72ScampTramp
Scamp Tramp
that and to say that you have thrown some parts at it and gotten a bigger radiator.. Means there is still an underlying problem.
Dart over heating???
- Thread starter 604
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Ok then. Put in a 195° thermostat and see what happens.... At least you will have less engine wear until it overheats (you will have a 35° head start to get there)... LOL.
Like I stated in my first reply. Put in the shroud and seal all gaps with foam between the shroud and radiator. Your problem is that you are not pulling enough air through the radiator at idle and low speeds.
You need a good fan, a shroud, and to get the air to flow through the radiator, not around it.
Drilling holes around your thermostat plate is sorta bypassing it. It allows the coolant to flow through it when cold (closed) and therefore increases the warm up time and increases the wear on your cylinders.
kt340sport
Well-Known Member
I guarantee you , put a 195 thermostat in it and a real 7 blade steel fan , and not one of those racing flex fans, spacer if needed , if you run a lower temp ther , it will stay open to long and water has no time to cool in radiator, meaning it will eventually come to a boil , make sure the timing is on , and flush system .
How long should it take to warm to 180*, 5 minutes? They are small holes, and I did it to keep the system from getting air pockets. It seems to work.
A few of you missed the key sentences.
Not enuff airflow thru the rad at an idle or slow speeds running up a steep hill.
Means not enough air flow thru rad.
Even the biggest fan won't help if it is too far away from the rad. All it will do is draw air from between the rad and the fan.
A shroud will work wonders, esp if the fan is part way into the shroud. That way, all the air that the fan moves has to come thru the rad.
604
Well-Known Member
Throne parts at it? That is rather insulting. I replaced a 30+ year old radiator, thermostat, and hoses on a 32k mile car that spent most of it's life sitting. Seems to me I took the proper steps to work toward fixing this problem. Not much more I can do till the shroud gets hear. And I checked; not one of the local parts stores carry the hose with a spring. But as it is over heating at idle, it is pretty easy to see that that is not the problem. The more I look at how far the fan is from the radiator I am sure that the shroud will fix the problem.
Thanks to every one for all the help!
trapster
Well-Known Member
try running a can of carb medic through the carb
72ScampTramp
Scamp Tramp
What that ment was in relation to my first post about the hose collapsing. You made some upgrades to suspected areas (which can't hurt) and it didnt fix the problem. Which means the problem is most likely with something you haven't changed. I was mearly suggesting things that you havent tried. To the guy that recommended the system flush if you havent already is right.. Now that you say the car has been sitting for years.
I believe you are on the right track, keep us posted.
604
Well-Known Member
Good idea,
But I just rebuilt the carb. With how long it had sat I really thought it would be a mess inside. But man that thing was like new! That carb looked like it was made maybe 6 months ago. I am sure I have something not set just right. It has been darn near 100 in the shade with 80% humidity for a weak hear. To afraid of over heating the car to make any more adjustments to the carb. Going to weight till the shroud gets hear to try any thing else.
604
Well-Known Member
Hay no problem. I was going to flush it, but when I changed the T-stat I looked in the intake and it was still pretty gray iron. No rust. That and way back in 1990 A 15 year old (me) got his first car. A 1973 Dodge Charger. Ran and drove great. I think it had 70k on it. Well to make a long story short, I decided to flush it out. Next thing I know I have 3 freeze out plugs puking water. And this 15 year old had to change the plugs with the engine in the car. Boy did that suck!!! One of those things you never forget! Probably just coincidence. But I have been leery of the stuff ever since. This engine will probable only be in there till winter. I plan on pulling the original engine and putting a stock 340 or 440 in it at that time. Always wanted to have a Sport 440 that looked like it could have come that way from the factory!
mullinax95
Well-Known Member
I have never seen my .030 over 360 run hot but it would get hot enough that it would run funny. More than likely going lean is what I had figured. Instead of telling what you need to do I'll just explain what I did to rid of heat problem I had. I however was having problems running down the interstate at 70 MPH. I would hit the exit ramp just after a five mile venture and the temps was around 210 degrees.
Griffin aluminum radiator with two rolls of 1.25 tubing. (the radiator was a direct bolt in rad)
New hoses (lower hose has spring)
7 blade steel fan from Flexalite ( non flex type,spaced half way as previously mentioned, no clutch)
Shroud for my year model (don't buy any reproduction fan shroud they will warp on you... don't ask me how I know)
195 degree thermostat
50/50 mix of coolant and water
Over flow bottle from Summit (fixed to where it sucks the coolant back in as it cools)
What first amazed me was how much more coolant/water the Griffin held. I just keep adding coolant thinking "Good gosh where is all of it going?" LOL
I can leave the car running in 90+ degree weather and not worry about it running hot. The temp gauge stays pegged at 190 or a shade higher. The entire car cooled down!
Griffin aluminum radiator with two rolls of 1.25 tubing. (the radiator was a direct bolt in rad)
New hoses (lower hose has spring)
7 blade steel fan from Flexalite ( non flex type,spaced half way as previously mentioned, no clutch)
Shroud for my year model (don't buy any reproduction fan shroud they will warp on you... don't ask me how I know)
195 degree thermostat
50/50 mix of coolant and water
Over flow bottle from Summit (fixed to where it sucks the coolant back in as it cools)
What first amazed me was how much more coolant/water the Griffin held. I just keep adding coolant thinking "Good gosh where is all of it going?" LOL
I can leave the car running in 90+ degree weather and not worry about it running hot. The temp gauge stays pegged at 190 or a shade higher. The entire car cooled down!
:thumleft:
i've chased these same issues back and forth over the years....and here's some facts i have discovered.
