about it & when she found out what the insurance was going to be it scared her. Thats all the further it went. I havent had the chance to talk to her. She is still working & long hours. She wants to retire late this year & im hoping to come up with enough money to offer. She wanted to retire last year but she paid to have some trees cut down & that out her in a hole. Hear is the deal with her garage it comes with a 30x30 garage also & will not separate them.
 
Do you have a full time job now? How old are you? Do you have health benefits? Do you have any money set aside for retirement? At a older age it would be better if you had a secure income and did body work as a side business, even restoration just doing body and paint with no mechanical's
There is a lot at stake going legit.
 
That is my thoughts also.
George Jets said:
Yep, rent the neighbor lady's garage. You can carry on her husband's dream.

So handy right next door, just extending your service without breaking the bank.

And the neighbor lady gets a few bucks to help her get by and be able to hire the lawn mowed.

Win, Win . . .

☆☆☆☆☆
Click to expand...
I just dont know what to offer & if i can get it. Ill put my house if need be. By the way he late husband was a big mopar man.
 
No the
Steve welder said:
Do you have a full time job now? How old are you? Do you have health benefits? Do you have any money set aside for retirement? At a older age it would be better if you had a secure income and did body work as a side business, even restoration just doing body and paint with no mechanical's
There is a lot at stake going legit.
Click to expand...
no the place i was working at went out of business i did body & paint part time while working. Im 52 I several friends who own there own business & they cab steer me when it comes to any kind of insurances. Im going to keep doing it for as long as i can. I love doing it.
 
What you're doing is pretty dangerous. No business license....I'm "guessing" no insurance.

I have a friend who is......meh, I guess about 10 years older than I so that puts him bout 65-67 and he's been doing work in this county like you for well......purt near all his life. Everybody knows him. He does really decent work. Builds hot rod street motors....does paint and body work....does entire restorations from time to time. Of course he's slowing down a little.

Back in 2019 his shop caught fire and burned TO THE GROUND, with several high end cars and engine builds and his own personal car. A really NICE Chevelle. Lost everything. No insurance, no business license. It was sad, really. Then his daughter gets on Facebook cryin about how he lost everything and askin everybody to donate to a gofundme. Now, I like the guy. He's a decent sort. BUt he's one of these that's never filed taxes, thinks the gubmint is the enemy......I can't disagree there.......but does everything he can to not contribute to the local or federal gubmint....INCLUDING pulling a trailer behind his everyday ride so the cops can't see his expired tag.

I kinda got of on a tangent there. Not sayin any of that is true about you, but you REALLY need to be very careful running an illegitimate business. Anything can happen.

I take in maybe three projects in maybe five years, but I don't do paint and bodywork or whole car jobs and I don't pull or install engines. In fact, I'm down to my last job I'm ever going to do here now. The risk is just too great with someone else's property.
 
RustyRatRod said:
What you're doing is pretty dangerous. No business license....I'm "guessing" no insurance.

I have a friend who is......meh, I guess about 10 years older than I so that puts him bout 65-67 and he's been doing work in this county like you for well......purt near all his life. Everybody knows him. He does really decent work. Builds hot rod street motors....does paint and body work....does entire restorations from time to time. Of course he's slowing down a little.

Back in 2019 his shop caught fire and burned TO THE GROUND, with several high end cars and engine builds and his own personal car. A really NICE Chevelle. Lost everything. No insurance, no business license. It was sad, really. Then his daughter gets on Facebook cryin about how he lost everything and askin everybody to donate to a gofundme. Now, I like the guy. He's a decent sort. BUt he's one of these that's never filed taxes, thinks the gubmint is the enemy......I can't disagree there.......but does everything he can to not contribute to the local or federal gubmint....INCLUDING pulling a trailer behind his everyday ride so the cops can't see his expired tag.

I kinda got of on a tangent there. Not sayin any of that is true about you, but you REALLY need to be very careful running an illegitimate business. Anything can happen.

I take in maybe three projects in maybe five years, but I don't do paint and bodywork or whole car jobs and I don't pull or install engines. In fact, I'm down to my last job I'm ever going to do here now. The risk is just too great with someone else's property.
Click to expand...
Lots of good points here.
Insurance is a must and a LLC is probably a really good idea.
With that being said, You call it a paint and body shop, you are opening up a really big can of worms. You will have to really up your production to cover the cost and will have to hire help to cover your production.
Take a hard look at it.
I was in a supervisor roll for many years and would rather just work by myself these days as my worst problems were always employee related.
 
