Stupid Distributor Questions

[George R]

Sounds good. Put the highest octane gas in you can get. I always ran 93 octane in my stock 340. The lower grade fuel would always ping. I'd jet that carb up because stock those carbs are WAY too lean. What is your total timing?

Like I said, I couldn't check total timing because I would have needed a 3rd arm, but I'll get someone to help me in the next couple of days.

Sounds great George but I wouldn`t let moper get away if he still wants to visit Friday.

Dave sent a message asking whether Friday or Saturday would be better for me. I responded that I am at his mercy, so he needs to let ME know what day is best for HIM.
I haven't heard back from him yet.

Moper, if you didn't get my message, I have to work Friday morning, so Saturday would be best.

George

 

[3404spdvaliant]

Well, for what it's worth, I rotated the distributor intermediate shaft 1 tooth counterclockwise, and dropped the distributor back in the car. No more pop through the intake, idle is smooth as well. I set the initial timing at 16º BTDC, and took it for a ride. It still pings when you put your foot down, and there is a slight hesitation from a dead stop, but other than that it runs very well now. I think if I fill up with high octane fuel the ping will improve. If it doesn't I'll mess with the advance springs to make it come in a little later. Maybe I can eliminate the hesitation with the idle mixture screws or the accelerator pump?
I couldn't check the total timing because I couldn't operate the dial on the timing light while holding the light on the damper AND holding the throttle open. Maybe on Friday I'll have my wife help out.

What do you guys think??

George

Glad to hear george, that you changed the timing to make it run better.
re stabbing the intermediate shaft did nothing other than probably got you to correct the mistake you made when you first timed it.
Intermediate shafts and the gear on the cam have 18 teeth, thats an even # isn't it?
And the slot on the drive is fixed huh?
So like we said even if a tooth off all you have to do on a mopar is turn the distributor.
But as said glad to hear your getting somewhere with it.

 

[SSDA67]

Glad to hear george, that you changed the timing to make it run better.
re stabbing the intermediate shaft did nothing other than probably got you to correct the mistake you made when you first timed it.
Intermediate shafts and the gear on the cam have 18 teeth, thats an even # isn't it?
And the slot on the drive is fixed huh?
So like we said even if a tooth off all you have to do on a mopar is turn the distributor.
But as said glad to hear your getting somewhere with it.

I'm Glad SOMEONE Understands Me...


SS

 

[waggin]

That's my story and I'm...............sticking to it!!!!!!!!if you turn the housing and move the plug wires around till you are blue in the face the rotor button will still end up in between two terminals until you move the intermidiate shaft, and as far as "having my dream" It's a good one,I dream all mopars will out run the competition.....everywhere and anyday!Isn't that why we share information here?Winners circle is where us mopar guy's like to be!
I don't understand how you two can sit there and spend whatever time you have spent telling people that you can stick a distributor in a motor any where and it will be right?and not spent 20 minutes checking to see if you are right?.....cuz your not!!! the book is right but does not explain (why it is right)I found out from watchin people that stuck distributors in your way and then asking me to fix it,so I learned and didn't exactly share that information with my competition but I'm sharing it with you guy's.maybe I shouldn't share stuff like that? Nah,Heck with it you painted me in a corner on this If I wan't to share important information like this I will and you guy's that think I'm wrong just do it your way cause truth be known,"it's better to be LUCKY than to be GOOD"
p.s.It happens on big block mopars too.(

Waggins right only about making it simpler by putting the dist gear and dist in the factory way, other wise you just turn the distributor to obtain the timing desired if a tooth off.

 

[SSDA67]

That's my story and I'm...............sticking to it!!!!!!!!if you turn the housing and move the plug wires around till you are blue in the face the rotor button will still end up in between two terminals until you move the intermidiate shaft, and as far as "having my dream" It's a good one,I dream all mopars will out run the competition.....everywhere and anyday!Isn't that why we share information here?Winners circle is where us mopar guy's like to be!
I don't understand how you two can sit there and spend whatever time you have spent telling people that you can stick a distributor in a motor any where and it will be right?and not spent 20 minutes checking to see if you are right?.....cuz your not!!! the book is right but does not explain (why it is right)I found out from watchin people that stuck distributors in your way and then asking me to fix it,so I learned and didn't exactly share that information with my competition but I'm sharing it with you guy's.maybe I shouldn't share stuff like that? Nah,Heck with it you painted me in a corner on this If I wan't to share important information like this I will and you guy's that think I'm wrong just do it your way cause truth be known,"it's better to be LUCKY than to be GOOD"
p.s.It happens on big block mopars too.(

You Are Overthinking the Visual Here...YOU ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING DIFFERENT By Changing the Clog than you are by just turning the Distributor.The Shaft of the Distributor Stays PUT while the Body of the Distributor changes and the Point of Contact..Take a Spare Distributor and put the shaft slot in a Bench Vice.Now Turn the BODY of the Distributor and Wallah you will notice that the Cap RIDES on the BODY NOT the SHAFT....Therefore you have changed EVERYTHING.....THIS IS DIFFERENT With The CHEBBIES....It is VERY Easy to get it OFF a TOOTH Or Clog).......The ONLY time you should have to change the intermediate shaft a Clog or So is when you run out of room for the Vacum Canister Etc...and it hits....