Fact1:
a cooling system must be completely sealed for it to work properly. meaning if your radiator cap lets pressure leak, then the water will boil in the radiator pushing hoses off and the overflow full. keeping the system sealed lets it operate above 212 degrees F without boiling. now this same issue applies even with a small hose leak on a heater hose, or a small hole in a radiator or something.
Fact2:
stock brass and copper radiators are not the best option for dissipating heat. to opt for a stock style radiator when you can get an all aluminum 2 core from summit racing for $180 is not wise, in my opinion
Fact3: an electric fan is much better than a mechanical one for airflow. clutch, flex, 27 blade...whatever...there is a company called zirgo that makes an electric 3000+cfm fan for the same price as a new clutch setup and fan. it also fits in front of the radiator as a pusher giving you more engine bay room, plus doesn't drag the engine down
fact4: a clogged radiator/block is a rarely occurring thing. unless you have a bunch of hard miles, or you pull something from a junk yard...it's usually something else like the above.
Fact5:
The worst of the bunch...pop you cap off, fill the radiator to the bottom of the neck and start the car (while cold) not hot...look for bubbles coming up through the fluid...those bubbles would be pressure that is escaping from somewhere into the cooling system...head gasket probably... i have had cars with blown head gaskets keep running the same 11 second et they were before, only evidence was some water in the overflow every pass....also somewhat rare and i dont mean to scare you...but you can only throw parts at an engine so long.
print this out, keep it in your tool box, and good luck.lol
Fact1:
a cooling system must be completely sealed for it to work properly. meaning if your radiator cap lets pressure leak, then the water will boil in the radiator pushing hoses off and the overflow full. keeping the system sealed lets it operate above 212 degrees F without boiling. now this same issue applies even with a small hose leak on a heater hose, or a small hole in a radiator or something.
Fact2:
stock brass and copper radiators are not the best option for dissipating heat. to opt for a stock style radiator when you can get an all aluminum 2 core from summit racing for $180 is not wise, in my opinion
Fact3: an electric fan is much better than a mechanical one for airflow. clutch, flex, 27 blade...whatever...there is a company called zirgo that makes an electric 3000+cfm fan for the same price as a new clutch setup and fan. it also fits in front of the radiator as a pusher giving you more engine bay room, plus doesn't drag the engine down
fact4: a clogged radiator/block is a rarely occurring thing. unless you have a bunch of hard miles, or you pull something from a junk yard...it's usually something else like the above.
Fact5:
The worst of the bunch...pop you cap off, fill the radiator to the bottom of the neck and start the car (while cold) not hot...look for bubbles coming up through the fluid...those bubbles would be pressure that is escaping from somewhere into the cooling system...head gasket probably... i have had cars with blown head gaskets keep running the same 11 second et they were before, only evidence was some water in the overflow every pass....also somewhat rare and i dont mean to scare you...but you can only throw parts at an engine so long.
print this out, keep it in your tool box, and good luck.lol
mullinax95
Well-Known Member
I tried the 3500 cfm zirgo fan between the rad and engine and it didn't work out very well. Now I didn't try the elec fan with the Mopar shroud so that is a thought but I did however install the elec fan on the front of rad as a back up just in case.
see i'm the opposite, i had zero luck with any form of mechanical fan...and my electrics have always worked amazing,even some junkyard fans as pushers.
another note..i've heard that a elec in front, and mech in back, can actually cause more problems by causing turbulent air to just tumble through the radiator instead of neatly flow.
67Dart273
Well-Known Member
There is no way in HELL that this blanket statement is "always" true.
It all depends on the mechanical fan, it's size, blades, pitch, whether or not it has a proper shroud, whether the pulley ratios are helping, and probably a few other things
Electric fans are exactly the same way. Some aftermarket fans don't flow enough air even if installed "optimum", some have poor blade designs (so called reversible blades), some don't have provisions for shrouding the radiator and so don't pull air through the whole core.
"It just depends."
mullinax95
Well-Known Member
Yeah I've told that by others so it sounds like there is some truth to that but as of yet I haven't had a problem. I like e-fan to stay if possible because I cut it on if the engine is off to cool things down a bit.
w/e works for your setup...each car and engine is diff...if it's working then stick with it....just like the thermostat argument... i don't know how many ppl i've heard say that taking it out is the only way to run, and how many more i hear say thats the dumbest thing you could do...personally i run one but again there are a bunch of old school racers that don't.. no "blanket statement" intended...it's opinion from experience...thats all. just trying to help with the original cooling problem questions.
It depends on your starting ambient temperature. Are you talking summer or winter? Takes a few minutes longer in winter, especially Michigan.
That is like saying room temperature. It doesn't matter what temperature a room is at, it is still at "room temperature"...
Hemirunner
Well-Known Member
I started it today to move it out of the garage and it took just a shade over 5 minutes to hit 180 on the gauge. The car only gets driven in the summer months. I'll have to check it when the temps cool down later in the season.
604
Well-Known Member
Why would you think timing is the issue? If it over heated no mater were the timing is??? That makes no sense. And that is 5 deg is initial timing. That is set with the vacuum advance un hooked. Factory spec is 0 deg. Or top dead center for 1973. So that should not have a thing to do with it. Yes on a performance engine I would run more timing. But on a stock 318 2bbl there is no need. Believe me I have checked a thing or two. This is not my first rodeo. May only be my second Mopar, but I have had over 20 classic cars in my life time. And raced quite a few rather heavily. Not to mention retired from a corporate flight department were I kept 30+ mill aircraft in the air and operating correctly. Not tooting my own horn or anything, just trying to give the bigger pic. Boils down to I just did not know how close the fan should be the the radiator. Now that I found the seems to be imposable to find shroud for one, I am sure it will fix the problem. Just can not wait for it to get hear!
67Dart273
Well-Known Member
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