Offer the neighbor lady 500 a month for use of her garage. Just use it for over flow work and in progress storage as you are waiting for parts.

Do the main down and dirty work at your home garage. Keep things neat and picked up outside and at your neighbors place.

Do an overkill on fire prevention, don't have an accident waiting for a place to happen.

Keep doing what your doing.

Yes I started my own body shop business In my mid 20s on pretty much no money but owning a garage and shed. Had a good local bank to help bridge the lean times. Made a success out of it.

66 now and only worked out 4 years of my adult life, have always been self employed. Have enjoyed multiple different self employed careers and it all started with my autobody business. Having a good shop and storage shed were useful resources to have as the next businesses came to be.

With the economy and political scene all screwed up right now, being your own boss is golden.

Make a plan, and work the plan, follow your gut, you will do fine.

Things change with time. You are on your feet now and as things change you can change, thinking of your one foot on the path with your body shop.

☆☆☆☆☆

Picture 28.jpg
 
WAYNE0 said:
No the

no the place i was working at went out of business i did body & paint part time while working. Im 52 I several friends who own there own business & they cab steer me when it comes to any kind of insurances. Im going to keep doing it for as long as i can. I love doing it.
Click to expand...
You're flying under the radar now, keeping that in mind, sure you could use a bigger place but going legit opening a business you would have to check local zoning laws as to were you could open a body shop.
Cover your backside always, prepare for the future, 52 is still young but not that young and you yourself only know your own situation.
I have a guy I know well who is a excellent carpenter, he's been in the business all his life, built custom homes, owns rentals and is comfortable, except he has no health insurance.
The guy is a bull, in great shape at about 60 but he recently took a job as a carpenter, the salary was low but the benefits were great.
He took the job because as he aged he knew him and his wife needed more stability plus benefits
Still does work on weekends ....... Loving what you do is important, putting money in your pocket and keeping it there is also important
 
WAYNE0 said:
Has anyone started a business from scratch ? Did you get financial help ? Business loan ? Ive been told you can get government help. Here is my situation. I have been doing body & paint for about 20 plus years part time. I have been doing it full time for 3 years. When i was doing it part time i did out of my dads garage. When he past away we had to sell his house & garage. I bought a house with a 16x30 garage. I have been doing body & paint in it for 3 years. I hate painting in the same bay that i do welding, cutting & body work. I am swamped with work. It is awesome ! I would love to expand & start a business. There is so much more i can do if i had the room. I have turned down complete restorations because i dont have the room. I have heard go get a loan, go get a business loan. My credit is **** only because its been a long time since i have had a loan or credit card. Ive always paid cash for things. I cant show any income because most of the people pay me in cash. As of right now i have 10 people in waiting just for body & paint. I know there are people out there that would love to have my problem. For those of you that have done alot of cutting , grinding, welding & body work in a one bay garage & then try to do a nice paint job know what i am talking about.
Click to expand...
Contact SCORE, Service Corp of Retired Executives. They will assist you for free when starting a business. They know what they are doing.
 
You want to carry the LEAST amount of debt you need to to get up and running and pay that **** off pronto. Debt is a business (and personal) killer.

Get a written price structure because your prices MUST go up or you’ll be working for poverty wages. Taxes are a business killer. Never get behind on those because if the IRS gets ahold of you they won’t let go. Keep the taxes clean and legit.

Forget you have family and friends who want the buddy deal. Throw anyone and everyone out of the shop who asks for sponsorship. It’s a loser every time. Sponsor no one until you get on solid ground and the ONLY then when YOU pick the guy you want to sponsor. Someone with a winning record. Talk to the guys already sponsoring him and see how he does.

Pay your taxes. All of them. On time.

Minimum debt. Don’t use the government for loans of any kind. The government has the worst plans for loans. Dancing with the devil will get you burned.

Make sure you get ALL the pertinent licenses and all that. Do your research before moving forward.

Use an LLC and whatever you do, hire a competent lawyer to help you set up the business so you don’t miss something. A quality business lawyer (as slimy as some are) are worth their weight in gold.

Pay your damn taxes. Pay cash for tools and such whenever possible. Banks ain’t your friends either.

Make sure you are insured for every kind of loss you can imagine. And then get a balloon policy to cover anything else. This is where a good lawyer can save your bacon. Everyone wants to sue at the drop of a hat for anything so you have to cover your *** first.

