Stopping rust under paint?

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DadGum_Teen

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I noticed a few small bubbles forming underneath the paint of the duster... great. rust.

It is in the same spot I had trouble with before, right behind the rear wheel in the bottom corner of the fender. Would I just find where the metal is exposed and spray it with a dense paint or a rust preventer? Or is there a better step to take? Thanks for any advice.
 
If you already have bubbles chances are you are looking at a repaint. Gonna have to cut out the rust and weld in new clean metal or you will continue to have the same problem that apparently has happened before.
 
I got the same issues on my Duster Bubbling around the rear drivers lower quarter panel. and behind the front fender drivers side. I am going to order full quarter skins from AMD and get a new front fender. I want to eliminate the rust out completely. For however much it will end up costing me to do this, it will be worth it in the long run because I will get it all removed and hopefully I will never have to deal with the damn rust again.
 
The guy who painted the car cut/welded the previous rust spots, but I guess its a wasted effort if he doesn't coat the back of the metal with anything :???:

I'm just hoping theres hope to stop it from getting any worse by use of a rust converter/air tight coating. Any recommendations?
 
The guy who painted the car cut/welded the previous rust spots, but I guess its a wasted effort if he doesn't coat the back of the metal with anything :???:

I'm just hoping theres hope to stop it from getting any worse by use of a rust converter/air tight coating. Any recommendations?

Im in the same boat as you boys and I plan to cut out the bad and replace it, then paint.
 
The guy who painted the car cut/welded the previous rust spots, but I guess its a wasted effort if he doesn't coat the back of the metal with anything :???:

I'm just hoping theres hope to stop it from getting any worse by use of a rust converter/air tight coating. Any recommendations?
the problem is he didn't cut out and weld in patches far enough, yha gotta cut out a few IN (or more) around not just the area thats showing.
 
He may have gotten the rust, but didn't properly clean/seal the area, letting rust start before the paint was applied. Rust is like a virus, not just the way it spreads, but the way it starts, too. Painting over even a small amount of rust is like putting on a condom after you get an STD, too little, too late. Rust creates it's own oxygen as it forms. there are a lot of rust converters on the market, but the best bet is to remove the infected area and clean it and seal it ASAP. We get flash-rust on metal parts here at work in as little as 3 minutes (we use a phosphate and etching compound before paint). I'm not saying you have to paint your car within 3 minutes of grinding, just that rust is an evil, evil thing. If I sound bitter, it's because I have been there too - my daily driver has more cubic inches of bondo than displacement!
 
Rust is like cancer,it will spread if the affected part is not eliminated.Look inside the trunk where the quarter is to see how far the rust has gone.The reason why this area rusts is because moisture and water seeps either through the marker lights or a bad trunk lid seal and its really got nowhere to drain and just sits in there until it starts to rust.You may be able to fix that area and blend it in to the original paint.Ive seen lots of very good undetectable blends in paint.Hope it works out =)
 
Hi

Last year as a test I took a very rusty shock mount that I soaked it in rust remover product and than painted in a cheap rust paint and left it outside for a year and the rust has never returned.

So does this mean that technology can help us remove or stop rust or was this test just a fluck.

Rick
 
Hi

Last year as a test I took a very rusty shock mount that I soaked it in rust remover product and than painted in a cheap rust paint and left it outside for a year and the rust has never returned.

So does this mean that technology can help us remove or stop rust or was this test just a fluck.

Rick
Ive had good luck with rust removers and rust preventing paint.The problem with auto body panels such as fenders ,and quarters is that the rust hides,like inbetween,the door jam inbetween the lower fender (where leafs get stuck and get wet) the fenderwells , and sometimes theres no way to exactly tell how far it has spread unless you remove the fender or cut out the entire panel.=\
I did a patch panel on a 69 Chevelle once on the lower quarter on both sides,1 year later the paint started bubbling right above where the new panels were.The owner didnt want to replace both quarters,which were both pretty pricey.
 
Sounds like it needs to be cut out again if I don't want to take chances.

If I were to patch it, what steps are needed to prep the area for a nice blend? I wouldn't spray it myself, but I'd rather do everything I can manage so I'm not spending big bucks on labor. (If I were to go this route)

And it looks like it can be a common problem from a few of the comments... I'm still slowly learning some of the pains these cars come with ](*,)
 
If the patches are not butt welded, epoxy primed and painted inside an out they will rust out within 2 years.Places where you can't get paint in with a gun brush it in you won't see it anyway.
 
25 years ago I had a quarter sized rust bubble on the front bottom passenger door on my Signet, today it is the size of a 1/2 dollar, Before the winter hits I will cut it out and weld in a piece of sheet metal and than paint the bottom inside of the door with POR 15. 25 years ago I brushed POR 15 on the entire undercarriage, front end and rear housing. I bought this beautiful black Signet completely stock and 62,000 original miles 25 years ago and within six days I installed a 340, 727, 8 3/4, fuel cell and went racing on Sunday, anything is feasible if you love what you want. When it comes to rust have a professional do it once and do it right.
 
I have had good luck with some rust converters and other primers. Many guys swear by POR-15, but it is ~$40/qt. I am currently using Rust Destroyer, which is about half that. Some primers claim to etch the metal and bond to even aluminum and galvanized steel. On the lower frame of a trailer which was totally covered in surface rust, I wire-brushed away all loose rust and sprayed Rustoleum Rusty-metal primer, then their white top coat. It looks like new and no rust in 3 years, even though a quickie job. On my Dart I try to wire brush and sand down to clean metal and prime right away, but it takes a lot of time.

Whenever you pull a door panel, vacuum, scrap, and blow out all the crevices, then spray converter primer everywhere. The top of the doors inside is usually all surface rust because it looks like the factory stopped painting about half-way up. Ditto for the wheel well and inner fender crevices you can reach from the trunk and when you have the rear seat out.

