They walk among us!

-
You can see the earth's curvature in my brothers private plane. Flat earth theory (it is just that: a theory) has so many holes in it.... that just WOW!
To argue flat vs. round actually makes me feel stupid :D
  • Just take a round ball and a flat disc, and try to duplicate shadows, 1/4 moons and everything else.
  • Flat earth people claim to have fired a rocket that hit the ceiling.... LOL. I saw the video, and as fast as the rocket was going, it suffered no damage. Just, hit the ceiling like a bottle rocket in your living room. talk about fake news and videos of lies... LOL.
  • I could go on and on, but I would make AJ jealous because how long the post would be.... :D
 
Yeah I seen this too, dig deeper
My wife's sister's husband lived in the Antarctic and worked there. Trust me, it is not the edge where you could "fall off" .... LOL

not to mention how some things work opposite on the other side of the equator.
 
Last edited:
You will never win this argument.

The winning answer is always "I believe..."

What gets me is that almost all if not all of the "major" religions essentially say the same two things-

Don't kill people, and don't screw people over.

For myself, I have deduced that there is no reliable way to tell which religion, if any is "correct".

Therefore I submit that the intelligent philosophy is to admit that.

I do believe that there is a certain order to the way things happen, but this could be "big nature" just as easily as an "intelligent creator". In fact, they may be one and the same.

I find it fascinating that those who believe Christianity the most, seem to be the least concerned with respect for a habitable planet and the most eager to kill or ostracize others that do not believe the exact same way.

It's almost as if they read the book over and over, but still do not get the meaning.

Something else that's often overlooked is that the particular book in question was translated how many times?
...and even rewritten by a king, perhaps to more closely follow his own personal beliefs.

If you understand the way the human brain works (OK, at least a cursory understanding), you can see how easily the manufacture of "gods" to explain all sorts of things, including human behavior, really is.

Again, I submit- don't kill people, and don't screw people over.

I do not need the threat of eternal damnation to live by those simple rules.

Oh man, do I agree with every word you said.
The most devastating loss of life on the planet is and always has been over differences in religious beliefs.

The ten commandments covered it all, but the bible and it's followers go on to add threats in case we don't mind the word.
I never needed my Mother to threaten me with "You just wait till your Dad comes home" because I respected my Mother's wishes as it was the right thing to do.
This is exactly what threats of hellfire for eternity or a really hot place with an asshole that likes to torture the bad kids are in my opinion.
A way to try and threaten people into behaving in a decent manor to each other.
I didn't need threats of Dad coming home, and I don't need the threat of going to hell to keep me from screwing my neighbor over.
I'm not going to screw them over because it's wrong and I know it, so I don't need to be threatened to not do so.

Please know that I am not trying to judge or put down people that feel the need for religion as it is absolutely necessary for some people to believe there is something bigger and better than them.
I'm just not one of them, so the threats of rapture and hellfire have no more meaning to me than waiting till Dad gets home did.
 
AJ Form S said:
So, there you have it. There is NO WAY to prove the earth is a spinning ball, moving over 1050mph at the equator.
I wonder what a 1050mph wind would do to a person standing on the equator?Hmmmm, nothing? How is that possible? Oh, the atmosphere is cemented to the earth, and whithersoever the earth goes, so goes the atmosphere....Now I get it.
What, it's not cemented but rather Gravity keeps it on?Good to know. What gravity is that, exactly? The force that is powerful enough to keep millions of tons of water from flying off the earth, yet we have no problem walking.So I guess we are all superstrong then........
Gravity must be true,AJ. BELIEVE it, AJ . Smarter men than you AJ, figured all this out years ago. BELIEVE IT!
I don't think so,Tim................

Yes, the wet tennis ball imagery seems to be the cornerstone of FET's

It is simple to understand. The Earth is not accelerating. It is the same scientific principle that allows you to hold a perfectly still cup of water on an airplane traveling at a continuous speed of 500mph.

If you don't believe in Gravity then how do you explain mass? Do you not believe in Atoms and Molecules?
 
