Congrats Tim!
DOES THE HDK SUSPENSION K-MEMBER HANDLE BETTER THAN A T-BAR SUSPENSION?
- Thread starter racerjoe
- Start date
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JBrian
Well-Known Member
Congratulations Tim, we had s great time
Is this the same guy?
By the license plate, it looks like it.
Nice looking car.
By the license plate, it looks like it.
Nice looking car.
@Hyper_pak Stan, have you seen this article?
racerjoe
Well-Known Member
Lots of people confuse our cars. Brian's car is a 71, mine's a 70. The easiest way to differentiate is I have black bumpers and he has chrome.
DionR
Well-Known Member
Funny, I hadn't noticed the bumper being chrome on his. I always look for the opening/slot you added to yours.
Hyper_pak
Old School Chrysler Fan
Thanks Rusty, I had not seen that.
Lots of stuff doesn't match the fender tag!
Go Lite, or Go Home!
Dartsun
Mopar Dude
Congrats on the win Racerjoe Tim. Love the car keep up the good work.
JBrian
Well-Known Member
The easy way to differentiate our cars is mine is the show car that races. Tim's is the black one. We do kind of exchange barbs, and to be honest, Tim's car was the closest target for what I wanted to build. Tim's also a much better driver than I am, and in autocross, that's worth seconds! Congrats buddy, you earned it!
I must have posted the same car as in post # 61.
when Tim checked in from MoParty last Saturday and informed me that after day 1 he was sitting in P1 in the autocross, I not only wanted to offer my congratulations, but offer a little extra incentive.....maybe for some new tires.
One might say HDK offered him 1000 reasons why he should get up on the wheel.
He did....
HDK writes the check!!!
One might say HDK offered him 1000 reasons why he should get up on the wheel.
He did....
HDK writes the check!!!
If I haven't mentioned it yet, I'll do so now.
I respect and give credit for someone finally stepping up and showing what these aftermarket parts are capable of doing.
I won't be convinced to buy the products but it is good to know that some people have had success with them. I hate to see money wasted or to see people suffer failures due to improper manufacturing, poor welds and bad engineering concepts.
I don't see these as being nearly as durable and long lasting as a well thought out and improved torsion bar system but in truth, I doubt the buyers of these coil over systems are driving 30,000 miles a year on paved and dirt roads. It is quite possible that these aftermarket systems may last many years without any repairs since most of us drive these cars less than 5000 miles a year.
I don't like what Magnum Farce put out. That dorky looking rock band roadie that ran the business put out some crappy parts.
I don't like the cantilevered tie rod connection that RMS and others have.
The tubular K members just don't seem nearly as robust in preventing parallelogramming like a stock K member does.
If the body gaps are consistent on these Dusters after several autocross events, maybe that is a non issue.
On a related note....
For 36 years I built houses, schools, shopping centers, apartments and other buildings. We were told for years that all the straps, brackets and reinforcements were necessary. I've stripped drywall off of 70-80 year old walls to find rotten studs, improper nailing and no structural reinforcements at all yet the house was still standing. The doors and windows opened, the floors didn't slope. It got me wondering how over the top I've been building things all these years. Maybe we could have gotten by with a lot less of that stuff.
Is it possible that the Mopars were over-built too?
I respect and give credit for someone finally stepping up and showing what these aftermarket parts are capable of doing.
I won't be convinced to buy the products but it is good to know that some people have had success with them. I hate to see money wasted or to see people suffer failures due to improper manufacturing, poor welds and bad engineering concepts.
I don't see these as being nearly as durable and long lasting as a well thought out and improved torsion bar system but in truth, I doubt the buyers of these coil over systems are driving 30,000 miles a year on paved and dirt roads. It is quite possible that these aftermarket systems may last many years without any repairs since most of us drive these cars less than 5000 miles a year.
I don't like what Magnum Farce put out. That dorky looking rock band roadie that ran the business put out some crappy parts.
I don't like the cantilevered tie rod connection that RMS and others have.
The tubular K members just don't seem nearly as robust in preventing parallelogramming like a stock K member does.
If the body gaps are consistent on these Dusters after several autocross events, maybe that is a non issue.
On a related note....
For 36 years I built houses, schools, shopping centers, apartments and other buildings. We were told for years that all the straps, brackets and reinforcements were necessary. I've stripped drywall off of 70-80 year old walls to find rotten studs, improper nailing and no structural reinforcements at all yet the house was still standing. The doors and windows opened, the floors didn't slope. It got me wondering how over the top I've been building things all these years. Maybe we could have gotten by with a lot less of that stuff.
Is it possible that the Mopars were over-built too?
just in case I have not mentioned it, thank you for your astute analysis and can only deduct you prefer the not-so lovely stick welds and low-budget spot welds securing the two halves of the OEM K's versus the fully tigg welded K's offered by HDK?
OK...got it!
Cherry pick much, Denny?
I wrote that I don’t see these aftermarket systems as being as durable as a well thought out and improved torsion bar system.
Rick Ehrenberg laid it out quite “astutely” in an issue of Mopar Action more than 6 years ago.
It costs very little to weld up the seams and reinforce the steering box mounts.
I’ll stand by my stance that these systems offer no advantage over properly prepped torsion bar car other than slight weight savings and the appearance. They do look pretty.
I wrote that I don’t see these aftermarket systems as being as durable as a well thought out and improved torsion bar system.
Rick Ehrenberg laid it out quite “astutely” in an issue of Mopar Action more than 6 years ago.
It costs very little to weld up the seams and reinforce the steering box mounts.
I’ll stand by my stance that these systems offer no advantage over properly prepped torsion bar car other than slight weight savings and the appearance. They do look pretty.
