318 camshaft timing question

[junkyardhero]

So, I will get a compression test done. Just need a few more days.
I believe that the carb is lean. It runs a lot better while the choke is partially closed and cold. At the very least tomorrow, I want to put a larger squirter in it.
Is there a spark plug that I should use with the 10-15% ethanol gasoline that would be better than the Champions? I'll order them from Rockauto.com and have them here by the weekend.
Yeah, my elevation is darn near sea level. There is a point at the inlet, it seems like the road goes below sea level at the base of the bridge, but the dunes give it that optical illusion.
Thanks for everything and I hope to get something done tomorrow

get the compression and report back
the carb is likely lean, so you'll need some jets to fatten it up.
the squirter only effects the initial crack of the throttle as the butterflies open and introduce more air an immediate richening event needs to occur or the car goes lean and falls flat on its face.

so in essence, if the jump off the line is good and it's not popping and farting or falling down or bogging hard, changing the squirter yields nothing.

 

[George Jets]

☆☆☆☆☆

 

[TT5.9mag]

If it runs better hot with the choke partially on, then one of two things is definitely true. Either the main metering system has trash in it, or the main jets are way undersized.

Or what the raccoon said in the next post.

 

[junkyardhero]

If it runs better hot with the choke partially on, then one of two things is definitely true. Either the main metering system has trash in it, or the main jets are way undersized.

or... hear me out... v-v-v-v-vacuum leak!

(look pal, don't @ me. i'm just over here advocating for devils alright)

 

[TT5.9mag]

@junkyardhero I don’t trust raccoons. Especially the kind that advocate for devils.

 

[junkyardhero]

@junkyardhero I don’t trust raccoons. Especially the kind that advocate for devils.

as well you shouldn't!

*cinches up trench coat*

 

[mygasser]

i've never liked champion plugs myself, i always use ngk.
neil.

 

[RustyRatRod]

ya rabid bastid. lol

 

[George Jets]

Here is an interesting comment from @halifaxhops about what can be contributing to engine ping.

* * * * *

 

[67Dart273]

Use your timing light. And your tach. Plot the curve.

THIS here. Not that hard. Pull the vacuum if you use it, and plot the curve at several RPM points, use a helper if needed. You need to read the tach and the light, and write it down. then get one of those hand pump vacuum testers and add the vacuum into the mix

Decades ago, I had a 340 and other SBs in my old 62 Landcruiser. Various carbs, including a couple of different QJ's, a Thermoquad, and Holley spreadbore. I think the QJ was the "worst," with a modified dual point 340 factory dist, at least one of the carbs provided way too much early vacuum to the distributor, and that thing would rattle like crazy. This was with the desired mechanical "total" cranked in. I usually just ran it with no vacuum. I guess back then I as stupidly worrying about fuel mileage. That thing would not get mpg if you pushed it off a cliff with an empty tank

 

[Big.J.007]

I had pinging issue with my 440 running too cold of a thermostat, it was a high flow 160.. I installed a high flow 180 and left the timing alone. The issue went away... Engines need some heat to burn the moisture off from condensation. It sounds more like an incomplete burn issue than too much engine. Essentially with the 318 you have it should run like butter on moose pi$$

 

[TT5.9mag]

I had pinging issue with my 440 running too cold of a thermostat, it was a high flow 160.. I installed a high flow 180 and left the timing alone. The issue went away...

Huh? That’s almost not possible. There’s no way adding more temperature to an engine cured a detonation problem. And moisture (water) in the chamber would be an anti-detonate.

 

[Big.J.007]

I'm here to tell you it sure the hell cured it

Huh? That’s almost not possible. There’s no way adding more temperature to an engine cured a detonation problem.

 

[TT5.9mag]

I'm here to tell you it sure the hell cured it

And I’m here to tell you some other other factor was involved. The ONE absolute, necessary variable that has to be present for detonation to occur, is heat. Make it colder and the chance for detonation is ALWAYS less. And I hate using the word always but in this circumstance it works.

