Axle won't go in far enough

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Walker434

Walker434

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I am assembling my 8 3/4 rearend after taking it apart to replace a broken wheel stud. Since I had it apart I decided to replace wheel seals and bearings (old rearend out of a parts car). I painted the rear end and puchased new gaskets (steel and foam) and I am putting in a 3.91 sure grip 3rd member. I put in the divider before I installed the 3rd member. I installed the LH axle with no problem. When trying to install the RH axle feels like it's going in the splines but not far enough. There isn't enough threads showing to even start a nut on the studs. I have played with my axle adjustment with no success.

Any help would be appreciated. I usually call my dad for issues like this but he is a Chevy guy and has never messed with this type of rearend.
 
Walker434 said:
I am assembling my 8 3/4 rearend after taking it apart to replace a broken wheel stud. Since I had it apart I decided to replace wheel seals and bearings (old rearend out of a parts car). I painted the rear end and puchased new gaskets (steel and foam) and I am putting in a 3.91 sure grip 3rd member. I put in the divider before I installed the 3rd member. I installed the LH axle with no problem. When trying to install the RH axle feels like it's going in the splines but not far enough. There isn't enough threads showing to even start a nut on the studs. I have played with my axle adjustment with no success.

Any help would be appreciated. I usually call my dad for issues like this but he is a Chevy guy and has never messed with this type of rearend.
Click to expand...

Did you use green bearings? If so there is a part that you have to remove if I recall right.

Update: Thrust block.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=175823&highlight=green+bearings
 
Walker434 said:
I am assembling my 8 3/4 rearend after taking it apart to replace a broken wheel stud. Since I had it apart I decided to replace wheel seals and bearings (old rearend out of a parts car). I painted the rear end and puchased new gaskets (steel and foam) and I am putting in a 3.91 sure grip 3rd member. I put in the divider before I installed the 3rd member. I installed the LH axle with no problem. When trying to install the RH axle feels like it's going in the splines but not far enough. There isn't enough threads showing to even start a nut on the studs. I have played with my axle adjustment with no success.

Any help would be appreciated. I usually call my dad for issues like this but he is a Chevy guy and has never messed with this type of rearend.
Click to expand...

There is a thrust button in a sure grip that may be stopping the axles from seating that the peg-leggers dont have. look through your old pig and see if there is light at the end of the tunnel, the SG's have a spacer in there.
 
i've always used moser axles with green bearings and have never had to do anything but bolt the axles in.. seem most guys that use yukon and other brands axles (other then moser) have to take that button out of the center of the rear.
 
I am using the stock axles. I had the OEM style wheel bearings and out seals pressed on. I put the little button in the SG before installing it and thought at first maybe half of the botton fell out when I installed the LH axle but that's not the case becuase I can see it's still in there when I shine a flashlight down the axle tube.

Thanks for the quick replies, I am not sure what's going on. Did I not drive the inn seal in far enough? It seemed like it bottomed out.
 
slide a tape measure in there and see where it bottoms on the button. Then you can tell if the axle is the issue. You say 1/4 inch? SG's have 2 splines that must line up! turn your axle when you push it in to engage the inner SG splines inside the carrier splines. perhaps you are hanging up on the inside splines? Or am I thinking of a Dana?
 
Aren’t 8 ¾” axel's left & right sides unequal length?
Have you got the short one in the long hole?
 
I assume this is an A body rear? Axles should be the same length, 27 11/16". I suspect the second set of splines might not be lined up. Try turning the axle and apply inward pressure like pishta suggested, you may have to tap on it a little as well.

The suregrip has two sets of splines in it.
 
Badsport said:
I assume this is an A body rear? Axles should be the same length, 27 11/16". I suspect the second set of splines might not be lined up. Try turning the axle and apply inward pressure like pishta suggested, you may have to tap on it a little as well.

