BBC head advise...Indy? Pro Comp? Eddy Victor?

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68Valiant440

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Im looking to buy a new set of BB Chrysler heads..
I have new shortblock stroker being built and was gonna use some Eddy RPM heads.But I called Indy about thier 440EZ heads and Russ told me i was gonna lose around 100 hp if i use the small Eddy head.The motor is under 500 cubes and around 11.0 with the 84cc rpm heads.The rpm heads are only 210 intake runners and 2.14/1.81 valves and 84cc chamber.The Indy 440EZ heads are 270 intake,2.19/1.8 valves and 75cc..so my comp will be alil higher.
I read some bad things about Indy on here and now cant decide if buying thier heads are a good idea.
I was shopping around and saw that the Eddy Victor head will fit,but need off set rockers and then i went on TTI headers sight to see that i would need a motor plate to clear the headers with stock mounts.I will be installing this in the 68 Valiant(a body) in my sig.
I also see that Pro Comp has a nice CNC head i can use too,but dont see any real tech info about intake and exh locations that might stop me from buying them.
I will be using a TTI 2" header and have Crane Cams Gold 1.6 rockers and a custom hyd flat tappet cam around .600"

So any thoughts or answers to a good head that has stock locationt o accpet my headers/rockers etc? Also will be running a Victor intake..Not max wedge style tho..

So is Indy good or junk? Pro Comp..Junk? Eddy Victor will they work with my headers and schumaker motor mounts?

Thanks
Adam
 
IMO, going with a std port and not a MW port is a big waste of time. 500 inches needs a port!
Hell I use MW ports on 440's. If you have flattop pistons you'll either have to change the pistons to work with smaller chambers (best way to go from a power stand point)and then the EZ heads will be great.
Or you'll have to run the eddy heads. Edelbrock has redesigned the Victor and I can tell you OOTB it aint very good. It needs porting.
Brian
 
ou812 said:
IMO, going with a std port and not a MW port is a big waste of time. 500 inches needs a port!
Hell I use MW ports on 440's. If you have flattop pistons you'll either have to change the pistons to work with smaller chambers (best way to go from a power stand point)and then the EZ heads will be great.
Or you'll have to run the eddy heads. Edelbrock has redesigned the Victor and I can tell you OOTB it aint very good. It needs porting.
Brian
Click to expand...

Brian your saying stick with the 440EZ head without the max wedge port? Standard port? I will be using a Victor intake and yes flat tops Mahle -8cc as advertised in Eagle Products.
Arent he mw ports big? Will they match my intake?
Thanks
Adam
 
68Valiant440 said:
Brian your saying stick with the 440EZ head without the max wedge port? Standard port? I will be using a Victor intake and yes flat tops Mahle -8cc as advertised in Eagle Products.
Arent he mw ports big? Will they match my intake?
Thanks
Adam
Click to expand...

If you buy the EZ's from me, we port the chamber some, clearance for pushrods and do a much better valve job plus set the springs up correctly.
Yes, EZ MW head is what I recommend. We just open up the port at the flange to MW. I highly recommend the Victor MW intake with some porting. Fantastic intake.
Compression will still be too high for pump gas with the EZ's...This is why better planning or planning with an engine builder is KEY...the right pistons are THE most important criteria when planning an engine build.
 
The 470-500 cubic inch engine doesn't require but certainly can USE a ported head no matter which one you choose.

The head with stock port locations and the greatest power POTENTIAL is the Indy EZ.

However......the Victor 440 intake and ported Edelbrock RPM heads, with the stock intake gasket size, that flows 305-310 cfm @ .600" and the hydraulic flat tappet, will still easily give you a 640tq/600hp 500ci street engine, all by 5800 rpm. Almost anyone's CNC program, or a competent hand porter can achieve those flows.

Depending upon the cam duration, I suspect you may be able to run on 91 octane with the 84cc Edelbrocks and the cam you have chosen.

ANY aftermarket aluminum head, properly ported, can make in the 800 HP range, this INCLUDES the Stealth and RPM heads. I have a Mopar Performance Stage VI head, that uses standard offset rockers, part number P4529335, that I measured at 90cc's in the combustion chamber. They too can be ported into the 800HP range.

The EZ head is not going to give you an extra 100 HP, as Russ claims, without doing the improvements suggested by Brian and using the Super Victor 440 or Super Victor 440 Max Wedge or another Max Wedge style intake. This is because, the box stock RPM will outflow the box stock EZ to about .500" lift.
 
It really boils down to what you want the end result to be. If your looking for 650HP or more, then shy away from the RPM. But if you want upto that, the RPM will support that kind of power no problem.

The way I see it, dont spend all that extra coin on the EZ heads if you want 650HP or less, spend it in the valvetrain. Go solid on the cam, youll get more power from that then just going with the EZ heads over the RPMs.

And Ill agree, 100hp lose, no way. Get real Russ, they aint that good LOL
 
IQ52 said:
The 470-500 cubic inch engine doesn't require but certainly can USE a ported head no matter which one you choose.

The head with stock port locations and the greatest power POTENTIAL is the Indy EZ.

However......the Victor 440 intake and ported Edelbrock RPM heads, with the stock intake gasket size, that flows 305-310 cfm @ .600" and the hydraulic flat tappet, will still easily give you a 640tq/600hp 500ci street engine, all by 5800 rpm. Almost anyone's CNC program, or a competent hand porter can achieve those flows.

