225 Slant no spark

Slant 6 Engines

  1. rustyfish

    rustyfish Unwell Member

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    Hey, I just brought home a '64 Cuda. Originally a v8 car, converted to slant 6 after 273 blew up apparently. First try on a battery after going through a prestart check and lube of the cylinders produced no sound whatsoever. Found a broken NSS and fixed that. Cranks over now but no spark. Replaced coil, condensor, and cap. Checked all 6 plugs, no spark.

    Ideas?
     
  2. Arethius

    Arethius Member

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    I just went through a somewhat similar experience... Try and hot wire it by running a wire from the positive battery terminal to the positive post on the ignition coil and use a screw driver to connect the solenoids on your relay. This bypasses the wiring of the ignition switch and if it works, I'd double check the connections going into the firewall and consequently, the other side under the dash.

    Keep in mind, I may be talking out my ass as I don't have anymore experience than trying to fix my 70 dart slant 6 that I've had for a little over a month.

    If you're still running points, I would double check those as well and see if you're getting any spark at them.
     
  3. 67Dart273

    67Dart273 Well-Known Member

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    Get your multimeter. Clip it to the coil + and ground, and turn the key to "run."

    See what you have. You will either have "same as battery" or very low, around 6V + / -

    Bump the engine and see if the voltage changes as the point open / close.

    If no change, remove the cap. Bump the engine until the points appear closed. You should have lower voltage, 6--8V or so

    Bump the engine until the points are open. You should have "same as battery" 12.6 or whatever battery reads.

    If it stays high, "same as battery" the points are not closing, or are not making electrical contact

    If it stays lower, points are not opening, or something is shorted to ground.

    If points ARE going high/ low in this test, replace the condenser. You must have a good condenser. "New" does not mean "functional."

    ============================

    Another way is to bump until the points are open. Use a jumper wire or screwdriver to spark the points wire connection to ground. Should make a spark.

    Suspect points / points gap, condenser, coil, coil wire.

    Check spark with a grounded probe in coil tower, or inline spark checker, eliminating the coil wire
     
  4. jonesscamp1973

    jonesscamp1973 Member

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    Hello im new here sorry to jump threads but im having starting problems to just changex distributors and now no spark from coil thanks for time
     
  5. mvh

    mvh FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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    I might check the engine-to-frame ground wire -- it might not have been replaced after the engine swap.
     
  6. momoparman

    momoparman MOISMYHOME

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    Sigh.....throwing money at the problem will not necessarily fix it. Try a bit of trouble shooting first. A multi-meter is a few bucks at Harbor Freight....much cheaper than coils and plugs and wires and distributors and etc.

    If you follow the simple test that 67Dart273 posted you could be up and running and on your way to a steak dinner already. :D

    Don't be an Askhole......
     
  7. rustyfish

    rustyfish Unwell Member

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    Thanks for all the tips. I'll check all the free suggestions, connections, points, voltmeter.
     
  8. 340doc

    340doc Well-Known Member

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    Did you verify the dist was turning? seen a couple slants with a broken plastic drive gear.
     
  9. rustyfish

    rustyfish Unwell Member

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    Update. So the dist is turning. I checked the coil in both start and run at the positive post and am getting about 5.5 volts in both positions. It's a brand new coil with new wires, points, rotor and cap. Could the ballast resistor be the problem? Seems like I'm down to that or the relay. Should I try a hot wire to the coil?
     
  10. momoparman

    momoparman MOISMYHOME

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    Go to MyMopar.com and you will find many trouble shooting guides that will help you further.

    Start with this one since your wondering about your ballast resistor.

    http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=115

    Then move on if that doesn't solve your problem. If you keep digging you will eventually find your issue. Check all your grounds including component to body grounds as well since there has to be a path for the current to flow.

    Here are the wiring diagrams for your use.

    http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1964/64ValiantA.jpg

    http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1964/64ValiantB.jpg

    Take your time and stay calm and focused. Electrical problems can be a bear if you have never worked on them. The trick is to stay on one thing at a time so you don't get confused or miss something simple.

    Do some more testing then if your still stuck take a break and start over. I wish I could help more but without having my hands on it I can only do so much.

    If you haven't done all the steps in post number 3 then go back and do the steps from beginning to end.
     
  11. 67Dart273

    67Dart273 Well-Known Member

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    You need to pull the dist cap and get your hands wet

    Re read what I posted. You need to figure out if the points are opening and closing, and actually switching electricity, IE they are not remaining open or closed, or corroded, or something else shorted

    There are MANY ways to approach this

    ======================================

    With the cap off, bump the engine until the points are open. You can do this with a screwdriver jumpering the two exposed terminals on the starter relay.

