5.9 stroker build

[Kern Dog]

One thing that always impresses me is when an engine that I built ends up not only running, but is reliable.
Take that how you want, it just boggles my mind how engines hold together and run and run and run.
Think about it....You had the engine A P A R T. It was in several separate pieces and now it is all assembled and it runs when you start it. It moves the car when you drive it and YOU made it happen. There is something really cool about being a part in that.

 

[mopowers]

Is this one up and running?! Do tell.

 

[Kern Dog]

I could….but this is Rich’s story to tell.

 

[4eighteener]

To quote Dr Frankenstein: "It's alive, it's alive (evil laugh)!

 

[mopowers]

How's this sumbitch running???

 

[Kern Dog]

I can tell you that it runs great but the OP has the right of way here.....
@RBConvert

 

[RBConvert]

How's this sumbitch running???

Sorry for the long delay, I've been catching up on my overdue To Do list.
The short answer is the engine runs like a beast. Haven't run it on a dyno to verify, but the original goal was to end up around 500 hp/500 ft-lbs torque. The seat-of-the-pants feel, feels like the goals were met. Gobs of low end torque. With all the additional power, I replaced the original clutch and pp with the McLeod Super Street Pro kit. Between the low end torque and the grabby clutch, it's almost impossible not to peel out from a standing start. I love it!
The experience is vastly different than the original 360/380 hp crate motor. With the narrow lsa and M1 single plane manifold, the crate motor didn't start hitting it's stride until around 3000 rpm. Now its instant torque right off the line.
This seems unlikely, but the engine is quieter now when cruising in 4th or 5th gear. It's the same headers and exhaust, but I'm hearing less drone at cruising speed.
Going back to the start-up, I was very anxious that it would start immediately, even though with a roller cam the initial start isn't as critical as with a FT cam. Greg and I followed the SOP for initial start-up: #1 piston on compression stroke, distributor rotor slightly advanced from #1, verified spark, gas in the fuel lines with Greg priming the carb. The motor fired on the 2nd revolution.
It was a surprise that there was only one minor leak, at the rear of the oil pan (its not the rear main seal). I gave an extra 1/4 turn to the rear-most oil pan bolts and the leak seemed to have slowed, but it's slow enough that it won't need to be addressed until the 500 mile oil change. But no coolant or gasoline leaks.
My cars aren't built for show, they're sort-of daily drivers. Having said that, this engine sits proud in the engine compartment. Greg's choice of GoMango was a homerun, and I'm glad that I painted the TF heads and the intake manifold. The color is a nice offset to the plain white surroundings. The valve covers are Summit.
So far I've only put 250 miles on her, as I'm now tracing down a parasitic drain and a stuck horn, both issues that were present before the build started.

 

[Kern Dog]

That is a good looking engine. It looks so tangy, you could almost LICK it.

 

[Kern Dog]

To those members considering an engine swap in the future....
P L E A S E consider doing the Body drop method of removal and installation. It saves time, effort and avoids damage.
Imagine for a moment having the engine right in front of you completely unobstructed....no fenders, hood, firewall or core support blocking access. Headers can go in easily. Whatever difficulties you may have with aligning the pulleys and bracketry is now easier to reach.
You can do this with a car lift or without.
This project was only the second time this car lift has been used for this. The other time was in 2022 with a Charger.
You can do this with an engine hoist lifting up the front of the car. If you can weld, you can make a U shaped bracket that attaches to the front bumper mounts in the frame rails. If you can't weld, there are companies that make the lifting bracket.
When you do the body drop, the transmission is installed with the engine which speeds things up a LOT. It makes wrestling a transmission up and in the car a thing of the past.