Last edited:
Yes, the wet tennis ball imagery seems to be the cornerstone of FET's

It is simple to understand. The Earth is not accelerating. It is the same scientific principle that allows you to hold a perfectly still cup of water on an airplane traveling at a continuous speed of 500mph.

If you don't believe in Gravity then how do you explain mass? Do you not believe in Atoms and Molecules?

Hey, I didn't say what your quote says I did. :D
 
Those that "have not done their studying", are those that choose to remain ignorant of the fact that every individual is unique and that there are many valid forms of religious or non-religious beliefs other than their own.

If we as a planet could simply take responsibility for our own actions and treat others and our environment with respect, that would be a true gift to ourselves and our creator, who or what ever that may be.
 
Yes, the wet tennis ball imagery seems to be the cornerstone of FET's

It is simple to understand. The Earth is not accelerating. It is the same scientific principle that allows you to hold a perfectly still cup of water on an airplane traveling at a continuous speed of 500mph.

If you don't believe in Gravity then how do you explain mass? Do you not believe in Atoms and Molecules?

I think it's interesting that everything that makes up all known matter is exactly the same in physical design no matter the size.
Atoms have a center mass with satellites in orbit around it, as do solar systems and even universes.
It seems everything follows this same design.
Are we going to look even closer at atoms and find that they also have atoms?
Does this mean our currently known place in space is actually just one of billions of places just like it, and we just have not been able to see the edge of ours yet? or the edge of the one next to ours.
Some scientist are starting to think this is actually the way all of existence is layed out, because it follows the same pattern.
It is just in hugely varying scales and distances so we don't know it yet for sure.

Man has a pretty bad habit of deciding something is the way we think it is and defending it to the death even when wrong.
Let's see, we do that with science and nature so what else could be untrue and defended to the death anyway?
Hmmm,:D
 
you wont find "Bible" in the Bible either, i guess the Bible doesnt exist?

the main passage that teaches the rapture is first thessalonians 4:17
"Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

this was originally written in greek and the phrase "harpoza" is translated "shall be caught up" in English, but in the latin translation it is "rapturo"
and it literally means to be snatched up

goes what term we got from there?

1 Thessalonians 4:17 is discussing a RESURECTION not a rapture. They are two entirely different things.

In order to have a rapture, as you say, you have to ignore every single time prophecy, and take the 70 weeks in Daniel and pull one week (7 years) right off the end of the prophecy that is one continuous prophecy and stick it out in time somewhere without regard to ANY other prophecy that is tied to it. For example, the 2300 day prophecy and the 2520 day prophecy and ignore the fact that they are continuous and run concurrently with the 70 weeks. Why make the 70 weeks not like every other time prophecy? You can't. Christ himself called out the end of the 70 week prophecy.

So, I'll say it again, there is NO rapture. It's a lie. There are two resurrections, seperated by 1000 years. There are three times Christ comes to earth. One already. The second time he never sets his foot on the earth. The third time is after the 1000 years, before the second resurrection.

You can make the bible say anything you want. If you read it just like it's written and let the bible define itself, you won't have errors like this rapture crap.

You also wouldn't have people praying to Mary or other dead people, you wouldn't have people think that hell is burning now and people will burn forever in that hell. Rediculous. You wouldn't have the pagan doctrine of the trinity. Confession to a priest. There is no once saved always saved.

I could go on....
 
Who exactly did God kill? A very juvenile thought process. When Cain killed Able, did God do that? Is God responsible for World War I? Or any war?

Well, we could say that God killed everyone who has ever died since it was Gods will, right?:D
Or we could say that since God gave man free will it was his will that people be capable of killing.

Anyway, obviously Rudy's ride was referring to belief over religious differences.
 
1 Thessalonians 4:17 is discussing a RESURECTION not a rapture. They are two entirely different things.

In order to have a rapture, as you say, you have to ignore every single time prophecy, and take the 70 weeks in Daniel and pull one week (7 years) right off the end of the prophecy that is one continuous prophecy and stick it out in time somewhere without regard to ANY other prophecy that is tied to it. For example, the 2300 day prophecy and the 2520 day prophecy and ignore the fact that they are continuous and run concurrently with the 70 weeks. Why make the 70 weeks not like every other time prophecy? You can't. Christ himself called out the end of the 70 week prophecy.