Some haul *** and some write about it. I think by now the guy with the trophy might not agree with your (or Rick Ehrenbergs) analysis......but we do agree on this, they do look pretty.
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One guy in a row, huh?
Wow. THAT is impressive.
I'm not trying to belittle the man, in contrast I'd bet that he would be great in a torsion bar car that was optimized.
Wow. THAT is impressive.
I'm not trying to belittle the man, in contrast I'd bet that he would be great in a torsion bar car that was optimized.
in case you missed it.....he had an optimized torsion bar set-up from the get-go and was contemplating a Gen III install. The truth is, that is why I contacted him to try the HDK out and offer a 100% honest opinion....good or bad, nothing off limits. And for a fair comparison, begin with his proven small block stroker driveline already in the car, only after that did he swap engines.....with ease.
maybe he will elaborate....or maybe not.
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when you gonna show us your credentials.....can't wait.
I did not miss that. I remembered it.
I want to reaffirm that I'm not stating that your products are junk. I hope that wasn't how I came across. I just don't see it as a durability improvement over a (I'll state it yet again) properly set up and improved torsion bar setup.
Maybe the steering has a better feel with your products? I can't argue against that since it is a subjective matter.
This isn't a 67 Mercury Cougar or a 1980 Corvette where the steering linkage is a convoluted mess that begs for improvement.
A Borgeson box mounted to a reinforced K member seems really hard to beat.
Now you're being petty. I showed you respect but you chose to be like this.
NC Engine Builder
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What is the chassis weight and tire rule? I assume everyone has to weigh a minimum weight, and everyone runs the same tire correct? That's the situation I ran under
Not at all. Tires for sure are all different and different sizes. I think there’s a class minimum weight, but that’s it. Maybe not even that for Moparty, I know CAM has a couple weight categories.
NC Engine Builder
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I'm confused, how can you have a legitimate organized competition, with different weights and tires? That's not how ANY real sanctioned competition is done.
Most of these events are more about fun and bragging rights than anything else. The Optima series is a little more regulated than Moparty, and the SCCA CAM classes are a bit more regulated than that. But even the SCCA CAM class was dramatically opened up as far as rules go, the issue was that most of the SCCA classes just don't apply to old muscle cars that people actually drive. You'd basically need to have a dedicated car for a lot of the classes. And participation was way down, so, the made the CAM class so more street cars could compete. But with less rules, well, not as equal on the competition side.
Some tire rules are set, like typically for Moparty or street classes you have to use a DOT approved, minimum 200 treadwear tire (no race tires). But yeah, in Optima most of the guys that are doing well are running 315 square, so if you can't do that or close to it you're going to have a hard time.
And that's before you even get into horsepower. No limits on that either. With the Moparty grand champion you've got a drag race, a 3S, and the autocross. So you could easily have the best handling car and smoke the autocross, but not be fast enough on the drag strip to win the event on the total. The 3S is also pretty horsepower dependent, you have to get up to speed quick. And then stop quick, so it's not just horsepower, but yeah.
So like I'd love to get into more of this stuff, but realistically with a 340 pushing only about 400 hp I wouldn't win anything. In most of those competitions I'd need another 100 hp or more to be in the game.
The classes for Moparty Grand Champion are only this
- Late Model Class: All 1990 and newer model year cars.
- Vintage Class: 1989 or older model-year cars.
- Truck Class: All trucks regardless of the year of manufacture.
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Update 2/22/2022: The Kumho V720 ACR tire has been excluded for use in competition. It will no longer be allowed in future MoParty™ events. Any vehicles participating at the event with these tires installed will be automatically transitioned to an exhibition class and the times will not count towards points in Autocross or Grand Champion.
- All Grand Champion participants must compete in all segments of the event to qualify for The Holley MoParty™ Grand Champion Award:
- Drag Race
- Autocross
- 3S Challenge
- All drivers will be required to sign a liability waiver. Passengers must be at least 18 years of age and will be required to sign the same liability waiver as the driver. No passengers allowed on the drag strip, or 3S Challenge.
- Only official wristbanded drivers may drive the vehicle.
- All competitors must have a current driver’s license.
- Each entrant will be issued a number, which must be clearly visible on the windshield, side windows, or rear window.
- No dual drivers or Co-Drivers allowed in Grand Champion Competition.
- Participants must use DOT approved street tires. Tires will be required to pass a technical inspection at the track. Street tires are defined as any treaded, non-competition tire with a 200 treadwear rating or higher. No modifications to tires will be acceptable, including shaving. Any vehicle with tires showing any evidence of modification will be immediately disqualified from the event.
- Competitors must use a single set of tires for the entire event, no tire changing between events will be allowed. Tires will be marked during tech. Tire changes will be allowed in the event of a catastrophic failure, but replacements must be of the same manufacturer and model as those approved during tech inspection.
- Helmet use is required during all non-highway segments of the competition. The helmet must be approved automotive style with a Snell foundation sticker of SA2015 or later. Motorcycle helmets will not be approved.
- All convertibles or roadsters must have rollover protection for the drag race portion of the challenge.
- Participating cars must pass a basic safety inspection that will include but may not be limited to the following:
Functional seatbelts.
b. Proper brake pedal pressure and travel.
c. Sufficient throttle return spring and secured battery.
d. All lug nuts in place and tight.
e. Hubcaps/clip-on center caps are to be removed.
f. All loose items must be removed from the vehicle.
(Floor mats, things hanging from the rearview mirror, cassettes, CDs, and glove box, console, trunk items.) - Each segment of the event will be timed to 0.00.00. The competitor with the most combined points is the winner. The fastest autocross time will break all ties.
- Race directors and event management staff will have COMPLETE discretion to deny or remove from competition anyone in the event for any reason. All decisions are final.
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