Don’t work for free or a discount. No one else is willing to punch a clock and take less. Charge MORE and and have fewer customers. That’s better than charging less and having a bunch of horrible customers and they are out there.

The customer has ZERO loyalty. They will **** on you so fast your head will fall off. They will trash you on any platform they can. Be choosy in who you work for.

The customer isn’t always right. In fact, most of the time they are wrong. Whatever you do, do NOT do something you wouldn’t do, even if the customer walks. Let them go. They are more trouble than they are worth.

One quick example of this would be building an engine with a single turbo and using the customer chosen 10.75:1 compression ratio. Even after making him sign the paperwork that this was wrong and he would be wholly responsible for ANY and ALL damages related to failures from that compression ratio, he went to court and the judge ruled in favor of the customer. The screw ball judge said the engine builder is still responsible because he should have known better and never built the engine. See my comments on the customer isn’t always right.

Opening a business, especially in THIS industry is a quick way to go broke in a hurry. Protect yourself first. Be picky. Build the business slowly. Rapid growth is a sure fire killer.

Make sure your prices are high enough to cover the inevitable customer (or even one of yours) screw ups because it will happen. Anything goods or services that come with any warranty, expressed or implied has to have that money built into EVERY job. One job going sideways can send you to the port house, where you will be happy to be pecking **** with the chickens.

I’m sure I’ll think of more but be careful.
 
Don't skimp on the insurance. One of my wife nephews bought a cabinet door business from her brother, going business made a ton of money. Recently after one of the Louisiana storms his insurance raised his rates after paying for his damage. He thought it was too much so he cancelled everything except Liability. You guessed it 3 weeks the shop caught fire in the middle of the night and burned to the ground. All of his machines including 2 CNC machines and multi thousands of stock all burned. Absolutely nothing was saved. He had no insurance and it will cost him much to get going again. Not only that he still owes his mortgage for building and equipment he no longer has. Bad situation!!
 
Life is a gamble any way you look at it. If you lead your own dream, everything else follows in your wake.

Chart the course and get busy living, you will be surprised at the people that see your efforts and will rise to the occation to help make things happen.
It's a 2 way street so keep looking for ways to return the favor.

If you don't take the initial action, nothing happens and nothing will follow.

Follow your dreams, especially if you love doing them.

☆☆☆☆☆

20181027_081425.jpg
 
Last edited:
I started an auto repair business 8 years ago. Im in Canada,different rules to some extent. Cash jobs need to go on the books. Same deal for everyone. Can only hide so much, and not worth the trouble. Insurance,tax numbers and a good accountant are all priorities. If there is a lineup of people waiting, you arent charging enough.
58 in june, a couple more years and im picking favorites after that.
 
RustyRatRod said:
What you're doing is pretty dangerous. No business license....I'm "guessing" no insurance.

I have a friend who is......meh, I guess about 10 years older than I so that puts him bout 65-67 and he's been doing work in this county like you for well......purt near all his life. Everybody knows him. He does really decent work. Builds hot rod street motors....does paint and body work....does entire restorations from time to time. Of course he's slowing down a little.

Back in 2019 his shop caught fire and burned TO THE GROUND, with several high end cars and engine builds and his own personal car. A really NICE Chevelle. Lost everything. No insurance, no business license. It was sad, really. Then his daughter gets on Facebook cryin about how he lost everything and askin everybody to donate to a gofundme. Now, I like the guy. He's a decent sort. BUt he's one of these that's never filed taxes, thinks the gubmint is the enemy......I can't disagree there.......but does everything he can to not contribute to the local or federal gubmint....INCLUDING pulling a trailer behind his everyday ride so the cops can't see his expired tag.

I kinda got of on a tangent there. Not sayin any of that is true about you, but you REALLY need to be very careful running an illegitimate business. Anything can happen.

I take in maybe three projects in maybe five years, but I don't do paint and bodywork or whole car jobs and I don't pull or install engines. In fact, I'm down to my last job I'm ever going to do here now. The risk is just too great with someone else's property.
Click to expand...
That is just one of many reasons i want to go ligit
 
My paint jobs start at $7,000 thats just the outside no jambs & depending on color also thats no sanding & buffing
 
WAYNE0 said:
That is just one of many reasons i want to go ligit
Click to expand...
I think it's a wise decision......but I don't envy you with all the taxes you're going to have to put up with. I wish you luck my friend.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top