pishta
I know I'm right....
yeah, your probably right, one at a time. I think it was an OLD BMC foundry doing 1275 mini blocks 4 at a time.
@pishta there weren't just one core box and core set for one block pour. May be they had 8 and the mold line got them ready to pour. The molds take a lot more time to construct that it takes to pour.
yeah, your probably right, one at a time. I think it was an OLD BMC foundry doing 1275 mini blocks 4 at a time.
Pretty fascinating stuff. I have been in Dan's pattern shop and it takes a special part of your brain to imagine what the part will look like when all you can see is what isn't cast iron.
I had visited the Chrysler foundry in Indianapolis several times, V8 blocks would be cast 2 at a time.Pretty fascinating stuff. I have been in Dan's pattern shop and it takes a special part of your brain to imagine what the part will look like when all you can see is what isn't cast iron.
Thanks Karl. I knew you'd have somethin constructive to add. Hope yall had a good Thanksgiving.
Are you Sure, you haven't been to my part of FL? Cause the last few sentences, seem really familiar, as in some of my thoughts many years ago, about many things, that unfortunately, due to current events, are resurfacing again, many times overThat's all horse **** geared towards getting a higher price for something. It's been pretty much proven crap through research and some common sense. It's common sense you don't want the lowest or highest number, because toward the beginning they were still working everything out with the new mold and toward the end they were at the end of their life span. An engine in the middle was generally the best for lack of core shift. ......but it's all splittin hairs anyway, because if the block passed inspection, it's not much different than any of the rest. I'd tell um to stick their core reversion bullshit up their ***. Sideways. With no lube.
I had visited the Chrysler foundry in Indianapolis several times, V8 blocks would be cast 2 at a time.
And I have 30+ years experience at the IH / Navistar foundry in Indy. Concerning the numbers seen on the outside of the casting close to the part number, those are Pattern numbers. Patterns 1 & 2 would run together, patterns 3 & 4 would run together and so forth.
Concerning why one would see a pattern 4 with an early cast date. It is because when launching a new engine the foundry would would require that more than one set of tooling be available. That is so Patterns 1 & 2 could be in production use for a day or two, then they would be returned to the Pattern shop for routine maintenance and Patterns 3 & 4 would be in use for a day or two, typically two sets of patterns are rotated, as they wear beyond normal repair, patterns 5 & 6 and 7 & 8 would be brought in.
Concerning dimensional improvements, I would not say that later ( higher) numbered patterns are better than earlier ( lower ) patterns. Break through improvements in dimensional accuracy are more closely related to improvements in the core making process and in how the cores are processed and are assembled into a complete package. It is the unusual case when a single engine remains in production long enough for it to be re tooled with completely different core making processes. The slant six is one that comes to mind. The slants up to the late 60’s were oil sand cored, after that they were hot box, the final series in the 80’s were cold box. Those charges tie closely to the 3 distinct slant six cylinder head varieties.
The core boxes are similar to patterns, in that they are also identified with numbers. The lower numbers are early the higher numbers are later, with multiple numbers ( core boxes) being in production at any point in time to allow for repair and maintenance.
Yes, that is why the patterns have numbers. To be able to track differences and changes.Not sure if I missed it, but I kinda thought that different numbers during casting would allow easier tracking down on blocks that had imperfections. 1 vs 2. 2 being fine but 1 having issues it would be a simple find.
Yeah, Windsor blocks were 2 at a time too....so @my68barracuda do the suffix numbers mean ANYTHING as related to quality? That's the base of my theory. It sounds like a -1 and a -8 (-15) are going to be dimensionally the same? So this last number is meaningless in regards to block worth...? I think so. I posted 2 340s made 1 day apart and the latter one had a lower number. Thanks for your input!
Back on part numbers, and using slant six blocks as an example, there are several block part numbers and with the exception of the steel vs cast crank difference, all of the blocks are interchangeable. Those part numbers were introduced sequentially and all part numbers were not all produced at the same time, hence I think there were some minor feature changes but the big change was in how the cores-casting was produced.Concerning how two 340 blocks made a day apart with the latter having a lower number. The mold sets 1 & 2 and 3 & 4 could both be ran the same day. Perhaps they started running 3 & 4 in the morning, but a problem developed during the run so that pattern set was taken out and patterns 1 & 2 were set in. To keep productivity high, pattern changes could made in the matter of minutes. Basically any pattern set that was available could have been ran on any day.
Concerning pattern numbers and dimensional quality. Whether it is pattern 1 or pattern 26, typically the quality level will be very similar. Foundry tooling is typically very expensive, to maintain the interchangeability of that tooling, it usually is all made the same way.
Changes in tooling singificant enough to impact casting quality are typically introduced at the same time part design changes are introduced. Then the part number also changes. Again using slant six heads as an example. Drool tube heads have a part number, peanut heads have a different part number, hydraulic heads have a different part number. These three heads each have different foundry core processes, but are basically interchangeable and each set has their own part number.
Thank you! Ill close this chapter with BUSTED!...
Concerning pattern numbers and dimensional quality. Whether it is pattern 1 or pattern 26, typically the quality level will be very similar. Foundry tooling is typically very expensive, to maintain the interchangeability of that tooling, it usually is all made the same way.
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Thank you! Ill close this chapter with BUSTED!
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If you have son’s with foundry experience, perhaps you should run what you wrote by them. As it makes absolutely zero sense.That - number is simply to identify how many pours were mede in a single mold. As the old deteriorates they can identify the cores that are likely bad and send them to the scrap pile to be remelted and reused.
I have two sons who have foundry experience.
I should have said pattern numbers...thanks for clearing the air.If you have son’s with foundry experience, perhaps you should run what you wrote by them. As it makes absolutely zero sense.
The sand cores used in gray iron green sand casting, used in producing the 340 v8 blocks that are under discussion here are one time use only. The single digit numbers under discussion, the numbers on the outside of the casting are Pattern Numbers.