Vacuum Problem

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Fitz68

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Ok, so I have the new vacuum tree installed. Per the picture of my old vacuum tree you can see I have two lines running to the distributor plus a tiny line(leftmost in the picture)...and now I have the big 3/8 line running out the top and an additional 1/4 port that I have taped over right now with electric tape because I don't have a plug for it. I have a 3 foot 3/8 fuel line hose running from the vacuum tree to the brake booster(there is also another 18" hose worth from the vacuum gauge. With this current setup I'm getting a steady 16 psi reading on my vacuum pump gauge and my break pedal is basically going right to the floor.

Is this an indication that I don't have enough vacuum to run the booster after all and need an electric vacuum pump or could it be because it's a fuel line...or because the vacuum is degrading because the line is so long....?? Any advice on how to troubleshoot this?
 

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Sounds like a bad master cyl or low fluid or air in lines. Have you tried adjusting and bleeding the brakes? If this doesn't help replace the master.
 
Short length of tubing and a golf tee make a better cap than tape.
As said previous post sounds mechanical or hydraulic .
So do you have brakes when your "break pedal is basically going right to the floor" and the car stops? Do you have rear drums and are the shoes adjusted up properly?
 
First, going to the floor would be a "booster too strong" problem, if anything. But, the pedal still wouldn't go to the floor unless you have the other issues mentioned.

If you do have some brakes, first thing would be to back up and jam the brakes many times in a parking lot. That will make the self-adjusters do their job and could fix your problem. Harder, is to play with the adjustment star wheel thru the slots behind the brake plate.

Air in the system is common if someone who doesn't read touched your brakes. Many newbies here install a new MC without first "bench bleeding" it and get no pedal. Learn to flush new fluid thru since you need to do that regularly in FL (4 yrs max), unless you use silicone fluid.

Most boosters I have seen have a much bigger hose, ~1/4" ID. But, the booster stores vacuum internally, so the hose is just to "recharge the vaccum" so any size "should work" if you don't brake too often.
 
First, going to the floor would be a "booster too strong" problem, if anything. But, the pedal still wouldn't go to the floor unless you have the other issues mentioned.

If you do have some brakes, first thing would be to back up and jam the brakes many times in a parking lot. That will make the self-adjusters do their job and could fix your problem. Harder, is to play with the adjustment star wheel thru the slots behind the brake plate.

Air in the system is common if someone who doesn't read touched your brakes. Many newbies here install a new MC without first "bench bleeding" it and get no pedal. Learn to flush new fluid thru since you need to do that regularly in FL (4 yrs max), unless you use silicone fluid.

Most boosters I have seen have a much bigger hose, ~1/4" ID. But, the booster stores vacuum internally, so the hose is just to "recharge the vaccum" so any size "should work" if you don't brake too often.

Exactly.
"pedal should never go to the floor unless something else is wrong"

I don't know if the backing up and hitting the brakes will adjust that much out though, if any in the condition they are right now.
I'd do whatever it took to get pedal back first, then try the backup/stop as a final adjustment.
 
What ^^^ they said plus
1) fuel line is the wrong stuff for the booster. It has little to no resistance to vacuum inside it and will collapse and pass no vacuum through it in a short time. And
2) manifold vacuum has nothing to do with your pedal on the floor issue. For whatever reason, pedal going to the floor, is because the piston in the M/C went to the bottom.
The above ideas will probably reveal the reason.
 
Thank you all very much. So I decided to pay to have the system bled to rule out air in the system. So now I have excellent stopping power....but the brake pedal will not come back up. The pedal goes down and just sticks. Ugh--now what!?
 
Every time I have ever seen this happen it was a bad vacuum booster.
I had one go in a Lincoln I had and when I touched the brake pedal it would take off for the floor on it's own and bring the car to a stop right in the middle of the street.
I would have to shut the car off, get out and open the hood to pull the vacuum line off the booster to get it to let go.
Finally I just left the vacuum off of the booster to get it home.
Replaced the booster and it worked perfect again.
 
So far as the vacuum, me not unnersa'tan

"two lines to distributor??"

tape is never good.

3/8 fuel line varies. A LOT, it varies, it does. Fuel line was never intended to be vacuum line, AKA "it collapses."

