A new head design (fantasy)

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MOPAROFFICIAL said:
Fe, same
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Post some pictures of the
gzig5 said:
Well, I've been impressed with OHC for a long time. No such thing as valve train stability issues. I've owned a 2000 BMW M5 for ten years. That comes with a 400hp 5 liter, all aluminum DOHC, four valve per cylinder V8. Essentially the Ford Coyote was modeled after it, in my opinion. The exhaust is very restrictive and a set of headers and tune is worth almost 50hp. That motor is a work of art and is more than twenty years old now. Way ahead of everything else at the time. Overhead cams and variable valve timing allow you to do things that a pushrod engine only dream of. A lot of it is aimed at efficiency and fuel economy of course, but you can make some serious power. Multiple valves allow more area for flow in a given chamber area, rather than a single big valve with a lot of wasted space around it. Biggest downside with the BMW motor is the engine controller is locked up and figuring out the variable cam timing in a standalone controller is like black magic. A lot harder for a backyard hot rodder to tinker with, but the system is capable. Kinda looks like a hemi.
View attachment 1715446340
View attachment 1715446341
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"Kinda looks like a hemi"

Actually, it kinda looks "tore up".
 
RustyRatRod said:
"Supposedly" still doing it.

the new hemi
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Wonder if one of the small cube Gen 1 Hemi heads are similar to an LA? Just curious.

241 red ram.jpg
 
Charley Maluke figured out the 426 bore spacing was close to a 383 back in the day.

image0-3.jpg
 
And when piezio electric valve actuation actually becomes a thing, everything we know about valve train science will go by the wayside.
 
Seems like the factory race engineers did a pretty good job with the W7-W9 and P5-P7 work. But if your talking about something for standard 59 degree blocks, there was a design for small block Chrysler’s in the late eighties for sprint car design that looked like it was on the verge of alien technology. It somewhat reminded me of the Mickey Thompson F1 engine that had the twin rocker covers and the fuel injection stacks and spark plug went down vertically between them.
 
Garrett Ellison said:
Seems like the factory race engineers did a pretty good job with the W7-W9 and P5-P7 work. But if your talking about something for standard 59 degree blocks, there was a design for small block Chrysler’s in the late eighties for sprint car design that looked like it was on the verge of alien technology. It somewhat reminded me of the Mickey Thompson F1 engine that had the twin rocker covers and the fuel injection stacks and spark plug went down vertically between them.
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We discussed that 318 sprint motor before.
Custom heads
 
Its 59 and 48, Tony.. lol

Also there is a poly that will take hemi head, fireball and 315 truck motor or something like that., from 1956
I was on quest and had the parts located and lined up for purchase... then the 410 happened ..and i left that idea.
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
We discussed that 318 sprint motor before.
Custom heads
Click to expand...
I’ll be a while finding it, because it was such a custom affair. But it wasn’t the 318 sprint motor. It was a complete package that sprint car teams could buy for one or two years before the company went the way of Batten engineering. It had its own mechanical injection system, 38 cc chambers for alcohol, weird valve covers that looked like Cleveland ford units and only covered the inboard side of the head. The spark plugs were inboard. A valley cover between them. The injectors were mounted to outer top of the head and the paired injector stacks aimed to the outside of the car. The cam and valve train were all custom to the heads, for obvious reasons. It was in an issue of circle track from around 1989-1991 that covered all the different aluminum heads. Wishing I had that magazine now, there was a chart and a section that covered which rockers it was designed for. The only thing it said under rockers was "it's own".
 
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gzig5 said:
Well, I've been impressed with OHC for a long time. No such thing as valve train stability issues. I've owned a 2000 BMW M5 for ten years. That comes with a 400hp 5 liter, all aluminum DOHC, four valve per cylinder V8. Essentially the Ford Coyote was modeled after it, in my opinion. The exhaust is very restrictive and a set of headers and tune is worth almost 50hp. That motor is a work of art and is more than twenty years old now. Way ahead of everything else at the time. Overhead cams and variable valve timing allow you to do things that a pushrod engine only dream of. A lot of it is aimed at efficiency and fuel economy of course, but you can make some serious power. Multiple valves allow more area for flow in a given chamber area, rather than a single big valve with a lot of wasted space around it. Biggest downside with the BMW motor is the engine controller is locked up and figuring out the variable cam timing in a standalone controller is like black magic. A lot harder for a backyard hot rodder to tinker with, but the system is capable. Kinda looks like a hemi.
View attachment 1715446340
View attachment 1715446341
Click to expand...


