Today, dollar for dollar, is the 318 faster than the 340 ???

would you agree ?

  • yep, the 318 wins if buying and building for under 3k

    Votes: 48 41.7%

  • Nope, the 340 always has and always will beat the 318

    Votes: 57 49.6%

  • Actually, never thought about it like this... Good Point !

    Votes: 10 8.7%
  • Total voters
    115
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273 said:
Not really a 340 is 7% bigger so a 318 would basically need to make power 7% higher rpm so if a 340 makes peak at 5500 rpm a 318 would need to at 5900 ish rpm. Obviously this is just a gross oversimplification eg. If the 340 is a bad put together combo and the is done well the rpm difference could be close and if the opposite the rpm could be further apart. As for torque that’s what gears are for.
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Why would you turn one engine higher than the other to compare? The point is the 318 will shroud the valves more (.120) which will kill the power
 
Ceedawg said:
Why would you turn one engine higher than the other to compare? The point is the 318 will shroud the valves more (.120) which will kill the power
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Kill is a bit of an overstatement, we don’t know how much cfm loss there is, I’ve seen Chevy 305 vs 350 bore difference on flow bench 3.75” vs 4” and it was like 5-10 cfm and how many are pushing their heads to the limit anyways.

As for the rpm why people go on so much about static displacement (engine off) when dynamic displacement (running engine) is what matters most.
340 @ 5500 rpm displaces the same amount of air as a 318 @ 5900 rpm.
 
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Here's the skinny. The change between a hot small block and a hot big block is "generally" on the order of .5 seconds. How much exactly do you think will be the change from a hot 318 to a hot 340? Trust me, it's splittin hairs.
 
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I still say the rules on this they are saying " wait until I do everything I can to convert my 318 to a 340, and 340 guy, you do nothing but set timing and tweak carb and well race ...oh you have a 73 340? Even better...:lol:
 
Dave_J said:
^^^ This is NOT a good thing.
Over there if you can not afford to spend the money to buy a new Hemi block and all the parts to build it, you're gutter trash.
They constantly put budget street guys down.
If you disagree with one of the "Holy Gurus" you get called names like Fagot or the N word.
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:bs_flag: I've been on Moparts since 2003 and have never seen anyone called the "N" word and honestly don't remember seeing anyone called a faggot either. There have been a lot of good members leave because of the bickering though.

As far as name calling goes it happens here a lot, just look in this thread. It has been somewhat less tense though for the last two or three weeks.

Internet experts are everywhere, Moparts don't have a lock on them.
 
Dartswinger70 said:
I still say the rules on this they are saying " wait until I do everything I can to convert my 318 to a 340, and 340 guy, you do nothing but set timing and tweak carb and well race ...oh you have a 73 340? Even better...:lol:
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The very first post was very clear
 
Ceedawg said:
I said all things the same. Of course if you put good heads on one and stock on the other it’ll be better for the good head engine. The only initial price difference is the block.
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which with the theoretical fixed budget to 'buy and build' puts the cost of one much higher than the other. this leaves money for the good heads etc to go on the cheaper block. it's not rocket science.
the 340 guys here can bleat on about unfair parts use on one and not the other but the real unfair part is the cost of the 340 block/core. that's what would make the 318 faster for that fixed 'buy and build' budget. it doesn't make the 318 better, just that for this theoretical discussion constrained by budget it's faster.
 
To be honest, If I built both, the 340 would win. It would be for the same car, so that takes out the variables. Since they are basically the same size and compression ratio, I would cam them the same. I would run 360 heads on the 318, but use the smaller 1.88 intake valves. Same intake, carb, windage tray, exhaust, distributor, and oil pan. It would be quick and fast in an A body, but always a bit slower than the 340. Can you make a 318 faster than a 340? Yes, but there are always trade offs and I put limitations on what I will put up with. I won't sell my 340 to put money into a 318. On the other hand, if I only had a 318 I would not hesitate to build it either.
 