So, I'll say it again, there is NO rapture. It's a lie. There are two resurrections, seperated by 1000 years. There are three times Christ comes to earth. One already. The second time he never sets his foot on the earth. The third time is after the 1000 years, before the second resurrection.

You can make the bible say anything you want. If you read it just like it's written and let the bible define itself, you won't have errors like this rapture crap.

You also wouldn't have people praying to Mary or other dead people, you wouldn't have people think that hell is burning now and people will burn forever in that hell. Rediculous. You wouldn't have the pagan doctrine of the trinity. Confession to a priest. There is no once saved always saved.

I could go on....

All left open to individual interpretation, so who do we kill because they don't beleive yours?
(that wasn't a shot at you personally, but a point)
 
You can see the earth's curvature in my brothers private plane. Flat earth theory (it is just that: a theory) has so many holes in it.... that just WOW!
To argue flat vs. round actually makes me feel stupid :D
  • Just take a round ball and a flat disc, and try to duplicate shadows, 1/4 moons and everything else.
  • Flat earth people claim to have fired a rocket that hit the ceiling.... LOL. I saw the video, and as fast as the rocket was going, it suffered no damage. Just, hit the ceiling like a bottle rocket in your living room. talk about fake news and videos of lies... LOL.
  • I could go on and on, but I would make AJ jealous because how long the post would be.... :D

I hate even calling it a theory. As that lends SOME scientific credence to it. I prefer to call it a belief. The religious connotations of "belief" bug me as well. But not nearly as much as the scientific connotations of "theory".

God or Gods have killed more people than they have ever saved. Guess I`m going to hell for that comment.

To play devil's advocate for a moment. As many war's over religion as there has been. There has also been good. For a VERY long time, the only orphanages, poor houses, soup kitchens and numerous other "charities" were operated solely by religious institutions. Like anything that has been around for a few thousand years. There is good and bad.

Who exactly did God kill? A very juvenile thought process. When Cain killed Able, did God do that? Is God responsible for World War I? Or any war?

I guess that would be a direct action vs indirect action debate. But there is at least foresight. If god is omnipotent. Then he knew ahead of time what giving humanity free will would do.

It's sort of like getting out your race car. Lining it up with a park full of kids. Putting the rear end up on one jackstand. Putting it in gear. Dropping a brick on the gas pedal. Then going for lunch.

I mean, you don't know FOR SURE what will happen. But you can make a reasonable guess. Even a man's court of law would hold you to that standard.

Personally. I don't think any god, or gods, are found in wood or stone. They aren't found in the voice of a preacher. His robes. Or the collection plate. God/gods aren't found in scripture or the bible. Or in a certain spot on earth. Nor in a certain ceremony. Any god or gods is found inside the person that believes in them. Anything they draw from that comes from themselves and their own belief. And at the end of the day. As long as that makes them happy. And they don't negatively impact someone else's life. Who cares?

Like someone else mentioned. As long as you are good to others. Don't hurt people. And lead a generally "good" life. Everything will be a-ok.
 
I think it's interesting that everything that makes up all known matter is exactly the same in physical design no matter the size.
Atoms have a center mass with satellites in orbit around it, as do solar systems and even universes.
It seems everything follows this same design.
Are we going to look even closer at atoms and find that they also have atoms?
Does this mean our currently known place in space is actually just one of billions of places just like it, and we just have not been able to see the edge of ours yet? or the edge of the one next to ours.
Some scientist are starting to think this is actually the way all of existence is layed out, because it follows the same pattern.
It is just in hugely varying scales and distances so we don't know it yet for sure.

Man has a pretty bad habit of deciding something is the way we think it is and defending it to the death even when wrong.
Let's see, we do that with science and nature so what else could be untrue and defended to the death anyway?
Hmmm,:D

And maybe the sub and post-atomic realms are actually a step forward or backwards in the fabric of time :)

The main beef I have with FET is that it denies the proven laws of physics to create a micro-relativism.