And Do You Know What SSDA Stands for?Super Stock D Automatic..I ALSO Have Run SS/A;AA;B;BA;C;CA;D;DA.....I Have had SEVERAL World Records and Work on My Stuff and Most Everyone elses when I go to the track..I Have run HEMIs For DECADES(Probably have run more years than you are old) and all other Mopar Engine Combos and your THEORY does NOT Hold WATER...So You can tell it as much as you want and keep thinking you made the next internet etc...YOU ARE WRONG!!!!


SS

 

[fishy68]

You Are Overthinking the Visual Here...YOU ARE NOT DOING ANYTHING DIFFERENT By Changing the Clog than you are by just turning the Distributor.The Shaft of the Distributor Stays PUT while the Body of the Distributor changes and the Point of Contact..Take a Spare Distributor and put the shaft slot in a Bench Vice.Now Turn the BODY of the Distributor and Wallah you will notice that the Cap RIDES on the BODY NOT the SHAFT....Therefore you have changed EVERYTHING.....THIS IS DIFFERENT With The CHEBBIES....It is VERY Easy to get it OFF a TOOTH Or Clog).......The ONLY time you should have to change the intermediate shaft a Clog or So is when you run out of room for the Vacum Canister Etc...and it hits....
SS

Totally agreed. Waggins no disrespect meant but your confused by thinking that indexing the intermediate shaft differently your changing rotor phasing. The rotor phasing can only be affected by the position of the rubbing block (points) or the reluctor (electronic ign.) on the dist. shaft in relation to the rotor. You want the points to just open (as verified by and ohm meter) or the reluctor to pulse the pickup right when the rotor is pointing at the dist. cap terminal. No matter where you index the intermediate shaft rotor phasing will not be affected.

That's why it's called rotor phasing because the firing mechanism is phased to fire when the rotor is pointing at the dist. cap terminal.

As was stated already you do want the intermediate shaft indexed so the rotor will be pointing at front drivers side intake bolt. That will position the dist. so a full range of adjustment can be utilized without the vacuum advance can hitting.

I have many times over the yrs. bought cars whose engines had the intermediate shaft indexed wrong (by people that didn't know how to do it right) so that the #1 plug wire could end up anywhere around the cap and as long as the firing order is right and the timing is set right they ran perfectly fine. I always straightened them out so things looked neater and were the way the factory designed them.

 

[George R]

Well, I thought it was better last night, but I was wrong.
I took the car for a long ride this am, and it still has a stumble, and will pop through the intake when put under load. If my foot is to the floor, the car runs like a bear! I put the 93 octane fuel in it this morning and the ping is gone. If the car is cruising on level ground, you can barely feel this misfire, or stumble, but once you get to a hill and the 727 is in 3rd gear, or if you accelerate slightly from cruise speed, the car will start to buck as the load increases, and eventually will pop through the intake every 10 seconds or so until either you nail it, or take the load from the engine. I dunno if there is a vacuum leak somewhere or not. If it is idling, it is smooth as silk, and the engine will die if I cover the carb with my hand. If you rev it up in neutral it is smooth and powerful, but once there is a load on it, it will start to stumble and run rough, unless it is at wide open throttle.

I thought I had this licked last night, but I only took it around the block a few times so I guess it wasn't really long enough a ride to make it act up.

There are only 5 vacuum ports that I am aware of; one on the intake for the brake booster, one for the PCV valve, and one small port at the base of the carb in front. The other 2 are as follows; one for the vacuum advance, and one to operate the choke pull off. I currently have the port for the vacuum advance plugged at the carb.
The power brake booster will hold vacuum, and so does the choke pull off. The intake has never been removed from the engine, and all the bolts are tight. The carb nuts are tight as well. I used one thin gasket under the carb, but I have tried it with the thick gasket as well with the same results.

Ironically, my friend owns a 65 Corvette convertible with a 425HP 396 motor, 4 speed Muncie, factory sidepipes, and he is bringing his car to me on Saturday so I can diagnose his engine troubles. At the same time, I cannot figure out what is wrong with my Mopar! LOL I thought it was funny that I am trusted and respected enough within the Corvette community enough so that this fellow is going to drive an hour to my house so I can fix his Vette, but when it comes to Mopar's I am the one who needs help! I didn't think these vehicles would be so different......maybe they're not, and I am just having a brain fart.
Anyway, it's all good. Today is a day to give thanks, so thats what we'll do. I think I'll take a break from the car for today, and help my pretty wife get dinner ready for our guests. I just wanted to THANK all of you guys that have contributed to this thread, and thanks also for those who haven't posted, but wished well.

George

 

[redfastback]

Check your plugs for cracks in the ceramic. I have had cracked plugs act like this.