66fs said:
To be honest, If I built both, the 340 would win. It would be for the same car, so that takes out the variables. Since they are basically the same size and compression ratio, I would cam them the same. I would run 360 heads on the 318, but use the smaller 1.88 intake valves. Same intake, carb, windage tray, exhaust, distributor, and oil pan. It would be quick and fast in an A body, but always a bit slower than the 340. Can you make a 318 faster than a 340? Yes, but there are always trade offs and I put limitations on what I will put up with. I won't sell my 340 to put money into a 318. On the other hand, if I only had a 318 I would not hesitate to build it either.
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Winner winner chicken dinner!
 
MrJLR said:
The very first post was very clear
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I thought so too....... And by the way, I think a 3k budget is generous to the guy assembling out of his garage. In fact, my '76 Duster runs high 12's with 3.23's and a factory stock converter on LESS than Half the 3k budget given here, carb to pan. Just say'n, I think 3k is a generous budget for the garage builder - budget minded person.
 
273 said:
Kill is a bit of an overstatement, we don’t know how much cfm loss there is, I’ve seen Chevy 305 vs 350 bore difference on flow bench 3.75” vs 4” and it was like 5-10 cfm and how many are pushing their heads to the limit anyways.

As for the rpm why people go on so much about static displacement (engine off) when dynamic displacement (running engine) is what matters most.
340 @ 5500 rpm displaces the same amount of air as a 318 @ 5900 rpm.
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Well then I’ll turn my 340 5900 rpm. Both engines are capable of the same rpm since they have same crank. If bore size means nothing WHY do they notch the top of the bore around the valve? 22” less means a smaller pry bar to lift an object, nothing you can do to change that, WITH ALL THE OTHER PARTS BEING EQUAL.
 
318willrun said:
I thought so too....... And by the way, I think a 3k budget is generous to the guy assembling out of his garage. In fact, my '76 Duster runs high 12's with 3.23's and a factory stock converter on LESS than Half the 3k budget given here, carb to pan. Just say'n, I think 3k is a generous budget for the garage builder - budget minded person.
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for sure, there was no mention of a race motor in the op.
 
mygasser said:
which with the theoretical fixed budget to 'buy and build' puts the cost of one much higher than the other. this leaves money for the good heads etc to go on the cheaper block. it's not rocket science.
the 340 guys here can bleat on about unfair parts use on one and not the other but the real unfair part is the cost of the 340 block/core. that's what would make the 318 faster for that fixed 'buy and build' budget. it doesn't make the 318 better, just that for this theoretical discussion constrained by budget it's faster.
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"faster "isnt the term there are too many variables right down to the driver, you be going for pulls on an engine dyno, as in Horsepower at the flywheel. That would make this a bit more cut and dried and accurate if you will. and, you 318 guys are still cheap skates who will dump the money into 340 360 heads and similar "conversion" parts you are in effect just using the block, calling it a 318 is pure lies and bullshit...it makes me wish there werent so many interchangeable parts between the two. I know none of you would use the stock 318 heads, ported or not. truth is, its a dick swinging contest and you 318 guys have little dicks...:)
 
Ceedawg said:
Well then I’ll turn my 340 5900 rpm. Both engines are capable of the same rpm since they have same crank. If bore size means nothing WHY do they notch the top of the bore around the valve? 22” less means a smaller pry bar to lift an object, nothing you can do to change that, WITH ALL THE OTHER PARTS BEING EQUAL.
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With all parts being equal, the 340 wins. However, if you have to buy parts at fair market value, the parts won't be equal because 318's are next to free and the 340 will eat up half the budget. This is why, and the ONLY reason why I say the 318 at todays prices is possibly the fastest of the two engines on the given budget. I find it ironic because 25 years ago this would have never been the case.
 
mygasser said:
for sure, there was no mention of a race motor in the op.
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The 318 guys would do so many mods it may as well be a race motor. I said it in another post, and Ill put it another way: there is no farm boy with a 318 that knows something the Chrysler engineers didn't when they designed the 340,which is their version of a "modded" 318.
 
