Alternator wiring

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minty

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Hindhead,Surrey,UK
Hi Guys,i know its been done before but just need to clarify one thing.
Have upgraded my charging system using the MadElectrical as a guide.Bypassed Amm gauge.
Got a new 60 amp alternator with 2 field connections.
Original alt had battery post and single green wire.
Car runs FBO electronic ignition and electronic external regulator,one of the old style look with electronic inside.
Have spent many hours reading previous posts on the subject.
Is it just a matter of grounding the second field terminal to the case(alt came with one supplied),
Just need to clarify this before start up.
Many Thanks
Terry
 

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Well finally had some time to fire up the car and have a problem.
Car is over charging.Am get 15.2 at fast idle which isnt right.
Have removed regulator,cleaned all grounds,have taken bulkhead connectors apart and cleaned.
Have trunk mounted battery,would this effect charging output.
Have tested hot side of ignition system with muliti meter ,one on battery pos and over on ignition side of regulator.Getting 1.5 volts ,have i done this correct.
Starting to get a bit lost,would like to track this down with the help of you fine people.
Any ideas what to do next....Help
 
If you've got a reading of 1.5 volts you have way too much voltage drop. It should be more like .2 volts. You've got too much resistance somewhere in the line. Check connections through your ignition switch, firewall etc.
 
If you've got a reading of 1.5 volts you have way too much voltage drop. It should be more like .2 volts. You've got too much resistance somewhere in the line. Check connections through your ignition switch, firewall etc.

Yup. Your no 1 suspect is the bulkhead connector, but you'll have to check the entire path.

Your basic circuit path is from the battery -- fuse link -- bulkhead -- ignition switch connector -- through the switch -- back out ignition switch connector -- back out bulkhead.

So check each point carefully to ground. You'll have to check both sides of the bulkhead to find that, or just pull it apart and look it over.
 
Can a multi meter be used to check each section ,how would i do that...multi meter is a recent purchase so still figuring out how you use them.have had the dash out today for visual check ,stripped back cable tape,nothing obvious,changed ignition switch ,have done away with switch connector,soldered heatshrink eliminating possible issue.Will check bulk head connection again tomorrow.will keep you posted,Thanks
 
Don’t forget to clean battery terminals, and ground conductor connection on engine block, ground strap between head & fire wall as well.

Recently I went through this very drill chasing voltage drop, I found one volt at negative battery post kill switch… The voltage drop saga can be found here.
 
Can a multi meter be used to check each section ,how would i do that...multi meter is a recent purchase so still figuring out how you use them.have had the dash out today for visual check ,stripped back cable tape,nothing obvious,changed ignition switch ,have done away with switch connector,soldered heatshrink eliminating possible issue.Will check bulk head connection again tomorrow.will keep you posted,Thanks

Go down to Radio Shack and get a couple of packages of various size clip leads, and look through their parts drawers and buy a couple of packs of alligator clips. That way you make up some Looooooonnnnggg clip leads to extend yours if necessary.

You need to put a "load" on the circuit on which you are trying to find the drop, because with no load, there is no drop. That is, the meter does not add enough load of it's own to provide any drop, and show the problem

Since you may have the key on for extended periods, it might be wise to pull the regulator IGN lead off, just pull off the connector.

Likewise, pull the connector off your igntion box.

To "load" the system, get something like a spare stop/ tail lamp, or even a headlamp. "Clip" this temporary lamp onto your ignition supply lead out in the engine bay. You can clip onto the blue field lead on the alternator, or the IGN terminal of the regulator, or the "key" side of the IGN ballast resistor.

In other words, you want the key "run" power on the IGN "dark blue" coming out into the engine bay feeding this temporary load.

Now there are two ways to measure this, but the one which shows up the easiest is to measure "voltage drop" along the harness as you go.

So with your new-- found clip leads, clip one lead onto the battery positive terminal, or as close as you can get, such as the "big stud" on the start relay.

Hook this lead to one side of your meter, and tape it up if necessary so you don't short the thing to ground.

Now you can take your other meter lead and probe various points to check "the drop."