Re patching rust-thrus around wheel wells, many people suggest welding in patches, but that takes tools and skill. If you can't clean and seal the inside of the welds, it may rust again. Some people claim a fiberglass repair will last as long, and is sure easier. Seems sound. The biggest problem is most people don't prep well and just slap on Bondo (like I did as a dumb kid). You need fiberglass, like woven mat for large areas or at least Bondo Glass for small, and cut away to sound metal and clean and prime. That is what I am trying on some spots around my Dart rear wheels. I'll let you know how it lasts in a decade.

Finally, you often see rust on sheet-metal near exhaust pipes. That is because the paint burned away. Most paints are only good to 200F. Use special 500F or 1200F spray paints at auto parts. I like Rustoleum's cans because you can spray at any angle.
 
All of our cars will rust eventually. Rust bubbles are holes.
The best way i found out how to fix it is to cut it out completely at least 3" around the area and weld in new clean metal. Rust converters and or POR 15 is a great way to stifle it in it's tracks from behind after it's fixed. If you don't back it up with something, it will come back to haunt you.
Where a lot of people go wrong is to not cut out enough!
Then afterward, after it's painted, wash it a lot and avoid high moisture driving such as spring, fall, and winter.
Try to keep the car garaged as much as you can.
I've never seen a true rust free car from the '60s and '70s. Even survivors.
Survivors have even minimal rust.
That's the facts when you are dealing with 40 year old cars.
I hope i helped!
Just my 2 cents.
Tom.
 
hah,i remember my first rust hole repair as a 12 yr old kid.I covered the hole with duct tape and spread wall spackling over it,sanded it and sprayed it with cheap Kmart primer.:toothy10:
 
hah,i remember my first rust hole repair as a 12 yr old kid.I covered the hole with duct tape and spread wall spackling over it,sanded it and sprayed it with cheap Kmart primer.:toothy10:

Do you remember which brand of wall spackling workes best? I may have to try that! LOL!
 
Sounds like it needs to be cut out again if I don't want to take chances.

If I were to patch it, what steps are needed to prep the area for a nice blend? I wouldn't spray it myself, but I'd rather do everything I can manage so I'm not spending big bucks on labor. (If I were to go this route)

And it looks like it can be a common problem from a few of the comments... I'm still slowly learning some of the pains these cars come with ](*,)

it's only common with body guys who didn't treat the weld properly
 
Bubbles in the top coat seem to come from a void under the paint, which can be due to either painting over raw rust or pockets of solvent. If the rust is sound and converted to black, it has never bubbled on me.

To avoid solvent bubbles, allow ample drying time. That is an advantage us hobbyist have over body shops. I might prime and wait ~1 year before I get to the top coat (unintentional). In one case, I painted over Rust Destroyer primer and the top coat wrinkled a few places. It said to wait 3 days and I allowed 4 days, but the primer didn't dry enough in some corners (aluminum trim on trailer).

I always prime metal before applying fiberglass or bondo. Some apply it over bare metal or even rust, but I expect that will allow rust since water can migrate through fiberglass.

Re feathering in the repair, that is an art. I have seen real shoddy jobs, even from body shops, especially around rocker panels where they don't want to stoop. You must apply several layers of Bondo. First beat the metal as close to shape as possible, so you use minimal filler. That is an art. For rust-thrus, you already have the shape, but ideally would beat the surface down slightly so the filler is flush. Instead, I just extend it far out to feather it in. Never leave metal sticking up past the final surface or you will never be able to sand it flat. You may need to tap metal down after a few filler coats when you find you are sanding down to metal.

Plastic spreaders work for small areas up to ~3" across, but for larger areas they flex too much. I use ~12" wide metal drywall blade to smooth large areas. Having worked with drywall mud is a big step towards Bondo work. Once, I re-did a dented door which turned out wavy in the first repair. I used a 1" wide steel strip to spread the Bondo flat across the whole door. It looks great now and the paint hasn't cracked in 15 years. The final word is the reflection of parking lot lines in a gloss clear-coat.

Bondo claims 5 minute working time, but I get ~2 min after mixing and that is after chilling it. Count on 2-3 swipes with the tool, then don't touch. Lucky if you can work on 2 spots with one batch. Clean your tools quicky with acetone. I mix it on plastic lids. After 10 minutes, use a wood rasp (like wood plane but cheese-grate bottom) to grossly shape the surface. If not, you will sand forever. I usually make ~4 passes w/ Bondo, sanding between w/ 240 grit and don't need the grate after the 2nd pass. To fill remaining pits or glitches, use the red laquer filler that comes in tubes. Some people spray black paint on in-between Bondo coats and sand to check flatness. I shine a light across the surface and run my fingers over the surface.

Re feathering in, all edges of the Bondo should appear translucent, gradually changing from opaque to nothing over 1/4" or more. If not, you have will have a visible edge that will show in a gloss top coat.
 
If you want to protect against rust both inside and out try this. Raybucks sells a rust converter/antirust paint in several colors...about 50 bucks a gallon and works good my familys used it for years on our trucks and equipment with no problems, also invest in a rust box (not the actuall name) the are sold by jcwhitnety for a little ove 100 and hook up to your car battery (i dont know why) and basically use sacrificcial pieces of metal to redivert the electrons or what ever they are called so the replaceable box that comes with it rusts out and not your car. For actually used these from the factory for a couple years to make up for the cheap metal in the explorers and they work great.
heres some links
http://www.jcwhitney.com/electro-sh...corrosion-inhibitor/p2000770.jcwx?filterid=j1
http://raybuck.com/c-54781-zero-rust-metal-coating.html

good luck
 
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