Depending upon the cam duration, I suspect you may be able to run on 91 octane with the 84cc Edelbrocks and the cam you have chosen.

ANY aftermarket aluminum head, properly ported, can make in the 800 HP range, this INCLUDES the Stealth and RPM heads. I have a Mopar Performance Stage VI head, that uses standard offset rockers, part number P4529335, that I measured at 90cc's in the combustion chamber. They too can be ported into the 800HP range.

The EZ head is not going to give you an extra 100 HP, as Russ claims, without doing the improvements suggested by Brian and using the Super Victor 440 or Super Victor 440 Max Wedge or another Max Wedge style intake. This is because, the box stock RPM will outflow the box stock EZ to about .500" lift.
Click to expand...

Thanks Guys..
I bought the Eagle kit with Mahle flat tops -8,.055 over so its 500"
The car will be mostly driven to shows and cruising on the weekends and a maybe a track run once a month.
Im not worried about compression..that Pump Gas theory is bs..I already own a race gas that i spray a 200shot of nos on 92 pump gas.
I just wanna take better advantage of the cubes with a better set of heads,but i dont want max wedge ports and not looking to get the heads i have ported or rpms etc..
The victors are killer,but i cant use my headers and need a motor plate according to TTI website and will also need off set rockers.
Looks like the ez head is my beast option,which i have been told i can get with a 80cc so the comp will not be so high...around 11.5.I also only run around 32 deg of timing and only plan to shift the car around 6500.My cam was built to those specs.If i want to go all out and see what the best et can be im not afraid to run some race gas and bump up the timing.
But the goal is to goal in the 10's and be street driven on pump gas!
Also using a Victo intake too!
 
MRL Performance said:
It really boils down to what you want the end result to be. If your looking for 650HP or more, then shy away from the RPM. But if you want upto that, the RPM will support that kind of power no problem.

The way I see it, dont spend all that extra coin on the EZ heads if you want 650HP or less, spend it in the valvetrain. Go solid on the cam, youll get more power from that then just going with the EZ heads over the RPMs.

And Ill agree, 100hp lose, no way. Get real Russ, they aint that good LOL
Click to expand...

Im loooking for 650+ and im using a flat tappet and a victor intake
 
IQ52 said:
Okay, shouldn't be a problem. My 451 with an M1 single plane, 290 cfm 452 heads and 9.5:1 CR makes 620HP.
Click to expand...

So you make good power with the 452 heads then? hmm
Im thinking for 500" they are too small?
Thats my problem...I cant decide to use the 452 alumn or go bigger!! ugh
 
68Valiant440 said:
So you make good power with the 452 heads then? hmm
Im thinking for 500" they are too small?
Thats my problem...I cant decide to use the 452 alumn or go bigger!! ugh
Click to expand...

290 cfm 452 factory IRON heads.

642tq/642hp with a single 4bbl, 496ci, 10.3 CR, 309cfm @ .600" Edelbrock RPM's, small solid street roller.

I make 775HP with 342cfm @ .700" Edelbrock RPM's and a 11.7:1 CR, 451 CI stroker on 91 octane.

Like I said, ANY aluminum BB head can go into the 800 HP range. 650+ HP starts to get expensive.
 
IQ52 said:
290 cfm 452 factory IRON heads.

I make 775HP with 342cfm Edelbrock RPM's and a 11.7:1 CR, 451 CI stroker on 91 octane.
Click to expand...

Sweet..Thats what i want to hear!!

But i think im just gonna try to sell my alumn 452's and by the ez heads..

Thanks for your help
Adam
 
ou812 said:
IMO, going with a std port and not a MW port is a big waste of time. 500 inches needs a port!
Hell I use MW ports on 440's. If you have flattop pistons you'll either have to change the pistons to work with smaller chambers (best way to go from a power stand point)and then the EZ heads will be great.
Or you'll have to run the eddy heads. Edelbrock has redesigned the Victor and I can tell you OOTB it aint very good. It needs porting.
Brian
Click to expand...

I agree.

From the factory Chrysler has been stingy on port size. I too see no problem running a Max Wedge port on a 440. You can get a well ported standard head to do satisfactory duty on a street 500" engine, but for maximum efforts, you are always gunna leave something on the table when compared to the larger head.

How did you discover the Victor had been changed? Must have been some test differences you got? Could it have been production tolerences?

Yesterday I spoke with Edelbrock tech. They pulled out the engineering and design sheets and went over them for me. There was proprietary information they couldn't talk about, but according to the engineers, no changes have been made to combustion chambers, port volumes, flows, or anything like that. They made some changes to IPS plugs in the end of the head, rocker stands, valve cover gasket sealing rail, pushrod clearancing and things like that, but nothing that changed the ports.

Edelbrock claims these flows:

.100"..........85
.200".........150
.300".........211
.400".........261
.500".........298
.600".........322
.700".........325

On my bench, the stock Victor flows are:

.100"..........68
.200".........141
.300".........204
.400".........246
.500".........277
.600".........305
.700".........324
.800".........334

If I may ask, how does that compare with what you get?
 
I hope the changes they made fixed the issues. I never did understand why they used the wrong valve cover rail. They make the RPM head correctly but for some reason they didn't use the correct valve cover rail in the Victor head? And hopefully they opened up more clearance for the pushrods. The first heads were really tight in that area. So that is good if Edelbrock is making changes and fixing problems. That head would be even better if they used a 2.0 or 2.1 installed height. The head flows past .800 lift but the valves are too short to use the flow.
 
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