 

[George R]

Guys-
I replaced every piece of the ignition 2 times. Tried bigger jets, thinner step rods, timing all the way from 5º to 18º, set float level and drop, stiffer springs for the step rods, and the car still has the same problem.
I give up. If there is anyone local to CT that can spend some time here, I will pay you for your trouble including fuel costs & tolls if needed.
The freakin car has a misfire at light load. Full throttle blasts it will run like a champ, but it won't run smoothly in any other throttle position. It feels like there is one or more dead cylinders when it is doing it. Thats the best way I can describe it to ya's. Start from a dead stop, going up a slight hill, or accelerating from 25 to 35 MPH it will stumble/miss. Put your foot to the floor and it will leave 200' of rubber. I just melted about 1/8" of rubber off the tires in front of my house, and the car runs great! Get to a stop sign and drive off normally, it will run like crap.
Please PM me if you can come here and look at it. Like I said, I will pay for all expenses and your time.

George

 

[SSDA67]

Guys-
I replaced every piece of the ignition 2 times. Tried bigger jets, thinner step rods, timing all the way from 5º to 18º, set float level and drop, stiffer springs for the step rods, and the car still has the same problem.
I give up. If there is anyone local to CT that can spend some time here, I will pay you for your trouble including fuel costs & tolls if needed.
The freakin car has a misfire at light load. Full throttle blasts it will run like a champ, but it won't run smoothly in any other throttle position. It feels like there is one or more dead cylinders when it is doing it. Thats the best way I can describe it to ya's. Start from a dead stop, going up a slight hill, or accelerating from 25 to 35 MPH it will stumble/miss. Put your foot to the floor and it will leave 200' of rubber. I just melted about 1/8" of rubber off the tires in front of my house, and the car runs great! Get to a stop sign and drive off normally, it will run like crap.
Please PM me if you can come here and look at it. Like I said, I will pay for all expenses and your time.

George

It COULD be a Cam has wiped Lobes...Could also be Burnt Valves/Seats.The best way to test this is:

Take Valve covers Off.
Unplug Coil Tower Wire at Dist(So Car Can't RUN)
Have someone turn car over and see if ALL 16 Rockers are moving the same distance.
Then you can Also Take each of the plugs out(One at a time is fine)and take a Compression Tester to see how much PSI each cylinder has.This should not vary more than a few pounds(ie 112 on #1 Cylinder 110 on #3 etc).I Think Advanced Auto Parts will rent the tester for a little of nothing if you don't have one or know of anybody that does.
I just had one of my buddies that thought his distributor was bad after doing a tune-up and bought a new Billet Distributor.It did not change his situation.They took the valve covers off and found out that when they turned it over several valves were not moving as much as the others.This was on a motor home and it was heating up pulling his enclosed trailer.By itself it ran like a raped ape...We changed the cam/lifters and it gets a couple MPG better and a Hell Of Alot of power now...

PM me your Number.I have a guy in NYC that may be able to run up and help..

SS

 

[AdamR]

George, Im working 1 job now. Maybe I can swing up and give you a hand soon.

 

[George R]

Well, I pulled the dist advanced a whole lot. I dunno where the initial timing is now, but it's way advanced. Anyway, the car seems to run a little better. I'm now second guessing my own work when I put the timing chain in the motor. I've done 100 chains in the past so I know I did it right, but now I'm second guessing myself.

Thanks Adam.

George

 

[moper]

Still not getting it better, eh George? Did you at least fix the Vette? Sometimes a new pair of eyes will help with insights you're blocked on.

 

[George R]

Still not getting it better, eh George? Did you at least fix the Vette? Sometimes a new pair of eyes will help with insights you're blocked on.

My buddy was here with his 65 396 Vette last Saturday. The guy wasn't here for 15 minutes and the car was all set. Ran like a raped ape! Front float level way too low, idle mixture screws were set by ear instead on a vacuum gauge, and I set his initial timing to 10º. Car ran like a clock when he left, but I can't fix my own freakin car.
Anyway.....

George

 

[AdamR]

George, we'll get it straightened out soon. Im busy next weekend but free the Sunday after.

Did you get the carb parts ?

 

[George R]

George, we'll get it straightened out soon. Im busy next weekend but free the Sunday after.

Did you get the carb parts ?

Yes I got the carb parts Adam. I used the biggest Jet, and the thinnest rod, with the strongest rod spring, and it didn't make a bit of difference.
I'm going to install the MP elec distributor kit one of these days just to rule it out, but I don't know if it will make a difference.
I almost want to drop a 427 Chevy and a Muncie M21 in this car.

George

 

[AdamR]

I almost want to drop a 427 Chevy and a Muncie M21 in this car.

George

Lets not do anything rash, lol

The car still has point correct ? That kinda sucks because I dont have any points distributor to try and dont have another carb but we'll figure it out.

 

[George R]

I have the stock points dist still in the car, the MP electric kit still in the box, the stock AVS carb on the shelf, and the Eddie carb still on the car.
The 427 and M-21 are in the basement.

George

 

[moper]

George, go M22