67 Barracuda Gen III swap

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Tbone

Tbone

TBone
Joined
Sep 17, 2019
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Location
West Point, UT
I have a 67 Barracuda that currently has a 360 in it, I recently purchased a Gen III 5.7 out of a 17 Challenger. My car is a Formula S 4 speed car and I want to retain the A833 and mechanical clutch. I have the Holley Terminator X Max 13+ DBW computer system, Sniper fabricated manifold, Jet throttle body, SRT8 exhaust manifolds, Mopar FEAD alternator and P/S kit, Mopar rear sump oil pan kit, Comp cams VVT lockout kit, Borgeson steering box, Right Stuff power bake booster and master cyl and Rylis flywheel, I need to know how much of the input on the A833 needs to be shortened, how will a 392 cam and MDS delete kit work and any issues with the combination of parts that I have.
 
Shouldn't have to shorten the input shaft at all.
You'll need a mid-sump pan and pickup to clear the K frame and steering linkage, a rear sump pan will not clear the centerlink on a stock suspension.
 
Professor Fate said:
Shouldn't have to shorten the input shaft at all.
You'll need a mid-sump pan and pickup to clear the K frame and steering linkage, a rear sump pan will not clear the centerlink on a stock suspension.
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I've seen mixed answers on this subject, which I asked, have you fitted the two together? The oil pan was part of a kit, I didn't think it would clear, is there an alternative to the Moroso oil pan that isn't quite as expensive?
 
You WILL need to shorten up the input. The gen 3 engine cranks are not drilled for a bronze style bushing. They use the Magnum style needle bearing. The exhaust manifolds are also a no go. They will swoop right into the inner fenders. TTI headers will be your best bet for keeping performance. Milodon mid sump with a stock k member. The 392 cam will wake up that 5.7. I'm not familiar with the Holley systems. Can you retain the VVT? I've used the Hotwireauto harness, was able to retain the VVT function with the 6.4 cam in the 5.7. Works awesome.
 
408 swinger said:
You WILL need to shorten up the input. The gen 3 engine cranks are not drilled for a bronze style bushing. They use the Magnum style needle bearing. The exhaust manifolds are also a no go. They will swoop right into the inner fenders. TTI headers will be your best bet for keeping performance. Milodon mid sump with a stock k member. The 392 cam will wake up that 5.7. I'm not familiar with the Holley systems. Can you retain the VVT? I've used the Hotwireauto harness, was able to retain the VVT function with the 6.4 cam in the 5.7. Works awesome.
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Thanks 408, I think the Milodon pan and pickup is probably the way I will go, Holley doesn't support the VVT and I've seen from more than one article that the Jeep SRT manifolds work on A bodies, so again mixed info, since I can't retain VVT and FCA has a $100 core on the 6 spd 392 cm I'm looking for a better cam option, can anyone verify fitment on the manifolds and does anyone have another cam suggestion?
 
I can't verify the Jeep SRT manifolds. Never had them in my hands. The 2010-2012 Jeep and Durango 5.7 manifolds do fit. But, they would be awfully restrictive on that 392.
 
408 swinger said:
I can't verify the Jeep SRT manifolds. Never had them in my hands. The 2010-2012 Jeep and Durango 5.7 manifolds do fit. But, they would be awfully restrictive on that 392.
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I guess will find out the hard way, I do have TTI motor mounts but $700 is hard to swallow for raw steel headers. What are you thoughts on cam since I can get away with more overlap without VVT?
 
Lots of different shops with cams. I use Hughes, but, they only have cams for the early/non- VVT.
 
The manual trans cam can/could be had for 250.
 
Tbone said:
I've seen mixed answers on this subject, which I asked, have you fitted the two together? The oil pan was part of a kit, I didn't think it would clear, is there an alternative to the Moroso oil pan that isn't quite as expensive?
Click to expand...
Yes, I have done it. Did not have to shorten the input shaft at all. You do have to run the roller pilot, they're not drilled for a bushing, but they are drilled enough for input clearance. *Qualifier* I can't vouch for all hemis, but mine fit right up after adding the roller pilot.
Charlie's Oil Pans is another option for a mid-sump oil pan, but still not cheap. I ended up making my own.
Oil Pans
 
Professor Fate said:
Yes, I have done it. Did not have to shorten the input shaft at all. You do have to run the roller pilot, they're not drilled for a bushing, but they are drilled enough for input clearance. *Qualifier* I can't vouch for all hemis, but mine fit right up after adding the roller pilot.
Charlie's Oil Pans is another option for a mid-sump oil pan, but still not cheap. I ended up making my own.
Oil Pans
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That helps, I already have the roller bearing, did you use the aluminum 10.5 bellhousing for small blocks? What did you do for exhaust manifolds?
 
Yes, initially I mocked it up with the stock LA bellhousing to make sure everything would fit together right and to build my motor mounts.
Mock yours up before installation to make sure yours will fit without mods to the input shaft. I'm sure 408 swinger wasn't blowing smoke when he said he had to modify his. As with so many things with these cars, there are no absolutes. Mine was an early 5.7 (04), so it wouldn't surprise me if your '17 crank is drilled different- which is why test fitting everything ahead of time is critical.
Original plan for exhaust was to use Jeep manifolds, which initially seemed like they could work, but I didn't get the final fit with the clutch linkage worked out before the project took a little different turn, so I can't vouch for that. That's all I can offer at this point.
 
