Engle valve springs

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69swinger340391

69swinger340391

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Has anyone used the Engle valve spring and retainer mentioned in this article from Mopar Muscle Feb 2001:

http://www.compcams.com/Community/Articles/Details.asp?ID=-738676943

I ordered them (993 spring and 606LS retainer) for my 69 340 Dart. The pictures below show how the retainer sits on the spring. The retainer is slightly narrower than the spring. How does this look to you?

IMG_1169 (Small).JPG


IMG_1170 (Small).JPG


IMG_1171 (Small).JPG


IMG_1172 (Small).JPG
 
I think that article may have printed the wrong retainer number. That sounds like the big block retainer part#.
 
That looks terrible to me. Something is drastically wrong. The retainers can be a little smaller o.d. than the springs and it'll be ok. The problem is your retainers aren't sitting down into the springs. That tells me the step on the retainer is larger than the i.d. of the spring. Each step of the spring should fit snug into the each spring (the inner and outer). If they're sloppy that's bad cause it'll let them walk around and produce harmonics and if they don't engage like yours it's bad. I wonder if something was packaged wrong?
 
Rapid340 said:
I think that article may have printed the wrong retainer number. That sounds like the big block retainer part#.
Click to expand...

That is correct, the article listed 604LS as the part #, The guys at Engle said that 606LS is the correct retainer, and that is what they sent me, the 606LS
 
fishy68 said:
That looks terrible to me. Something is drastically wrong. The retainers can be a little smaller o.d. than the springs and it'll be ok. The problem is your retainers aren't sitting down into the springs. That tells me the step on the retainer is larger than the i.d. of the spring. Each step of the spring should fit snug into the each spring (the inner and outer). If they're sloppy that's bad cause it'll let them walk around and produce harmonics and if they don't engage like yours it's bad. I wonder if something was packaged wrong?
Click to expand...

This is what has me concerned. The spring does not seem to fit into the retainer properly. I cannot force it by hand. The only way I see that this will fit properly is if the spring diameter is increased.
 
I called Engle today. They pulled the same parts off the shelf, and said that what they had matches correctly. I emailed them tonight, but couldn't attach my pictures. Hopefully, just mislabeled parts. I do not feel comfortable putting these on the heads. I'll keep you updated.
 
69swinger340391 said:
I called Engle today. They pulled the same parts off the shelf, and said that what they had matches correctly. I emailed them tonight, but couldn't attach my pictures. Hopefully, just mislabeled parts. I do not feel comfortable putting these on the heads. I'll keep you updated.
Click to expand...

If theirs fit together right the ones they sent you must mis-labeled. Bummer.

BTW: Do you have a caliper? If so you can measure the i.d. of the springs and the o.d. of the steps on the retainers and tell them how they measure out. Since something must be labeled wrong you don't know which part it is that's wrong, the springs or retainers. If you don't have a caliper here's a link to one like I have. I use them almost every day on something. A great investment. Not as accurate as a mic but just fine to most stuff with and costs allot less.

http://store.summitracing.com/partd...&N=700+4294925139+4294843885+115&autoview=sku
 
I do have a caliper. Here are some numbers:

Spring outside diameter 1.465
Spring inside diameter 1.070

Retainer outside diameter 1.375
small step .782
larger step 1.128
 
The retainer in the mopar muscle article is 604ls,this retainer is for 11/32 valve stem size. Engle has retainers for stock 3/8 stem size,can't remember the part number. Contact them.
 
Engle says the 606LS is for the 3/8 valve stem, which is what they sent me, according to the label on the package. I just don't like the way they sit on the valve spring. The retainers do not snap into the spring the way I thought they should. I wonder if they have a 909 LS retainer, and the "909" stamp was put on the bag upside down?

IMG_1174 (Small).JPG
 
69swinger340391 said:
I do have a caliper. Here are some numbers:

Spring outside diameter 1.465
Spring inside diameter 1.070

Retainer outside diameter 1.375
small step .782
larger step 1.128
Click to expand...

There's your problem. The o.d. of the first step on the retainer is larger than the i.d. of the outer spring in which is has to fit. It'll never work like that. You might want to measure the 2nd step to also see if it would slip into the inner spring. I'd call Engle and tell them what you measured.

The spring i.d. is a very common size at 1.07". The step on the retainer is really big considering it's small total o.d. It only leaves .125" all the way around it for the spring to seat against which isn't much at all. I wonder if the retainer was just machined wrong cause I have never seen any that had a step that small.
 
3forty said:
The retainer in the mopar muscle article is 604ls,this retainer is for 11/32 valve stem size. Engle has retainers for stock 3/8 stem size,can't remember the part number. Contact them.
Click to expand...

Read through the entire thread and you'll see this question was already brought up and he answered it in post #7.
 
I just looked back at the pics and noticed the springs are singles so never mind my comment about measuring to see if the inner spring fits cause you don't have them. My mistake.
 
I just looked at Engle's website. What a pitiful website. Their new catalog only shows camshafts. Nothing else. Their old catalog is the only thing that shows spring and retainer part numbers. According to the old catalog the 606 is a big block retainer like Rapid340 suggested. They list 993 springs as being correct for small blocks but the only part number listed for retainers for a sb is 599S.
 
I couldn't find much info on the website either. Yes these are single springs with a damper. The spring ID I measured does not include the damper.

Can't drive the car anyway, Booset Dewey is rebuilding the power brake booster. Sent it to him about 2 weeks ago. I heard he does great work.

Till then, still waiting for a reply from Engle.
 
I heard from Engle today regarding the retainers. They are sending the 599 retainers, which should be the correct ones.

Excellent customer service from Engle.
 
I've gotten stuff from Engle. Mark Engle picked up the phone...lol. Great product, inexpensive (for a full custom cam), and timely service. The website might not be great, I agree... But I like a guy that answers his own phone...
 
I was considering using the factory style 340 valve springs until I saw this article:
1970 340 High Performance Mill Dyno - Mopar Muscle Magazine
With the concerns this thread started, I now have my doubts about that hotrod article regarding their valve spring conversion and the retainers they used. The article does not mention valve stem size. Are there really two valve stem sizes available for 340's (11/32 and 3/8)? If so, I wonder why?
Thank you.
 
dibbons said:
I was considering using the factory style 340 valve springs until I saw this article:
1970 340 High Performance Mill Dyno - Mopar Muscle Magazine
With the concerns this thread started, I now have my doubts about that hotrod article regarding their valve spring conversion and the retainers they used. The article does not mention valve stem size. Are there really two valve stem sizes available for 340's (11/32 and 3/8)? If so, I wonder why?
Thank you.
Click to expand...
Wow, I didn't even remember this thread. No wonder! It's 6 yrs. old, lol... To answer your question, 340's never used anything but a 3/8" diameter valve stem. Whoever said they used an 11/32" stem is mistaken.
 
I did some more research, it seems when bronze valve guides are installed, there are some 11/32" stem valves available to use in that case. I think they go for about $30 apiece.
 
Always ask to speak to Chris.
Mark isn't there and hasn't been for a long long time. He has his shop behind his house on the edge of Santa Monica, went over there to have him lathe some bb retainers to use in some 1.437 springs because the bb sat higher on the stem in relation to the lock-more installed height for what I was doing.
 
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