    With points open, and key in "run" you should have "same as battery" at coil positive.

    You should ALSO have "same as battery" at coil NEG ative.

    ======================================

    So now you have shown that the points are open. With the key still in "run" use a clip lead or screwdriver to short the points "hot" terminal (or the coil NEG terminal) to ground. With a grounded terminal held "just in" the coil tower, you should get a snappy spark

    If not post back

    If so move on...................

    =======================================

    Bump the engine until the points are CLOSED. Take voltmeter readings on both coil + and - and post them here.

    You SHOULD bet about 5 at coil + and very low voltage at coil -

    =========================================

    Hook voltmeter to coil +. Crank engine USING THE KEY and take a reading while cranking. You should have AT LEAST 10.5 V

    Post back
     
  12. rustyfish

    rustyfish Unwell Member

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    Getting .7 Ohms resistance between terminals on the ballast resistor with all connections to it unplugged. That's a far cry from the 1.2 I think it should be.
     
  13. 67Dart273

    67Dart273 Well-Known Member

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    It might not be the original resistor. Regardless, that is not your problem.

    Please re- read what I posted.

    In "start" (assuming the car wiring is OK) and using the key to crank the car, the ignition switch sends battery voltage DIRECTLY to the coil by means of the brown wire. You can see that wire going to the ballast resistor on one end.

    What this means is, you can remove the ballast resistor and toss it in a nearby lake, and the car will fire for a split second while cranking the engine.

    This in part is why my posting was as it is --- to try and find out what is going on
     
  14. BillGrissom

    BillGrissom Well-Known Member

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    You cannot measure a ballast resistance accurately, and it changes as it heats. Measuring voltage @ coil is correct method. But back up. Run a jumper from BATT+ direct to coil+ (as told), then you get +12 V. You can run that way for 5 min and while checking for spark.

    Check spark from the coil tower. That bypasses the distributor rotor. Do you have a spark tester (cheap at Harbor Freight)? Otherwise try to rig a real spark plug up to see or have your wife hold the plug wire 1/4" from the intake and jump when it zaps her, then look for a new wife.

    Do you have a multimeter (free w/ coupon @ HF) and have you read the gazillion posts here? Worst-case, you could pull the distributor and spin it by hand to check spark. Ground the case to BATT-.
     
  15. AJ/FormS

    AJ/FormS 68 B'cuda fb, Form S clone ... 367/A833/3.55s FABO Gold Member

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    Set it on fire



    Get it?
     
  16. rustyfish

    rustyfish Unwell Member

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    Upon closer inspection, and a smoking wire near the ballast resistor that I just replaced, it would seem that there are several suspect wires (homemade splices here and there) as well as melty bulkhead sockets. So the problem is not quite as simple as it may have seemed initially. I do have a multimeter but now not so sure I don't need to replace some sections after more due diligence. Any recommendations for replacement bulkhead connectors?
     
  17. BillGrissom

    BillGrissom Well-Known Member

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    The jumper from battery to coil+ will get it sparking for now just to test the engine. I had to hot-wire my 64 Valiant slant like that to get it home since the key switch wiring had been buggered (fool wired electric radiator fan to ignition w/ no relay). After 5 min driving, it started missing badly >45 mph and the coil was real hot, so I ran another jumper to wire thru the ballast and was then fine.

    For long-term, consider installing the better 1965 bulkhead. I did in my 64. I had to cut the sheet-metal opening ~1/8" taller. I bought the bulkhead on ebay (completed cabin harness for 65 Fury). In 1965 (and 63), they used 2 big buss-bars to feed the high current ALT and BAT wires thru, so you don't get the infamous "melted bulkhead" problem.

    The terminal inserts are common "Packard 56" or "56 terminal", used on Mopar and GM (and home appliances). You can buy on ebay. Many photos here detail them. Use a thin screwdriver (or special tool) to release the females. Squeeze the male ones longitudinally at the base to release.

    At same time, I totally rewired my engine side, using a relay/fuse box from a Jeep, in both my Dart & Valiant. Need to do similar for my Newport since its engine wires are brittle. The cabin wires are good in all 3 cars, other than PO hacks I had to fix.
     
  18. rustyfish

    rustyfish Unwell Member

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    Thanks Bill. Used to live in midtown Sac at 24th & U. Migrated Midwest. I'll look into those bulkhead connectors.
     
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