To see, FIRST, what you are working with, put your probe on the hot side of your temporary load. You should be measuring some drop, you mentioned 1.5 volts. The amount of the load will change this, but whatever you have with the "test load" remember it, as you should get "less and less" as you work your way back to the battery

Now probe BOTH sides of the bulkhead connector on the dark blue IGN lead, and see if this reading changes. That will show a problem in that connector.

If you can reach, without shorting something (or unhook the battery temporarily) reach up in the dash, and hook a clip onto one side of the ammeter. Bring the clip down for access, and check there with your probe.

Remove the trim under the column so you can get to the column connector, l get your diagram, and identify the correct wire coming out of the IGN switch, which for many years is still DARK BLUE

Probe that and see what you have

You need to probe the "hot" feed into the switch coming from the ammeter circuit. This will be a LARGE wire, and I just realized I'm not sure what year/ model you are working on. Refer to your diagram, the feed from the AMMETER circuit to the IGNITION SWITCH and that is the one you want.

By reading these voltage drops, you should be able to identify the origination.

ALSO by working the bulkhead connector as well as the ignition switch connector in/ out several times, may "scrub" the terminals clean and that will of course show you that you're in the right area
 
Thanks for your input guys,have learned a lot these past weeks.Cleaned all connections,still getting 15.2 at fast idle.Have ordered new VR incase my one is playing up.
Have done the Mad electrical conversion ,i have a new 60A alt new 6awg cable goes direct to starter relay pos post through fused connection.From starter relay post a 1awg cable goes through car to rear trunk mounted battery.Grounds at batt and 2 from engine to chassis.alt wires as follows Green field wire to fld side of reg.no 2 field connection grounded to alt case.
As i have clear path to battery how does the VR regulate voltage to batt.
Probably a dumb question but its niggling me.
And a Happy New Year to you all!!
 
Thanks for your input guys,have learned a lot these past weeks.Cleaned all connections,still getting 15.2 at fast idle.Have ordered new VR incase my one is playing up.
Have done the Mad electrical conversion ,i have a new 60A alt new 6awg cable goes direct to starter relay pos post through fused connection.From starter relay post a 1awg cable goes through car to rear trunk mounted battery.Grounds at batt and 2 from engine to chassis.alt wires as follows Green field wire to fld side of reg.no 2 field connection grounded to alt case.
As i have clear path to battery how does the VR regulate voltage to batt.
Probably a dumb question but its niggling me.
And a Happy New Year to you all!!

Don't replace the regulator until you actually MEASURE the ground and hot side drop, it's easy:

With engine NOT running, and key in "run" stick one probe on the battery pos, the other on the regulator IGN terminal. You should not see much, not more than .2V (two tenths). The more you have the more it indicates a harness drop problem, and the more you have the more it will OVERcharge.

Now check the ground. With the engine running at an RPM to simulate "low to medium cruise" and the battery "normalized" stick one probe on the battery negative post, and the other directly onto the mounting pad of the regulator. Be sure to stab through any paint, etc.

Here again, you want a low reading, the lower the better. The combination (if any) of the two voltage drops---the ground side PLUS the drop in the harness ADD to the charging voltage set by the regulator

IF these two checks are OK, you either have a bad regulator, or in rare cases, a problem in the battery itself can cause this.

On my 67, before I rewired it, I had ONE VOLT drop through the bulkhead.
 
Don't replace the regulator until you actually MEASURE the ground and hot side drop, it's easy:

With engine NOT running, and key in "run" stick one probe on the battery pos, the other on the regulator IGN terminal. You should not see much, not more than .2V (two tenths). The more you have the more it indicates a harness drop problem, and the more you have the more it will OVERcharge.

Now check the ground. With the engine running at an RPM to simulate "low to medium cruise" and the battery "normalized" stick one probe on the battery negative post, and the other directly onto the mounting pad of the regulator. Be sure to stab through any paint, etc.

Here again, you want a low reading, the lower the better. The combination (if any) of the two voltage drops---the ground side PLUS the drop in the harness ADD to the charging voltage set by the regulator

IF these two checks are OK, you either have a bad regulator, or in rare cases, a problem in the battery itself can cause this.