None of the above may be related to the problem, already covered, above.
 
TB is right, If the reaction valve in the booster is cracked or busted. But notice he says the pedal took off on its own, and the engine was running.
Inside the booster is a very large powerful spring. Part of its job, is to return the control valve inside it, to its resting, un-applied position. In doing this, it also returns the pedal rod.If for some reason the valve doesnt return, then neither will the pedal. So the question is; Does the pedal return with the engine off, and the booster purged of vacuum, or does it not matter at all? The vacuum in the booster has to be purged, for this test to work.
If the pedal does return, with the booster purged, then the spring is ok.Pump it up several times just to satisfy yourself. Let the pedal return to the top. Start the engine. Does the pedal remain at the top?
1)If no it falls down, then the booster is faulty or the atmospheric valve is open. This could be due to a too-long pushrod adjustment. The easy fix is to loosen the booster retaining nuts and move it away from the firewall about 1/8 inch and retest.If you get the same results, get a different booster. But if the pedal now remains at the top, then shorten the pushrod.And retest
2)If yes, the pedal remains at the top; Put a wee bit of pressure on the brake pedal.Put a little more on it. If at any time it takes off and stays on the floor, Then the control valve is faulty and by definition the booster is junk.

But if the booster proves to be ok,and the pedal is not sticking, and the pedal still wont return, then;
first check all your rubber lines for clamps. Sometimes in the past , to isolate problems, I have had to clamp the lines. If the fluid cant return to the m/c, then the pedal wont return either.Perhaps your paid help forgot to remove a clamp.
After that check;
A) When you lift the pedal back to the top,does the pedal flop right back down again as soon as you release it? or B)Does the pedal stay at the top?This would indicate a possible pedal stiction problem
If A), the pedal flops right back down, That indicates the pedal assy is ok, and not sticking in any way.It also tells us that the piston in the M/C is staying in the bottom of its bore.So lets figure out why.The short answer is its stuck there, ei its no good.But there are two reasons for its not returning.The first is mechanical.Its physically stuck. The second is hydraulic.So Heres the hydraulic check:
I would check for fluid returning in the m/c. This requires a helper, and is done with the engine turned OFF/NOT running..First put rags all around the m/c to a radius of 1.5 ft, and extra layers towards the windshield,over the cowl. Then pop the m/cap.Have your assistant stroke the pedal down about 1 inch, and then very SLOWLY let the pedal back up.If the pedal sticks down, he will have to put a toe under it and lift it up, SLOWLY.While he is doing that you will be watching the fluid in the reservoirs. You will be looking for a little fluid roiling or even a little fountain, which is indicating the fluid returning. If at 1 inch stroke no fluid is seen to be returning, stroke again but adding 1/2 inch, again SLOWLY returning the pedal. Returning the pedal slowly is important because if the fluid is allowed to return too quickly, the fountain can be a gusher. When that occurs the fluid can spew up and hit the underside of the hood. Of course on its way back down it falls everywhere except back into the reservoirs. So remember-SLOWLY.Continue adding stroke until you see the fountain.This will prove that A) the m/c is working, and B) the seals in the calipers are doing their seal-retraction function, and C) the flex hoses are open, and D) the rear shoe return springs are on and able to do their job ie, the wheel cylinders are not frozen.
There is a slim chance that the fountain will not appear. Very slim. But if there is no fountain, now you have 4 possible reasons why. I would start with looking in the rear drums, then the flex hoses.In the end, you may discover that the short answer was right all along. But now you have proven it, have learned a bit about how it works, and are not just replacing parts with the hope that the problem will somehow solve itself, and are spending money once.
Happy hunting!
 
If your distributor is hooked up to intake vacuum, you need to change it to ported vacuum off the distributor.

But that's not what's causing your brake problem...
 
I 3rd the "bad booster" issue. When the rubber diaphragm gets a crack, it sometimes leaks (no boost), then the crack closes and it comes on real strong. I drove a company car (GM) once that would almost throw you thru the windshield. They had warned me "the brakes are touchy". That was my first time driving one w/ power brakes, but probably had a defect. My 65 Newport started doing similar, plus I could hear a vacuum hiss in the cabin. Replacing the booster fixed it. That was 1992 when you could still find these boosters affordably.
 
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