The suregrip has two sets of splines in it.
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X2... Generally when an axle won't go all the way in it's cause the 2nd set of splines aren't lined up with the 1st set. Turning the axle to align them is the way to do it but just so you know it's not easy to turn. I use my 3' prybar jammed between the wheels studs to give me leverage. Screw a couple lug nuts on the studs back to back for the prybar to pry against so you don't damage the threads.
 
Ok thanks for the help guys. I didn't realize there were 2 sets of splines on the SG. I am going to try this tonight, I'll let you know if I have any luck.
 
Walker434 said:
Ok thanks for the help guys. I didn't realize there were 2 sets of splines on the SG. I am going to try this tonight, I'll let you know if I have any luck.
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with the help ya got I am sure you will get it.I know I just learned something,this site rockssssssssssssssssssssssssss
 
Ok guys I worked on this last night and here's what happend. I put the axle in and could feel it slide into the 1st set of splines I then twisted the axle and felt it catch the second set of splines and it popped on to the threads! Felt like it went all the way in. I then started to tighten the five nuts holding the axle in but noticed the axle got harder and harder to turn as I tightened the nuts. I also noticed once I got the nuts tight that I had no axle play on the adjusting side. I also had no axle play on the Driver's side. When I messed with the axle adjustment I could get play out of the driver's side but can never get any play out of the passenger side. Shouldn't there be the same amount of play on both sides? Also, the axles are very hard to turn. I then losened the 5 nuts on the adjusting axle and everything turned easier. I am thinking maybe something isn't right with my divider button in the SG. Any help is apprecciated, and please excuse my ignorance on this issue this is my first 8 3/4 rear end.
 
I'm guessing on the SG, is it the clutch type? How did you install the thrust buttons? They are really pretty straightforward as far as installing them.

You should have minimal end play on the axle. Remember the thrust button is sandwiched between the two axles, essentially making it a "solid" shaft all the way through, if that makes sense. As far as hard to turn, it will be even with a tire on there, it should be resistant.

One thing, did you pack the bearings before you installed the axles?? Very important, they get no lubrication from the diff oil!!!

Once you get your axles in on the right side where the adjuster is take out the little retaining clip and tighten the the adjuster until you can feel no end play in the axle. Rap on end with a large hammer and turn axle a couple of times, go to left side and make sure that there is no end play there either. Now go back and back off the adjuster till you can just barely feel any movement turn axle a couple of times more to seat the bearings and recheck the movement. You should be able to feel a slight movement when you grab the axle flange and push in and out. Now replace the locking clip and put the drums back on.

Ideally you would want a dial indicator and set end play between .008 and .018, those are factory settings, I usually go for .010.

Hope this helps a little.
 
Thanks Badsport. I guess my main question is should there be a little axle end play on both sides? Because I can't seem to get any end play out of the adjusting side no matter what I do. Yes, I did pack the bearings with Mobile 1 sythentic grease before installing. I see what you're saying about the resistance when you put the wheel and tire on there it just felt like too much. I forgot to mention the SG is a 741 with 3.91 gears.
 
Wishing now I would have ponied up the money for aftermarket axles and Green bearings. I could have gone to big bolt pattern while I was at it.
 
Walker434 said:
Ok guys I worked on this last night and here's what happend. I put the axle in and could feel it slide into the 1st set of splines I then twisted the axle and felt it catch the second set of splines and it popped on to the threads! Felt like it went all the way in. I then started to tighten the five nuts holding the axle in but noticed the axle got harder and harder to turn as I tightened the nuts. I also noticed once I got the nuts tight that I had no axle play on the adjusting side. I also had no axle play on the Driver's side. When I messed with the axle adjustment I could get play out of the driver's side but can never get any play out of the passenger side. Shouldn't there be the same amount of play on both sides? Also, the axles are very hard to turn. I then losened the 5 nuts on the adjusting axle and everything turned easier. I am thinking maybe something isn't right with my divider button in the SG. Any help is apprecciated, and please excuse my ignorance on this issue this is my first 8 3/4 rear end.
Click to expand...