On my 67, before I rewired it, I had ONE VOLT drop through the bulkhead.
You are right 67 Dart
Hot side is 1.2 ground side .2 so if i find this problem alt should charge at around 14 v if its now charging at 15.2 which would be in the ballpark,would this be in ignition circuit only(blue) only or do i need to look else where.
 
Just carried out another test,took off dark blue wire to ign side of VR.
Put fly lead from positive stud to ign side of VR
Started engine
Fast idle got 14.3 V at battery,i assume alternator is working correctly Please correct me if iam wrong,would like to rule it out of the equastion.
Thankyou
 
14.3 volts is good to go. Now just find that drop.

Remember several small voltage drops within a circuit are additive, or in other words several small resistances in series add to one larger resistance. Say .3 v at ignition switch, .3 v at bulkhead connector x2 because current passes through it twice once in and once out adds to .9 volts a little more drop at any of the other connections, and you’re qiuckly at 1.5 volts or more… and so it goes.
 
14.3 volts is good to go. Now just find that drop.

Remember several small voltage drops within a circuit are additive, or in other words several small resistances in series add to one larger resistance. Say .3 v at ignition switch, .3 v at bulkhead connector x2 because current passes through it twice once in and once out adds to .9 volts a little more drop at any of the other connections, and you’re qiuckly at 1.5 volts or more… and so it goes.

Spent a day taking things apart,bulkhead connecter takern apart and cleaned,fuse block removed cleaned,replaced fuses,probably going to have to remove dash again to investigate further,charging at battery at 1000rpm down to14.9/15.07.going the right way but still not there yet.
 
Minty, do you have any resistance loads feeding from ignition circuit such as an electric choke? At one point I had taped into the high side of ballast resistor to feed switched power to an electric choke, it dropped line voltage below normal, which voltage regulator read as harness voltage causing voltage regulator to up alternator output to around 15.5 volt readings.

Now all that junk needing switched power runs from relays triggered by ignition circuit and feed directly from alternator or battery. If you have anything not stock running from ignition circuit, disconnect it, and recheck charge voltage.
 
You might check this thread:

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=170781

I used a used relay center out of a Voyager for the relays to run ignition, fuel pump, headlights, and charging system. Somebody else posted a commercial product, does the same thing. The box I used is very easy to re-wire and reconfigure the relays and fuses for what you want I mounted it on the left fender apron forward of the washer tank.

But your regulator is just fine, your clip lead test proved THAT. All you need to do now, as said above, is "find the drop" in the hot side harness. VERY common problem.
 
Minty, do you have any resistance loads feeding from ignition circuit such as an electric choke? At one point I had taped into the high side of ballast resistor to feed switched power to an electric choke, it dropped line voltage below normal, which voltage regulator read as harness voltage causing voltage regulator to up alternator output to around 15.5 volt readings.

Now all that junk needing switched power runs from relays triggered by ignition circuit and feed directly from alternator or battery. If you have anything not stock running from ignition circuit, disconnect it, and recheck charge voltage.

All thats connected to to ignition system is the blue/yellow wire that goes to the FBO ignition.Being of limited knowledge regarding auto electrics i assume this is drawing power for fbo system,Could this in anyway draw current away making the alt think there is a volt drop somewhere and overcharge,just a thought
 

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Ok,
Got my 383 back in May 2k10.
Have not put 10 miles on er yet.
Can you say-
"One wire alternator?
Yep.
At first I said, well I will just redo it to normal alternator.
Nope.
Recently I bought Powemaster 140 amp,
so,
one wire it is.
 
I used a used relay center out of a Voyager for the relays to run ignition, fuel pump, headlights, and charging system. ... The box I used is very easy to re-wire.

I just finished putting a modern Power Distribution Center in my 65 Dart, but it wasn't easy. It took several weeks of evening work to re-wire it as I needed. I recall it was from a ~95 Grand Cherokee, but could have been a RAM truck. Has 7 standard auto relays in one row (used all), ~10 maxi fuses and ~10 minis fuses. Newer cars like my 2002 T&C have the new mini relays, which helps but the overall PDC is larger and looks like it would be more effort.
 
Minty:
All thats connected to to ignition system is the blue/yellow wire that goes to the FBO ignition.



Brain fart condition active... What is FBO?
 
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