 

[RBConvert]

I want to circle back to the valve train. To recap, the hyd roller cam is from Hughes. I reused the OEM lifters. The PRW rocker arms and the geometry correcting spacers are from B3 Racing. Mike Beachel is one of the really good guys in our hobby. During the rocker arm install I reached out to him 2 or 3 times for some clarification, and each call he took the time to thoroughly answer my questions.
It was a little nerve racking for me, measuring and shimming for correct gaps. The included instructions were a tad ambiguous (for a novice like me), and after shimming and installing the arms, it was obvious that there was too much clearance between the pedestals. A call into Mike solved the issue. The instructions call for .015 - .020" gap between pedestals; I interpreted it as the same gap, but between each rocker arm, essentially doubling the gap. Mike said that my initial gap wouldn't necessarily hurt anything on a street driven engine, but it would be noisy. I went back and re-shimmed to get within specs. The pushrods are Smith Bros ball and ball.
Next to the ring filing, dialing in the rocker arms was the most time consuming piece of the build.
But it works. The engine has zero valve train noise.

I wound up adding a paint dab to one side of each pedestal spacer. The mounting holes are offset left-to-right, so makes a difference when shimming which way they are oriented.

That is a good looking engine. It looks so tangy, you could almost LICK it.

BTW, I forgot to mention that upon the initial fire-up, we had 80 psi cold oil pressure. The 76 psi below was during the oil pump priming.

 

[Icetech]

I want to circle back to the valve train. To recap, the hyd roller cam is from Hughes. I reused the OEM lifters. The PRW rocker arms and the geometry correcting spacers are from B3 Racing. Mike Beachel is one of the really good guys in our hobby. During the rocker arm install I reached out to him 2 or 3 times for some clarification, and each call he took the time to thoroughly answer my questions.
It was a little nerve racking for me, measuring and shimming for correct gaps. The included instructions were a tad ambiguous (for a novice like me), and after shimming and installing the arms, it was obvious that there was too much clearance between the pedestals. A call into Mike solved the issue. The instructions call for .015 - .020" gap between pedestals; I interpreted it as the same gap, but between each rocker arm, essentially doubling the gap. Mike said that my initial gap wouldn't necessarily hurt anything on a street driven engine, but it would be noisy. I went back and re-shimmed to get within specs. The pushrods are Smith Bros ball and ball.
Next to the ring filing, dialing in the rocker arms was the most time consuming piece of the build.
But it works. The engine has zero valve train noise.
View attachment 1716424635 View attachment 1716424636
I wound up adding a paint dab to one side of each pedestal spacer. The mounting holes are offset left-to-right, so makes a difference when shimming which way they are oriented.
View attachment 1716424637

BTW, I forgot to mention that upon the initial fire-up, we had 80 psi cold oil pressure. The 76 psi below was during the oil pump priming.
View attachment 1716424639

View attachment 1716424638

How far off were the rockers before the shims from b3? i have TFs with the mancini rockers and my sweep was really good without shimming, not sure if i missed something i should have done..

 

[RBConvert]

A PSA for those builders wanting to use the Cometic MLS head gaskets. Some of the rivets that bond the three layers interfere with the head-to-block. My magnum block needed clearancing in three places; Greg's standard block only needed to be clearanced in one spot. Ehrenberg ran into this same issue during his 2020 360 build.

 

[RBConvert]

How far off were the rockers before the shims from b3? i have TFs with the mancini rockers and my sweep was really good without shimming, not sure if i missed something i should have done..

I bought the shims and rockers from B3 at the same time. Mike has a spec form for the user to fill out. Based upon the head, cam specs, rocker arms (which he supplied), Mike mills the spacers.
Honestly, at my novice level I can't say I would notice a difference. The upside is talking to Mike and gaining his experience. For example, TF highly recommends the HS rockers, made for the TF heads. In reality, HS is not the only TF vendor; Mike prefers the cup type rocker arm adjusters on the PRW's vs the ball type.

 

[Icetech]

I bought the shims and rockers from B3 at the same time. Mike has a spec form for the user to fill out. Based upon the head, cam specs, rocker arms (which he supplied), Mike mills the spacers.
Honestly, at my novice level I can't say I would notice a difference. The upside is talking to Mike and gaining his experience. For example, TF highly recommends the HS rockers, made for the TF heads. In reality, HS is not the only TF vendor; Mike prefers the cup type rocker arm adjusters on the PRW's vs the ball type.