A trend I have been seeing at our church (I am not religious) is this trend towards fringe theory as a test of faith. Almost a throwing the baby out with the bath water type of approach to address their own spiritual doubts. A good friend of mine has been embracing this Creationism trend and has given me a few books on it, which I read, but they are so blatantly theory-crafted that anyone with an ounce of objectivity can poke a thousand holes in it.

To each their own I guess. If the Earth is flat or globular, 6000years old or 4 Billion years old, my daily life is still the same.
 
This thread shows why people have been saying for years, don't discuss religion or politics. It drives people apart. Not worth it.
 
Rapture and hell is not a threat. A fair warning to those that believe. As in the days of Noah, fair warning of a flood. To those that didn't believe, no need to enter the boat. It didn't change truth. The flood came, the door of the ark was shut, and those that were within were within, and those on the outside were outside.
  • Lie #1. Wars are over religion. Fact, more wars have been fought over land and borders than any belief. Many have used "religion" to sell the message to their country, but land and borders trumps this discussion
 
Science is all about BELIEVING that what they tell us is real. It's a religion.

This is a common misconception. In fact modern science, meaning since the middle ages, is about believing only what you can see or measure, taking nothing on faith. Of course no one individual has the time or resources to discover everything, which is why we rely on previous discoveries to make new ones. However, we can verify old discoveries. For example, when I teach physics, my students do lab measurements that verify F=ma, V=iR, and other previously known results. The reason we make them do the lab is so that they can see for themselves that the laws we teach are based on observation, not authority. I tell my students "Don't believe me or the book; find out for yourself."

One reason people have a problem with science is that we can never truly get to the bottom of a "why?" question. Physics goes all the way back to the Big Bang but no one has any clue whatsoever why the Big Bang happened, or what was before. Does that mean physics is worthless? No, it just means we don't have the complete answer yet, and maybe/probably never will.

Another reason people distrust science is because there's so much you have to know these days to be able to learn more. Here, Feynman explains why it's so hard to explain magnetism to someone who hasn't studied physics already:


As for gravity, the attraction between any two bodies has been demonstrated in the laboratory, using a torsion balance (look up the Cavendish experiment if you are curious). You have personally observed some of the effects of gravity: a thrown object falls in an arc, a lot of water is heavier than just a little water, etc. Newton's laws explain all that and more. If it seems hard to believe, fine. Lots of physics is hard to believe. Physicists accept it because it explains an awful lot of observations people have made over the centuries, including the orbits of the planets, motion of projectiles, why transistors work, the colors of hot objects, etc.

Are all science theories correct? Of course not. Often theories have to be modified because new observations are made that don't match the theory. For example, Newton's theory of gravity is good enough for most purposes but not for the precision time-keeping needed for GPS. For that you need Einstein's theory of gravity (commonly called "general relativity"), which says matter warps space and time. It sounds crazy...and yet your GPS wouldn't work if the people who designed it did not believe the theory. For that matter, none of the components of your car would work if the people who designed them did not accept the laws of physics.

By the way, religion does exactly what science doesn't do: it gets to the bottom of the "why" questions. However, it's not based on evidence but on faith. There's no inherent conflict between religion and science. The conflict only comes up when some fool scientist claims to prove God does or doesn't exist, or some fool theologian tries to explain the laws of nature by making up stories about God doing stuff when we can clearly see that nature follows the theories discovered by scientists (evolution for example). If you choose to believe in a Creator, it should be OK to believe that She made the laws of physics and let nature do the rest. You don't need to make up stories about firmaments.

Next time you're at the beach, watch a container ship sail away. Does it just get smaller, or does the bottom disappear before the top? Look carefully and you'll see that the ship is going around a vertical curve. That's gravity making the ocean round.

Some will say I'm wasting my time responding on this thread, but AJ has helped me more than once and I think I owe it to him.
 
This thread shows why people have been saying for years, don't discuss religion or politics. It drives people apart. Not worth it.

Just so you know, I have zero bad feelings toward anyone in this discussion. :D
Like my Brother always tells people "It's a conversation, not a confrontation"
I like to discuss, all of it from both points of view.

This quote from Lustle is the same way I live and feel about all of it.