And look at the size of it to feed that displacement. It's just too big. How would you feed 400 plus inches? It would eat up real estate more than a hemi.

And the hemi is just as impressive and not nearly as complicated.

And I'm not sure what valve train stability issues you are concerned with. If it has a valve and a spring it has stability issues. How you move the valve makes little difference.
 
yellow rose said:
And look at the size of it to feed that displacement. It's just too big. How would you feed 400 plus inches? It would eat up real estate more than a hemi.

And the hemi is just as impressive and not nearly as complicated.

And I'm not sure what valve train stability issues you are concerned with. If it has a valve and a spring it has stability issues. How you move the valve makes little difference.
Click to expand...
So getting rid of the 6” push rod noodle and nearly directly actuating the valve off the cam is going to be a less rigid system? No kidding, they all have springs. What about all the other crap hanging off flexing and vibrating? The push rods on an ohc engine don’t flex and bend because they aren’t in the motor
 
gzig5 said:
So getting rid of the 6” push rod noodle and nearly directly actuating the valve off the cam is going to be a less rigid system? No kidding, they all have springs. What about all the other crap hanging off flexing and vibrating? The push rods on an ohc engine don’t flex and bend because they aren’t in the motor
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Done correctly, the pushrods doesn't move that much.

I know you are in love with what you love, but it ain't as cool as you think. If the rocker "flexes" so what? The rocker does what an OHC cam can never do.

If I'm not mistaken, Ford dropped that engine and is going back to pushrods. They didn't do that because they are stupid.

Also, don't **** yourself. If you don't think the cam cores flex, and even worse, the cam mounts your kidding yourself. Nothing is solid. Nothing. Not even your magical OHC system. It moves. And it moves a bunch.
 

yellow rose said:
Done correctly, the pushrods doesn't move that much.

I know you are in love with what you love, but it ain't as cool as you think. If the rocker "flexes" so what? The rocker does what an OHC cam can never do.

If I'm not mistaken, Ford dropped that engine and is going back to pushrods. They didn't do that because they are stupid.

Also, don't **** yourself. If you don't think the cam cores flex, and even worse, the cam mounts your kidding yourself. Nothing is solid. Nothing. Not even your magical OHC system. It moves. And it moves a bunch.
Click to expand...
I never said anything about rockers flexing. You can believe what you want to believe. This was supposed to be a throw **** at the wall and see what sticks type of thing. If there is no pushrod, you don't' have to worry about routing the port around it. That was the point. Forgot you already have all the answers.
 
gzig5 said:
I never said anything about rockers flexing. You can believe what you want to believe. This was supposed to be a throw **** at the wall and see what sticks type of thing. If there is no pushrod, you don't' have to worry about routing the port around it. That was the point. Forgot you already have all the answers.
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Don't get your panties in a bunch. I don't have all the answers. But what I do know is the OHC isn't the miracle you think it is. The pushrods isn't the issue you claim it to be.

You're the in claiming the OHC will cover a multitude of sins and I'm saying it won't. Evidently, Ford doesn't think it's worth the squeeze either. They are building a PR engine to replace the OHC engine. You think they did it because they are stupid.
 
19DUSTER73 said:
Too bad it took Ford 25 years to figure it out lol
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Wish I could remember where I read about the new engine. I was surprised to see it was a PR deal.

They also have a new gearbox they claim is a manual but it isn't. Not even close, but the tool who wrote the article I read about it said only the ignorant (I think he said "unlearned" would say it wasn't a manual) would say it wasn't a manual gearbox. I doubt the little sissy who wrote the article can drive a real stick, let alone drag race one.
 
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