do frame ties & inboard rails affect #s match values

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chrisnben

chrisnben

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Been debating on buying a Mopar with #'s correct big block/4-speed, but they have added (nicely done) frame ties and inboard rear rails. The work is outstanding, but what decrease in value vs. stock (opinions needed). This is a low-production car with all supporting docs- build sheet, tag, correct parts, etc. :rr:
 
If you are looking for a concourse correct trailer queen then they decrease the value. If you plan on driving it the are worth the devaluation.
 
chrisnben said:
Been debating on buying a Mopar with #'s correct big block/4-speed, but they have added (nicely done) frame ties and inboard rear rails. The work is outstanding, but what decrease in value vs. stock (opinions needed). This is a low-production car with all supporting docs- build sheet, tag, correct parts, etc. :rr:
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Yes.

A lot from the inboard rails. Does this mean the original rear frame rails are gone and replaced by inboard rails?

I don't see how you would gain any tire clearance from moving the frame rails unless you mini tubbed ut and moved the inner wheel house over??

The frame connectors can usually be cut off if they are not welded to everything in sight. If its an original undercoated car the evidence is not too hard to hide.

Are the rear torque boxes/plates messes with or missing on the car you are looking at?

If it was a high end detailed resto of a 68-69 383 4 spd Barracuda or Dart with all those docs, I'd say knock $5-10k off a $30K to $40K car for moved/new inboard rails and subframe connectors. And the car will take longer to sell. Possibly the reason the car you are looking at has not sold yet.
 
Just a question from me. Not wanting to sound rude.

But why think of selling a car when you have not even bought it? Anyway, I say it depends on how you want the car. Are you looking for a numbers match, low production car to restore? If so then you may want to pass on this car or think of how much it would cost to put back to factory and take that much off the asking price.

Just saying!!
 
thanks Steve, yeah the car is mini-tubbed as well- again a sweet job. As we all know, these modifications are a personal taste deal, improving tire clearance and strength. The torque boxes are intact and nice. The car really looks sharp with the 10" steelies and dogdish caps.

I feel with all the correct engine accessories, radiator, manifolds, air cleaner, etc., this car would still warrant high $20's to low $30's. My gosh, resto-mods bring more than this and started out as /6's!
 
chrisnben said:
thanks Steve, yeah the car is mini-tubbed as well- again a sweet job. As we all know, these modifications are a personal taste deal, improving tire clearance and strength. The torque boxes are intact and nice. The car really looks sharp with the 10" steelies and dogdish caps.

I feel with all the correct engine accessories, radiator, manifolds, air cleaner, etc., this car would still warrant high $20's to low $30's. My gosh, resto-mods bring more than this and started out as /6's!
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Don't confuse a custom with a low production, factory, performance model. Custom cars use a value, that is based on build quality, personal taste and such.

A low production, factory, performance models value is based primarily on originality. One that has been cut up will be hard to sell, some people won't be interested at all and the car will bring significantly less money.
 
I would say those modifications definitely hurt the value compared to a unmolested car in respect to GTS, Formula S and the like type cars. You start cutting them up and taking off the original suspensions and performance parts like rims, intake and exhaust manifolds, carburetors, etc. It seems silly to even call the car a GTS or Formula S anymore to me, even if it does have the vin. number.

We have all seen that now days anything can be saved and restored back to original condition. My thoughts are, the cost to do the corrections would be about the amount it would decrees the value, but only to the point that someone else may buy it and like it for what it is currently.
 
What the hell difference does it make? If you like it and want it, buy it. If you're buyin it to flip it, pass unless you can get it at a price you can make something off of.
 
1968FormulaS340 said:
Don't confuse a custom with a low production, factory, performance model. Custom cars use a value, that is based on build quality, personal taste and such.

A low production, factory, performance models value is based primarily on originality. One that has been cut up will be hard to sell, some people won't be interested at all and the car will bring significantly less money.
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yes, unfortunately this car is a little of both- high quality resto-mod with Wilwoods, Moser axles, and the like & a rare, low-production car as well. It's too bad they chose this model to "chop up"/ improve upon.

Personally, I like the mods for what they provide. It just will be worth what's into it in the end- and for personal enjoyment. Good thing it wasn't a SS hemi car. :banghead:
 
68383GTS said:
So don't keep us in the Dark anymore.What is the make,model,year,engine,tranny,price???
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Jim- can't let the cat out of the bag just yet. If I decide to pass, I will post it here first :glasses7:.

Thanks everyone for your input- much appreciated!! Cheers:D
 
chrisnben said:
yes, unfortunately this car is a little of both- high quality resto-mod with Wilwoods, Moser axles, and the like & a rare, low-production car as well. It's too bad they chose this model to "chop up"/ improve upon.

Personally, I like the mods for what they provide. It just will be worth what's into it in the end- and for personal enjoyment. Good thing it wasn't a SS hemi car. :banghead:
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You gotta decide what you want. A resto mod restored car or a stock restored car.

This car is sort of half and half because it's got all it doc's 383 4sp A-body for collectabilty THEN it's got resto mod mini tub, frame relocation, brakes, etc. It's a car that half good for one thing and half good for another. IMHO, pick a car that is one way and get that car.