" Any god or gods is found inside the person that believes in them. Anything they draw from that comes from themselves and their own belief. And at the end of the day. As long as that makes them happy. And they don't negatively impact someone else's life. Who cares?"

One slight difference is that I don't thank or blame anyone or anything outside of myself for what I do.
Nor do I accept that excuse from others.
 
This is a common misconception. In fact modern science, meaning since the middle ages, is about believing only what you can see or measure, taking nothing on faith. Of course no one individual has the time or resources to discover everything, which is why we rely on previous discoveries to make new ones. However, we can verify old discoveries. For example, when I teach physics, my students do lab measurements that verify F=ma, V=iR, and other previously known results. The reason we make them do the lab is so that they can see for themselves that the laws we teach are based on observation, not authority. I tell my students "Don't believe me or the book; find out for yourself."

One reason people have a problem with science is that we can never truly get to the bottom of a "why?" question. Physics goes all the way back to the Big Bang but no one has any clue whatsoever why the Big Bang happened, or what was before. Does that mean physics is worthless? No, it just means we don't have the complete answer yet, and maybe/probably never will.

Another reason people distrust science is because there's so much you have to know these days to be able to learn more. Here, Feynman explains why it's so hard to explain magnetism to someone who hasn't studied physics already:


As for gravity, the attraction between any two bodies has been demonstrated in the laboratory, using a torsion balance (look up the Cavendish experiment if you are curious). You have personally observed some of the effects of gravity: a thrown object falls in an arc, a lot of water is heavier than just a little water, etc. Newton's laws explain all that and more. If it seems hard to believe, fine. Lots of physics is hard to believe. Physicists accept it because it explains an awful lot of observations people have made over the centuries, including the orbits of the planets, motion of projectiles, why transistors work, the colors of hot objects, etc.

Are all science theories correct? Of course not. Often theories have to be modified because new observations are made that don't match the theory. For example, Newton's theory of gravity is good enough for most purposes but not for the precision time-keeping needed for GPS. For that you need Einstein's theory of gravity (commonly called "general relativity"), which says matter warps space and time. It sounds crazy...and yet your GPS wouldn't work if the people who designed it did not believe the theory. For that matter, none of the components of your car would work if the people who designed them did not accept the laws of physics.

By the way, religion does exactly what science doesn't do: it gets to the bottom of the "why" questions. However, it's not based on evidence but on faith. There's no inherent conflict between religion and science. The conflict only comes up when some fool scientist claims to prove God does or doesn't exist, or some fool theologian tries to explain the laws of nature by making up stories about God doing stuff when we can clearly see that nature follows the theories discovered by scientists (evolution for example). If you choose to believe in a Creator, it should be OK to believe that She made the laws of physics and let nature do the rest. You don't need to make up stories about firmaments.

Next time you're at the beach, watch a container ship sail away. Does it just get smaller, or does the bottom disappear before the top? Look carefully and you'll see that the ship is going around a vertical curve. That's gravity making the ocean round.

Some will say I'm wasting my time responding on this thread, but AJ has helped me more than once and I think I owe it to him.


Perfect, thank you.
 
And yet, nobody seems to be able to explain the "Bronies"!! Politics, religion, and Bronies, 3 things that cannot be rationally discussed!!
 
People have been killing each other in the name of their religion since the dawn of time.
As for interpreting the bible, I once saw Jerry Falwell on late night TV quote a line of scripture, repeat it several times and twist it around so it became a reason to send him money.
 
Have you ever seen a "My Little Pony" episode?

I watched one.

It had the ponies in an alternate universe in which they were human.

Actually pretty good writing.

Being the analyst I am, I looked up the history because I seem to remember "My Pretty Pony" from the 80's, and yes they are the same. Turns out a girl who grew up in the 80's was disappointed that the story lines were bland and generic and later in life submitted a much more involved/technical/action oriented story with the pony characters to the toy/cartoon companies, and that triggered a revival.

Now is a multi-million dollar franchise for the second time in four decades.
 
Half the world does not have a three-digit i.q.
Half of the people with a three-digit IQ are imbeciles bent on impressing You with how many meaningless factoids they can retain without doing anything useful with them.
 
-
Back
Top