Strut Rod Question

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superdart

superdart

Shade Tree Tinker Gnome.....
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I see that Firm Feel sells adjustable strut rods, with the explanation that they are necessary to properly align the front end when thicker rod bushings are used.

Long ago (well, several years ago) I put in new Poly Mopar rod bushings, and they were definitely thicker than stock. So thick that I was unable to reinstall the cotter key in front of the nut on the K-member end.

If this is the case, should I be looking at these adjustable rods? Are the thicker bushings pushing my LCAs out of alignment?

http://www.firmfeel.com/adjstrut.htm

adjstrut.jpg
 
I see, they cant make the correct bushings which would not cost too much (for them) so they want to sell you a set of overpriced adjustable strut rods. What a brilliant idea. They are offering you an expensive solution to a problem that they cold solve cheaply. [have you ever heard of a lathe] I cant understand why someone cant make these bushings for A bodies. Are they that complicated? Hell, it's a hockey puck with a hole in it for chrissake! [I took a belt sander to mine to narrow them]
(jus get yours milled to fit; cheaper)
 
I haven't done a lot of studying on this issue. I have heard it was to make sure your LCA is square (perpendicular?) to the K frame to keep it from walking back and forth during suspension movement. I think it's a bigger issue with poly LCA's bushings and strut rods.
I'm very willing to be schooled on this if it doesn't involve a side course in capitalism and corporate greed.
 
I shaved a set down on a bench grinder until they matched the stock ones. If you center 2 of them on one of the sleeves that they slide over & then carefully grind, cut or sand them down until they are even at both ends with the sleeve you will have the 2 inner ones that you need. This link may help: http://users.erols.com/mathewg/bushings.html. The outside or front one does not matter but you will need to shave the inner one to keep the lower control arm pivot where it should be. If not you will have alignment problems & can burn up the LCA bushing prematurely. Moog makes a kit that they claim fixes this problem, part # K7040. We used the shaved set on a friend's car & I am trying the Moog set on my car.
I also sent Energy Suspension an email asking why they would make something & sell it for a car it is not meant for instead of just making the right part but surprisingly never heard anything back so they are now off of my "companies to buy from" list. How hard would it be to make the right part? It is funny how they make adjustable strut rods & point out the problem but no one makes the right bushings. I guess $195 is better for business than $18.
 
phish1270 said:
I shaved a set down on a bench grinder until they matched the stock ones. If you center 2 of them on one of the sleeves that they slide over & then carefully grind, cut or sand them down until they are even at both ends with the sleeve you will have the 2 inner ones that you need. This link may help: http://users.erols.com/mathewg/bushings.html. The outside or front one does not matter but you will need to shave the inner one to keep the lower control arm pivot where it should be. If not you will have alignment problems & can burn up the LCA bushing prematurely. Moog makes a kit that they claim fixes this problem, part # K7040. We used the shaved set on a friend's car & I am trying the Moog set on my car.
I also sent Energy Suspension an email asking why they would make something & sell it for a car it is not meant for instead of just making the right part but surprisingly never heard anything back so they are now off of my "companies to buy from" list. How hard would it be to make the right part? It is funny how they make adjustable strut rods & point out the problem but no one makes the right bushings. I guess $195 is better for business than $18.
Click to expand...

That's my picture of all the bushings laid out that Matt used. I did this about 14 years ago to my car and used Moog offset 7103 bushings. I could get up to 5 degrees caster with stock upper arms.

IMHO, if you bother with an adjust strut rod, pony up and get ones with spherical rod ends.

Here's the shaved rear poly bushing in my hand that I ran for 14 or so years. Behind it installed on my car is a Hotchkis strut rod with spherical rod and with full adjustment.
 

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Man I'm confused. Once you get the bushings right and install the adjustable strut rod, what good is the adjustment capability? Aren't you gonna create play between the bushing and rod?

OR, isn't pulling or pushing the strut rod going to create a side load on the LCA?

I'd really love to know all this stuff. I'm just getting ready to put my front end back together with the poly bushings. I'd love to do it the best way.

Also, how is caster adjusted on these A bodies? I'd love to be able to get 4 degrees positive, but I've been told "ain't no way".
 
Ironmike said:
Man I'm confused. Once you get the bushings right and install the adjustable strut rod, what good is the adjustment capability? Aren't you gonna create play between the bushing and rod?