408 swinger said:
You WILL need to shorten up the input. The gen 3 engine cranks are not drilled for a bronze style bushing. They use the Magnum style needle bearing. The exhaust manifolds are also a no go. They will swoop right into the inner fenders. TTI headers will be your best bet for keeping performance. Milodon mid sump with a stock k member. The 392 cam will wake up that 5.7. I'm not familiar with the Holley systems. Can you retain the VVT? I've used the Hotwireauto harness, was able to retain the VVT function with the 6.4 cam in the 5.7. Works awesome.
Click to expand...


I have a 1970 Dart I'm doing a 2010 challenger 5.7L hemi swap that comes with the 5 speed auto "nag1" I bought a ECM from Efi source I got the Gen3 ms3 goldbox with harness for plug and play, the owner told me I have to ditch my factory transmission that came with the motor off the donor car, I was wondering if they made a stand alone TCM so I can use that transmission, also I saw you say we can use the stock k member to drop the hemi in, what more would be needed to drop it before I go the TTI header route, milidon oil pan, amTTI motor mounts, and QA1 k member? Also if you have more info please email me! I need help this is a car I wanna build for my baby boy I just wanna get most out the way now.
 
Mopar6969 said:
I have a 1970 Dart I'm doing a 2010 challenger 5.7L hemi swap that comes with the 5 speed auto "nag1" I bought a ECM from Efi source I got the Gen3 ms3 goldbox with harness for plug and play, the owner told me I have to ditch my factory transmission that came with the motor off the donor car, I was wondering if they made a stand alone TCM so I can use that transmission, also I saw you say we can use the stock k member to drop the hemi in, what more would be needed to drop it before I go the TTI header route, milidon oil pan, amTTI motor mounts, and QA1 k member? Also if you have more info please email me! I need help this is a car I wanna build for my baby boy I just wanna get most out the way now.
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To run the Gold Box, yes, you have to ditch the Nag. I have heard of a company, Sound German Engineering(I think this is the name) that is doing stand alone for the 8 speed Torqueflite. Possibly the nag also? I do know to run the Nag, you need a LOT of parts from a donor car. Search Hotwireauto.com for this Info. To use the stock K member you'll need Milodon pan, TTI engine mounts, a remote oil filter system, and 2010-2012 5.7 Jeep Grand Cherokee/Durango manifolds. The Jeep manifolds have a smaller 2 1/2 inch outlet. The Durango has the bigger 3 inch. How they snake down is identical. I have a thread on here with some pics I did of my son's 73 Scamp.
 
Professor Fate said:
Yes, initially I mocked it up with the stock LA bellhousing to make sure everything would fit together right and to build my motor mounts.
Mock yours up before installation to make sure yours will fit without mods to the input shaft. I'm sure 408 swinger wasn't blowing smoke when he said he had to modify his. As with so many things with these cars, there are no absolutes. Mine was an early 5.7 (04), so it wouldn't surprise me if your '17 crank is drilled different- which is why test fitting everything ahead of time is critical.
Original plan for exhaust was to use Jeep manifolds, which initially seemed like they could work, but I didn't get the final fit with the clutch linkage worked out before the project took a little different turn, so I can't vouch for that. That's all I can offer at this point.
Click to expand...
More info always helps, what did the clutch linkage look like at initial mock up?
 
408 swinger said:
To run the Gold Box, yes, you have to ditch the Nag. I have heard of a company, Sound German Engineering(I think this is the name) that is doing stand alone for the 8 speed Torqueflite. Possibly the nag also? I do know to run the Nag, you need a LOT of parts from a donor car. Search Hotwireauto.com for this Info. To use the stock K member you'll need Milodon pan, TTI engine mounts, a remote oil filter system, and 2010-2012 5.7 Jeep Grand Cherokee/Durango manifolds. The Jeep manifolds have a smaller 2 1/2 inch outlet. The Durango has the bigger 3 inch. How they snake down is identical. I have a thread on here with some pics I did of my son's 73 Scamp.
Click to expand...

Pics help for sure, I've got to think that the SRT Jeep manifolds are very close to those, I have a Summit column and Borgeson steering box so that will help, clutch linkage is a concern but Brewers makes a pull type hydraulic slave cyl, it does look like my brake booster might fit too. The more info I can gather the less down time!
 
I had also read that the SRT manifolds would work. Im not sure what my 6.1 was out of, but there was not way the manifolds i had would fit. They exited right into the frame on the pass side, and it didnt look like it would clear the manual steering box. Does TTI say their headers will clear the factory z-bar?

I pieced together a hydraulic clutch setup as my car wasnt originally a stick car and ive probably got $250 into it with a hose still to purchase.
 
gummibear said:
I had also read that the SRT manifolds would work. Im not sure what my 6.1 was out of, but there was not way the manifolds i had would fit. They exited right into the frame on the pass side, and it didnt look like it would clear the manual steering box. Does TTI say their headers will clear the factory z-bar?

I pieced together a hydraulic clutch setup as my car wasnt originally a stick car and ive probably got $250 into it with a hose still to purchase.
Click to expand...
Jeep SRT manifolds not passenger car manifolds, I can't say yet, I haven't torn into mine, they have pretty good notes on the website but I've read on this forum that some people have had to massage them for different reasons.
 
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