66fs said:
To be honest, If I built both, the 340 would win. It would be for the same car, so that takes out the variables. Since they are basically the same size and compression ratio, I would cam them the same. I would run 360 heads on the 318, but use the smaller 1.88 intake valves. Same intake, carb, windage tray, exhaust, distributor, and oil pan. It would be quick and fast in an A body, but always a bit slower than the 340. Can you make a 318 faster than a 340? Yes, but there are always trade offs and I put limitations on what I will put up with. I won't sell my 340 to put money into a 318. On the other hand, if I only had a 318 I would not hesitate to build it either.
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Well heck get a /6, they pay you to take them so you’re money ahead then. With all that money it’ll blow that 340 and 318 right out of the water.
 
Ceedawg said:
Well heck get a /6, they pay you to take them so you’re money ahead then. With all that money it’ll blow that 340 and 318 right out of the water.
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I like that and I'd love to see it...:) you could go all UTG and put the slant in a B body, claim to do 10s LOL!
 
318willrun said:
With all parts being equal, the 340 wins. However, if you have to buy parts at fair market value, the parts won't be equal because 318's are next to free and the 340 will eat up half the budget. This is why, and the ONLY reason why I say the 318 at todays prices is possibly the fastest of the two engines on the given budget. I find it ironic because 25 years ago this would have never been the case.
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I get what you’re saying but your budget doesn’t allow enough money to get past a stock 340 in perfect tune. It already starts with the best heads, intake, compression, carb and cam
I will add, D/Stock Duster 340 with STOCK heads, cast iron intake .450 cam, 3200 pounds went 9.90 ET. I’m doing an E/Stock Duster and it should do 10.50s conservatively built.
 
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This is some great bench racing here...or is it a "twisted" version of bench racing I dunno...:)
Ceedawg said:
I get what you’re saying but your budget doesn’t allow enough money to get past a stock 340 in perfect tune. It already starts with the best heads, intake, compression, carb and cam
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That's kind of what I'm saying the 318 mod guys don't know anything the Chrysler engineers didnt. I still think the engnes should be dynoed for horsepower, going "faster" inserts a whole 'nother set of variables. One edge they may have is using "modern" parts, roller cam etc. whereas the 340 guys budget may be blown, no money for a roller cam/lifter setup.
 
Dartswinger70 said:
"faster "isnt the term there are too many variables right down to the driver, you be going for pulls on an engine dyno, as in Horsepower at the flywheel. That would make this a bit more cut and dried and accurate if you will. and, you 318 guys are still cheap skates who will dump the money into 340 360 heads and similar "conversion" parts you are in effect just using the block, calling it a 318 is pure lies and bullshit...it makes me wish there werent so many interchangeable parts between the two. I know none of you would use the stock 318 heads, ported or not. truth is, its a dick swinging contest and you 318 guys have little dicks...:)
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calling it a 318 is pure lies and bullshit? with the stock bore and stroke of course it's a 318 ffs :rofl: even you can't argue that, come on now.
so by your theory if you added say trick flow heads, a better inlet and cam etc to your 340 and beat a 440 with it you wouldn't say ''i beat you with only a 340''. 'cos it's not a 340 any more, that's pure lies and bullshit, at least according to you right?
 
mygasser said:
calling it a 318 is pure lies and bullshit? with the stock bore and stroke of course it's a 318 ffs :rofl: even you can't argue that, come on now.
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That 318 would be so heavily modded it would be half 340 lets not bullshit each other here...yu guys would graft in magnum parts if you could get away with it, I mean ... come on man...yes its bullshit. Look up Nicks garage he does a stock 340 dyno pull I believe the results were 320 HP...
 
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this is getting funny now as the diehard 340 guys are getting backed into a corner knowing they can't win. at least not based on the original theoretical post of buy and build for 3k, which is faster/makes more power? so they're now throwing abuse, i mean you don't know how big my dick is, lol. and i'm not a 318 guy, i like all motors. i just know when to accept something as correct and not argue because i don't 'like' it.
 
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