I know a 68 340 S fastback 4 speed red/red car that is a very well built show winning pro touring type car that was sold with the original numbers motor, buildsheet and numbers trans. California car all it's life, little to no rust ever, all original sheet metal. Car had a stroker 340 with a Tremec 5 speed. Car is extremely well thought out and performs on the track!.. Sold for low to mid to low $20K's. This car: http://www.carcraft.com/featuredvehicles/116_0507_1968_plymouth_barracuda_s340/

It did not sell real fast. So there's your market.

I know a 383 4-speed is a more desireble combo, but what are the original colors? With this 383 mini tubbed car, I would not pay more than low $20K's for it. And it better look good and have a universal received look to it (ie not a two tone paint job with graphics).
 
most A Bodies are not worth "high dollars"

only a few hundred were ever produced with the 426 hemi.

so really the mods don't change the values too much bro.

A Bodies were meant to be economy cars, and since they were light weight and could accept big blocks with not-too-difficult mods, they became great for bracket cars as well.

they were never meant as the top of the line sports cars (i.e. hemi - powered 'cudas, challengers, road runners, chargers etc)

they were the affordable performance cars for your average joe.

(interesting to note, however that the 400 or so hemi powered '68 darts and '68 barracudas could blow out any one of those top of the line sports models at the drag strip /snicker )
 
are you going to go on every mopar forum and ask until you get the answer you want to hear??

yes the value will drop with those mods.

just like the moparts guys told you..

ScottSmith_Harms :

Generally speaking, the more the car is worth as an original, the more modifications will hurt the value, further more, the harder/more expensive the cost of reversing such modifications, the more of an impact it will have (and a proper reversal of what you described is not a cheap endeavor if done to a high standard). Example, such modifications will have more impact on a Hemi Cuda than it will on a 383 Road Runner. Fame connectors improve a cars structure and keep it from flexing when it's being raced, etc. But think about it, who races or really pounds on an original #'s matching Hemi Cuda?

A suggestion; If you are new to Mopars do yourself a favor and get a Mopar SPECIFIC appraiser to do a pre purchase evaluation/verification for you. In todays world there are good quality fakes of everything you mentioned.
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quoted is the best advice for you. you either listen to it or don't. its up to you..
 
Here is the problem with our car hobby. It is not just for us guys who enjoy looking and and driving (safely) our cars around. It is also for those who consider a fun car as an investment. I buy a car to drive and drive the heck out of it (when I get them running). I can't afford much, so I am not concerned with resale value.
 
abodyjoe said:
are you going to go on every mopar forum and ask until you get the answer you want to hear??

yes the value will drop with those mods.

just like the moparts guys told you..



quoted is the best advice for you. you either listen to it or don't. its up to you..
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You are correct Joe ! Most of these cars are not original survivors and are Taiwaned up to the point of fake!The more involved the aftermarket is in our cars the less original they get.After you buy it or pass there will always be some guy that says you screwed up.It is worth exactly what the buyer and seller agree on not what another onlooker with no money says.
 
I have no semtiments for factory original cars. These cars are flimsy and mopar knew it. They offered and still offer bolt in and weld in subframe connectors. They also realize that pizza cutters don't function and that's all that fit inder these cars without , you guessed it a MPP reloaction or offset kit.

To me a car without these 2 items is worth less than one untouched becasue i'll have to pay to do it or at least buy the parts and use my time to get it done.

So to the purest, maybe. To the car enthusiast no.
 
This hobby is enjoyed in many different ways. I don't see just because one person or persons like a certain style of car they are branded as not car enthusiasts.
 
I tubbed , frame tied and caged this car. Also tossed the numbers motor for a race block. Originally a bahama yellow V24 car. original options accept for the scoop and paint. Launches hard wheels up and the doors still work fine. Its mine and who cares what they'll get for it when I am dead.
 
O-M-R,

I apologize on earlier statements on Duster 340's with Hood Scoops and
Rear Spoilers.

On A-Body cars, hard to find a Stock one that doesn't require sub-frame work
today.
 
Oldmanmopar said:
I tubbed , frame tied and caged this car. Also tossed the numbers motor for a race block. Originally a bahama yellow V24 car. original options accept for the scoop and paint. Launches hard wheels up and the doors still work fine. Its mine and who cares what they'll get for it when I am dead.
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thats wonderful, obviously unlike the OP you are not worried about the value of the car, you're out having fun doing what you are doing with it. the OP is apparently worried about a low production number big block abody and the value of it. two totally different scenarios
 
One thing you haven't considered is if it actually is factory correct. I was watching the new Graveyard Cars on Velocity (all Mopar) and the lead guy said that factory big block A's (and 340's?) had the same full frame rails as a convertible. Then I might be mixed up because they were looking at a Barracuda convertible (A-body) or maybe it was a 'cuda (B-body).
 
BillGrissom said:
One thing you haven't considered is if it actually is factory correct. I was watching the new Graveyard Cars on Velocity (all Mopar) and the lead guy said that factory big block A's (and 340's?) had the same full frame rails as a convertible. Then I might be mixed up because they were looking at a Barracuda convertible (A-body) or maybe it was a 'cuda (B-body).
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Probably talking about the torque boxes.
 
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