416 Burning oil and the road to redemption

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RAMM

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Just have to share what I consider an excellent opportunity to learn. This 416 R3/Eddy SFT combo has been sent to me from one of our very own members of FABO. The engine was built some time ago and runs excellent and strong just consumes far too much oil.

The plan here is to dyno test it as is, disassemble, repair/replace whatever is necessary and re-dyno test. The idea here is basically a refresh with hopefully just rings, bearings, gaskets etc... Hopefully nothing serious needs to be replaced such as pistons, guides, etc....

What I like to do in a case like this is a full compression test on all cylinders. This will reveal some useful info.Testing on the dyno is just to serve as a baseline. I'm not going to be searching for every ounce of power or unnecessarily beating on it. This will reveal some useful info. This thread will be updated in real time, as I just began the hookup on the dyno. Testing begins Monday. J.Rob

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Here are the full compression test results. Pretty good number for pump gas and right where I expected it. I kinda do comp tests like blood pressure. The number on top is what the cylinder pumped on the first revolution. Second number is what it pumped after five rev's. J.Rob

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RAMM said:
Here are the full compression test results. Pretty good number for pump gas and right where I expected it. I kinda do comp tests like blood pressure. The number on top is what the cylinder pumped on the first revolution. Second number is what it pumped after five rev's. J.Rob

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Did you shoot some oil in #5 to see if it would improve?
 
skrews said:
If those Eddy heads have the black rubber seals thats where I'd lay the blame.
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I will be using metal clad blue Viton's but that doesn't explain #5's poor comp results. I think the rings are washed and a good plate hone deglaze and new rings will make this right as rain. J.Rob
 
70aarcuda said:
Had problems with those seals also...any eddy head...I throw them away..ASAP
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A fairly well known engine builder in the US built this engine originally and I won't know what seals are on there until I get the springs off. It's possible they have been changed to the better ones already. J.Rob
 
RAMM said:
A fairly well known engine builder in the US built this engine originally and I won't know what seals are on there until I get the springs off. It's possible they have been changed to the better ones already. J.Rob
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Engine is up and running and running pretty good. So far timing is 36 total and 509 tq @ 4200 rpm / 488 hp @ 5800 rpm. The air is pretty good today so C.F. is 4%. There is a pretty decent amount of vapors coming out of the valve covers as well. Going to record manifold vacuum for future reference as well. J.Rob
 
RAMM said:
Engine is up and running and running pretty good. So far timing is 36 total and 509 tq @ 4200 rpm / 488 hp @ 5800 rpm. The air is pretty good today so C.F. is 4%. There is a pretty decent amount of vapors coming out of the valve covers as well. Going to record manifold vacuum for future reference as well. J.Rob
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I would have expected more of them horsepowers
 
o1heavy said:
I would have expected more of them horsepowers
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Added a 1" open spacer and manifold vac line. Final test: 499.4 HP @ 5800 rpm 517 TQ @ 4300 rpm. It also had 7.5-7.7" vacuum @ 1050-1100 rpm. It will be interesting to see if it picks up after going through it. J.Rob
 
Disassembly is complete. The ring gap on both the top and second ring is quite large. This gap in the photo took .055" of feeler gauge. J.Rob

IMG_20161212_140218.JPG
 
How far is the bore oversized? .005 wear is .015 extra gap but damn that is still .040 gap. Does it have hyper Pistons?
 
yellow rose said:
How far is the bore oversized? .005 wear is .015 extra gap but damn that is still .040 gap. Does it have hyper Pistons?
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The pistons are nice Ross forgings. I think I know what happened here. I think these are 4.060" rings and the bore actually measures 4.0715" for exactly .005" piston skirt clearance. Every .001" increase in bore opens ring gap up .003" (pi) So roughly .036" end gap plus the usual .018" gap a non-file fit ring set gives and we have .054". J.Rob
 
RAMM said:
The pistons are nice Ross forgings. I think I know what happened here. I think these are 4.060" rings and the bore actually measures 4.0715" for exactly .005" piston skirt clearance. Every .001" increase in bore opens ring gap up .003" (pi) So roughly .036" end gap plus the usual .018" gap a non-file fit ring set gives and we have .054". J.Rob
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This is why you have to verify everything.

If that is the case, that one is on the guy who did the assembly. It's possible that the rings were marked as .030 and were really .020 over, or they are .060 over 360 rings.

I've had everything you can think of come boxed wrong. If the guy doing the assembly actually verified end gap he would have caught it.

Luckily it wasn't the other way around.
 
yellow rose said:
This is why you have to verify everything.

If that is the case, that one is on the guy who did the assembly. It's possible that the rings were marked as .030 and were really .020 over, or they are .060 over 360 rings.

I've had everything you can think of come boxed wrong. If the guy doing the assembly actually verified end gap he would have caught it.

Luckily it wasn't the other way around.
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The original build sheet has the gaps recorded as .018" / .014" and the ring part # is correct (CR7590-35). So maybe someone went crazy with the ring filer?? J.Rob
 
Definately the wrong rings. Just checked the oil rail and the gap on it is .100"+ and the expander is not even close to be right. J.Rob
 
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