OR, isn't pulling or pushing the strut rod going to create a side load on the LCA?
Click to expand...

If you run the adjustable strut rods that use rubber or poly bushings, you don't need to cut the rear bushing.

If you cut the rear bushing to basically stock size, in my opinion you are fine with the stock strut rod.

The deal is, the poly replacement bushing is thicker than factory original. And the little difference in thickness can be handled by the LCA fine. But the thicker bushing will lose a little much needed caster.


I'd really love to know all this stuff. I'm just getting ready to put my front end back together with the poly bushings. I'd love to do it the best way.

Also, how is caster adjusted on these A bodies? I'd love to be able to get 4 degrees positive, but I've been told "ain't no way".
Click to expand...

Consult the repair manual. But basically there are adjuster cams on the upper control arms.

You can get those larger positive caster numbers if you install the Moog p/n 7103 bushings per the instructions below. DO NOT use the instructions in the manual.
 

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Hell, I didn't know they made adj. rods with spherical ends......:angry7:

I'll have to dig around because I may have the stock size Moog bushings from the rebuild kit.....that I didn't use because I went with the MP Poly thinking it was "better".
 
superdart said:
Hell, I didn't know they made adj. rods with spherical ends......:angry7:

I'll have to dig around because I may have the stock size Moog bushings from the rebuild kit.....that I didn't use because I went with the MP Poly thinking it was "better".
Click to expand...

Just cut the poly ones shorter. Hacksaw will work. Then sand/grind them to get them finished flat. Measure before and after. Then cut the metal inner sleeve the same amount. I think I cheated and cut them a just a little shorter than stock.
 
Yay...get to take my car apart....again.:banghead:

I think it will wait until I put my new brakes on...gonna have the front spindles torn down anyway. It's been wrong this long...it can wait another few months.
 
I thought the cams were for adjusting camber. I learn something new everytime I jump on here.

I pressed all my bushings in a week or so ago, so the Moog improved type are out of the picture. Everything's been blasted and coated with a nice fresh coat of chassis black. I am considering buying Moog's improved strut rod bushings, though. After all this work, I'm not sure I feel like hackin my poly strut rod nushings. I'd rather throw them in the garbage.

Kinda chaps my *** that 'ya pay PST 400 bucks for their super polygraphite kit and the strut bushings aren't reeeeealy correct. Do they see us comin' or what.

So when I put everything together, how can I get alignment close enough to get me to the shop?
 
I just set the street height on the tie rods and when I replaced the tie rod ends I measured the exposed thread and set the new ones the same.

Worked pretty well for the drive to the alignment shop.
 
fourspeed said:
Yes.

frontsuspension04.jpg
Click to expand...

Where did you get the strut rod kit with heim joints in lieu of rubber or poly bushing? I was thinking the same thing but haven't found a kit yet. I would bet this, welded subframe connecters and adding caster to the front suspension probably makes for a DRAMATIC difference.
 
stop the beast said:
Where did you get the strut rod kit with heim joints in lieu of rubber or poly bushing? I was thinking the same thing but haven't found a kit yet. I would bet this, welded subframe connecters and adding caster to the front suspension probably makes for a DRAMATIC difference.
Click to expand...

Yes, it does. These strut rods are from RMS. http://www.reillymotorsports.com/store/home.php?cat=266

I also used RMS upper control arms. Believe it or not, I'm running about 6 degrees caster now. The steering effort is pretty high, but at speed, it's straight as an arrow. I also used Addco's anti-sway bar, but welded the frame mounts to the K member and used rod ends for part of the end links. The only rubber bushings left are the lower control arms and four anti-sway bar end link biscuits. http://www.fourbarrel.com/frontsuspension.html
 
I think I started with my cam bolts around zero in/out adjustment. I used a level to measure tire cant and measured track width on the front and rear of the tires to see if they were toed in. That was enough to get me to the suspension shop, which is only a few miles away and I used the back roads to get there.
 
Ironmike said:
Where's a good place to start with the UCA cam bolts?
Click to expand...

All you are going to get is making it good enough to drive directly to a close alignment shop.

Front of A-arm leg outward. Rear of A-arm leg pulled inward. Then check camber with a carpenter's L square and set to zero. If top of tire. is in, pull the rear leg out. If the top of the tire is too far out pull front front leg in.

Set the toe in after that. Then drive to the alignment shop.
 

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