Ah ok, was just curious.. not too worried bout it

 

[Kern Dog]

I was impressed at how easily the engine started.
Holy crap, man....here this is a roller cammed engine that could far better tolerate a prolonged crank, crank, crank (no spark and no fire) yet it started up faster than any other build I have seen.
No exhaust leaks?
No fuel leaks?
That is impressive because I often see leaks in a few spots.
The engine has more cackle than before. The exhaust note is crispy.

 

[pishta]

E85 takes +30% jets alone to work on a holley ( ie. 76 to 99s) . Can buy them set up for E85 already. E85 is 101-110+ Octane depending on who's you buy and its inlet temp is like 50-70F lower than 91 so it reduces pinging even more. E85 is still cheaper here in CA than crap 87 unleaded but you need 30% more.

 

[Kern Dog]

E85 takes +30% jets alone to work on a holley ( ie. 76 to 99s) . Can buy them set up for E85 already. E85 is 101-110+ Octane depending on who's you buy and its inlet temp is like 50-70F lower than 91 so it reduces pinging even more. E85 is still cheaper here in CA than crap 87 unleaded but you need 30% more.

????

 

[NC Engine Builder]

How far off were the rockers before the shims from b3? i have TFs with the mancini rockers and my sweep was really good without shimming, not sure if i missed something i should have done..

My experience has been trick flow geometry is way better than any of the other edelbrock knockoffs

 

[RBConvert]

One thing that always impresses me is when an engine that I built ends up not only running, but is reliable.
Take that how you want, it just boggles my mind how engines hold together and run and run and run.
Think about it....You had the engine A P A R T. It was in several separate pieces and now it is all assembled and it runs when you start it. It moves the car when you drive it and YOU made it happen. There is something really cool about being a part in that.

It's cool, and very rewarding.

 

[mopowers]

That's awesome! Does your block have the provision for shaft oiling? I'm assuming not and that all oiling is through the pushrods?

 

[RBConvert]

That's awesome! Does your block have the provision for shaft oiling? I'm assuming not and that all oiling is through the pushrods?

Correct, oiling thru the pushrods.

 

[mopowers]

I forget - Where'd this stroker end up as far as compression?

Also, have you noticed it running any hotter than the previous iteration?

 

[crackedback]

To those members considering an engine swap in the future....
P L E A S E consider doing the Body drop method of removal and installation. It saves time, effort and avoids damage.
Imagine for a moment having the engine right in front of you completely unobstructed....no fenders, hood, firewall or core support blocking access. Headers can go in easily. Whatever difficulties you may have with aligning the pulleys and bracketry is now easier to reach.
You can do this with a car lift or without.
This project was only the second time this car lift has been used for this. The other time was in 2022 with a Charger.
You can do this with an engine hoist lifting up the front of the car. If you can weld, you can make a U shaped bracket that attaches to the front bumper mounts in the frame rails. If you can't weld, there are companies that make the lifting bracket.
When you do the body drop, the transmission is installed with the engine which speeds things up a LOT. It makes wrestling a transmission up and in the car a thing of the past.

Agree it is very easy to do.

Make that front lift bar with some low buck angle and square tube. Two forward legs and the crossbar with bolts. Lift from the center of crossbar.

Don't make the mistake of putting the forward legs on and stapping to each and lifting. People have pinched in the front rails doing that. Has to be a vertical dead lift from under each leg.

 

[mopowers]

The pistons are forget Icon, .030" over. The piston rings are file fit, with a .004" factor; meaning an installed gap of .004 for every inch of bore. In my case, 4.030" x .004" = .016" minimum gap. Better to be a little on the bigger gap size than too small so I gapped all 16 rings to a strong .016" / tight .018" (don't have a .017" feeler gauge).

Did you have to do any filing on the 2nd rings that came in your Scat kit? I'm assuming you gapped them the same as the top rings (0.017")?

 

[RBConvert]

Did you have to do any filing on the 2nd rings that came in your Scat kit? I'm assuming you gapped them the same as the top rings (0.017")?

Icon instructed .004" x bore for the 2nd ring, which was the same spec as the top ring. So yes, I filed both top and 2nd to the same 0.017".