It's possible that even though you got the axle in the splines still aren't quite lined up perfectly. If not that'd cause it to be real tight and make it seem there isn't any play. Lock the drivers side down and turn the pass. axle back and forth a couple times and it should finish aligning it. Then do what Badsport said about rapping on the axle with a hammer. I use a 3 lb. deadblow hammer so as to not distort the axle. That should free it up. Do you have a dial indicator to use to adjust the end play? Like badsport I shoot for .010" end play.
 
Also, since were only dealing with .010" end play it's real hard to feel by hand unless you've done it several times. That's why you need a dial indicator to see what's happening.
 
Walker434 said:
Thanks Badsport. I guess my main question is should there be a little axle end play on both sides? Because I can't seem to get any end play out of the adjusting side no matter what I do. Yes, I did pack the bearings with Mobile 1 sythentic grease before installing. I see what you're saying about the resistance when you put the wheel and tire on there it just felt like too much. I forgot to mention the SG is a 741 with 3.91 gears.
Click to expand...

You only need the end play on the non adjusting side, that is where you check your end play. Essentially what you are doing is making sure the axles aren't "jammed" together apply force against one another, if that makes sense.

If you don't have a dial indicator you can adjust as I posted above. Just remember you want very slight movement, as in, almost none. Once you get it right you will understand what I'm describing.

When you rotate the wheel it will almost feel as if the brakes are partially applied, perfectly normal.

I usually go to a vacant parking lot somewhere and drive the car in a loose figure 8 pattern a few times, one way and then the other, after getting it all together.
 
fishy68 said:
Also, since were only dealing with .010" end play it's real hard to feel by hand unless you've done it several times. That's why you need a dial indicator to see what's happening.
Click to expand...

Yup it is, but it can be felt if one pays real close attention. I tell people to think business card. That's about all the movement they will feel.
 
Ok guys thanks so much for your help. From the sounds of it I probably had it last night I was just worrying too much (being my first time). I have to go home for the holidays tonight but I will try it next week when I get back in town and let you know. I don't own a deadblow but I'll put a block of wood in there and use my 4 lb sledge to set the bearings. THANKS AGAIN!!!
 
Walker434 said:
Ok guys I worked on this last night and here's what happend. I put the axle in and could feel it slide into the 1st set of splines I then twisted the axle and felt it catch the second set of splines and it popped on to the threads! Felt like it went all the way in. I then started to tighten the five nuts holding the axle in but noticed the axle got harder and harder to turn as I tightened the nuts. I also noticed once I got the nuts tight that I had no axle play on the adjusting side. I also had no axle play on the Driver's side. When I messed with the axle adjustment I could get play out of the driver's side but can never get any play out of the passenger side. Shouldn't there be the same amount of play on both sides? Also, the axles are very hard to turn. I then losened the 5 nuts on the adjusting axle and everything turned easier. I am thinking maybe something isn't right with my divider button in the SG. Any help is apprecciated, and please excuse my ignorance on this issue this is my first 8 3/4 rear end.
Click to expand...
Walker434 said:
Thanks Badsport. I guess my main question is should there be a little axle end play on both sides? Because I can't seem to get any end play out of the adjusting side no matter what I do. Yes, I did pack the bearings with Mobile 1 sythentic grease before installing. I see what you're saying about the resistance when you put the wheel and tire on there it just felt like too much. I forgot to mention the SG is a 741 with 3.91 gears.
Click to expand...

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20200101_160821.jpg
 
With this older post I was able to have it as guidance on my same issue not getting my axles to go all the way in. And I must admit this forum and the super smart Mopar folks were spot on and made my job WAY easier.

To that I share two photos since technology has made things easier.
After reading the post I decided to snake a camera up the axle tube just to see the two splines. Sure made it easier to align the splines once I knew they were off.

Thanks great folks!!
 
make sure you installed the new inner seals far enough into the housing -- if not the axle bearing collar will bottom onto the face of the seal ---- face of the seal should be about 1-11/16 inch in from the face of the housing flange -- there is a lip in the housing end that the seal will bottom out on -- if installed properly.
 
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