 

[Big.J.007]

Sir, you me and many others do not know or fully understand all scenarios or obstacles. Your free to feel as you want, in my case nothing else was changed. I'm sure you've heard of vehicles being cold natured and running better when fully warmed up.. in my situation my engine never fully warmed up with a 160 stat and was running as such. Stumbling, stalling, pinging ect. Yes the choke worked, yes timing was correct yes, all ignition components were working correctly, fuel system, electrical ect. This isn't my 1st 2nd or 3rd rodeo. You can chalk it up as you learned something new, congratulations.

And I’m here to tell you some other other factor was involved. The ONE absolute, necessary variable that has to be present for detonation to occur, is heat. Make it colder and the chance for detonation is ALWAYS less. And I hate using the word always but in this circumstance it works.

 

[TT5.9mag]

Sir, you me and many others do not know or fully understand all scenarios or obstacles. You’re free to feel as you want, in my case nothing else was changed. I'm sure you've heard of vehicles being cold natured and running better when fully warmed up.. in my situation my engine never fully warmed up with a 160 stat and was running as such. Stumbling, stalling, pinging ect. Yes the choke worked, yes timing was correct yes, all ignition components were working correctly, fuel system, electrical ect. This isn't my 1st 2nd or 3rd rodeo. You can chalk it up as you learned something new, congratulations.

I don’t pretend to know everything and certainly wouldn’t claim that. But there is a few areas I have studied extensively because of my history with engines and one of those is cylinder pressure and detonation because of my love of turbocharging. Your engine did not re write the laws of physics or defy science. There were other factors involved and not tested for.

 

[Kendog 170]

 

[gliderider06]

Ok folks. I got some work done today. Waiting on 57 jets and a new 4 window, 10.5 power valve. Supposed to arrive later.
I did a compression test. 160-165 across the board, cold with throttle open.
Verified TDC, which was on.
Engine is not running hot. Pictures are after driving 34miles into work. I have a 3 row aluminum radiator which keeps the dude cool.
No vacuum leaks. Sprayed carb cleaner and no change in rpm.
Changed the squirter from a 25 to 28
Changed the plugs from autolite AP64 to NGK BPR6ES, which Napa said was the autolite 63 equivalent.
I ran out of time and have to go get my son from school. Hopefully Sunday I will get a few more hours to work on it after my wife gets home from work and jet the carb up and put a larger advance stop bushing in the MSD distributor.
Here are some pictures.

 

[Big.J.007]

Honestly that's way too cold for driving 34 miles.. that engine never fully warms up. Are you sure this is truly a pinging issue and not just the plugs loading up?

 

[TT5.9mag]

Plugs 3 and 4 (and maybe 1) look like they’re eating coolant.

 

[Big.J.007]

They look lean as hell!! They should never be bone white porcelain color. Hell, even the other 5 plugs look like they are cold which essentially causes more emission problems. All that unburnt fuel sits in the cat

 

[gliderider06]

Honestly that's way too cold for driving 34 miles.. that engine never fully warms up. Are you sure this is truly a pinging issue and not just the plugs loading up?

I'm sure it's pinging. It was 27* outside that morning, but yes, that's the temperature it usually runs at. I have a 160* thermostat in it, because before the new radiator it used to run hot and I hadn't changed it out for a 180* after changing the radiator last spring.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Have you plotted a timing curve yet? The cranking compression, if accurate, should be well inside the boundaries of detonation. So now we need to know exactly what and when the curve is.

 

[gliderider06]

Thank you everyone. I got it all sorted out. Colder plugs, jetted the carburetor up and larger power valve and squirter. I changed the limit stop bushing in the distributor for the next larger one. Lubed the distributor weights with silicone and they slide much easier now. 12* initial, 32* with mechanical and 46* with vacuum advance. Have driven it about 225 miles and haven't heard anything. Milage seems to be up slightly, but i will very at next fill up.
Thanks again for everything!