Advancing stock cam in a 360?

[Bewy]

When advancing or retarding a cam, you are doing so in crank degrees, NOT cam degrees. So in the example in post #22, one tooth would be 15.8*. that is a lot.
Yes confusing. Regarding cam timing [ in degrees ], the only number that is in cam degrees is the LSA. Every thing else, ICL, ECL & timing figures on the cam card are in crank degrees.

 

[ddart cart]

Been trying to make sense of this before I buy a timing set for my 360 magnum. The more I read/watch the less I understand.
What is the next step if you find cam timing is off, if you shouldn’t advance or retard the cam? Why would an adjustable set have the wrong numbers on it? Why haven’t I found one person with an adjustable set report on the ideal advance for a stock magnum 360?
Double roller - yes
Adjustable - god please chime in, thanks.

 

[MopaR&D]

Been trying to make sense of this before I buy a timing set for my 360 magnum. The more I read/watch the less I understand.
What is the next step if you find cam timing is off, if you shouldn’t advance or retard the cam? Why would an adjustable set have the wrong numbers on it? Why haven’t I found one person with an adjustable set report on the ideal advance for a stock magnum 360?
Double roller - yes
Adjustable - god please chime in, thanks.

You degree the cam by measuring the centerline on one of the lobes to check that the camshaft and timing set were made correctly. If it's off, you advance or retard however much is needed to get it to where it should be. Outside of that, intentionally advancing or retarding the camshaft is basically a tuning tool to modify the torque curve.

Btw I changed the timing set and advanced the cam a couple degrees, glad I did it because the old chain was super worn but it didn't make much difference in how it ran from before. Maybe a bit smoother during cruise and extended the redline a few hundred RPM. I found more improvements to the idle/revving issue by playing with the ignition advance and carb tuning. Still not perfect but close enough.

 

[QuickDart360]

In the old days the really only way to get any drivability on the street with the 292/509 was to advance it 6-8*. Everyone installed gears but almost never got a performance stall converter. Kim

I actually have thst cam in my dart sport 360. Runs good. I did advance it some. 3.91's also help it go.

 

[ddart cart]

I will have mine apart today. If the old chain is way off, I will buy an adjustable set, if not a normal set will go in, straight up. I feel like I’m missing something, and should probably advance it, but people chase me away from both ways, so flip a coin it is. Nothing like flipping a coin and crossing your fingers on a multi thousand dollar engine build.

 

[abodyjoe]

Back in the 70s and 80s my buddy would advance the cam gear 1 tooth on stock non hp engines. Really seemed to perk them up. I’m thinking it was 8* or more. I’m sure someone will do the math. Kim

the guy dave that helpped me build my 360 did the same thing. infact he had just rebuilt a box stock low mileage smog era 440 and put the cam in 1 tooth advanced.. he says its about 10 degreese.. that motor ran awesome.

 

[ddart cart]

Sounds good to me, and I have definitely heard that many times over the years (advance 1 tooth). Will that apply to my carbureted magnum 360, or will it handicap it? What about 4°? The argument on either side is strong and both make sense…if that makes any sense. My solution to the mystery is get an adjustable set, install it straight up, until I find the truth. Tons of posts, video, experienced 360 guys, and no solid consensus about cam advance on a stock internal 360.

 

[Speedy Pedi]

I built my 360 magnum stock bottom end and used 4 degrees cam advance with an HEI ignition engine fires off immediately. Set your spark plug gap to .45 to realize the benefit 45,000 volt of hotter spark. The cam advance will increase the cylinders dynamic compression according to David Vizard. I have my initial ignition timing set to 16 degrees at 800 rpm with no issues. According to Vizard the benefits are better power on the low end power with better drivability.

 

[ddart cart]

I built my 360 magnum stock bottom end and used 4 degrees cam advance with an HEI ignition engine fires off immediately. Set your spark plug gap to .45 to realize the benefit 45,000 volt of hotter spark. The cam advance will increase the cylinders dynamic compression according to David Vizard. I have my initial ignition timing set to 16 degrees at 800 rpm with no issues. According to Vizard the benefits are better power on the low end power with better drivability.

Thanks for the reply! Maybe I’ll use the 4° mark, maybe someone will say don’t. Maybe someone will say if I do, I’ll need to machine the everything, and recalibrate every piece of the engine with machine shop tools.
I’m not at ignition timing yet, but I will be looking to optimize that also since I had to put my tail between my legs with a cam swap.

 

[273]

Advancing may help compression with late intake closing but late closing also effects cylinder filling, nevermind the 3 other points of valve events.

 

[ddart cart]

Advancing may help compression with late intake closing but late closing also effects cylinder filling, nevermind the 3 other points of valve events.

Could it be possible a 98 stock 360 magnum comes slightly retarded for emissions, and we can advance it to achieve the engines happy place performance wise and disregard emissions? Or did the factory nail it regardless of emissions?

 

[273]

Could it be possible a 98 stock 360 magnum comes slightly retarded for emissions, and we can advance it to achieve the engines happy place performance wise and disregard emissions? Or did the factory nail it regardless of emissions?

Could be, I heard the factory ford 400 timing chain has a retard built in, don't know if true. But could see a lot of these smog engines having some built in.

Not saying don't do it but probably few have done what the OP is asking on a stock 360 cam so it's probably be a bit of a experiment. I find it a bit funny people only focus on one aspect of what advancing the cam can possibly do (Compression) and sold on the one merit no matter the effect on the whole. Overall probably a low risk experiment.

 

[273]

 

[MoparLeo]

No matter what you do. Always degree the cam and install a head to check valve clearance
Advancing timing whether mechanical or electrical will help bottom end at the expense of top end.
Altering the cam timing will affect valve to piston clearance.

 

[Slantsix64]

I would advance it 4 degrees, probably get you some more cylinder pressure. Those engines have the pistons all the way down in the hole.