Getting nervous about cost of engine rebuild.

[diymirage]

Pistons are staying the same. Rings and bearings will be replaced as well as oil pump. The rotating assembly, heads, intake, carburetor, and distributor were provided by myself.

The one they advertise for that money has iron heads and is rated at 375.

No point in buying iron heads if you allready have the edlebrocks (unless I misunderstood it) so you could probably get a shortblock from blueprint, install the eddies and be money ahead

The show a 408, 445 HP and 500 FTLBS torque for $5400

Here is a review from one of our members on that one

My Blueprint crate engine story - May 2018

 

[NC Engine Builder]

I think they do offer shortblocks that are not listed on there website, if you allready have heads, as someone else mentioned, you could just put your heads on that shortblocks. Edelbrocks will flow enough to make your power goal without porting I believe.

 

[Johnny Mac]

Morning Fellas,

we do have shortblocks, they are just in their own section so everyone misses them ( i need to fix that) !

Shortblock
$2440 for a 408 shortblock with forged pistons. very popular with guys that have heads laying around.
I did see the thread, but sounded like the OP was well on his way into the build, so didn't want to sound like a hindsight is 20/20 advertisement.lol

We also do the aluminum headed 408 for $5460... 3 yr, 50k mile warranty.. makes 445
Chrysler Compatible Crate Engines

and a mag head version for $4250

I think many people think they can re-use blocks, and save some $'s here and there, but at the end of the day...it ends up costing more than something finished from us. Hard to argue with that warranty also...

 

[doogievlg]

Morning Fellas,

we do have shortblocks, they are just in their own section so everyone misses them ( i need to fix that) !

Shortblock
$2440 for a 408 shortblock with forged pistons. very popular with guys that have heads laying around.
I did see the thread, but sounded like the OP was well on his way into the build, so didn't want to sound like a hindsight is 20/20 advertisement.lol

We also do the aluminum headed 408 for $5460... 3 yr, 50k mile warranty.. makes 445
Chrysler Compatible Crate Engines

and a mag head version for $4250

That would have been the way to go. It’s water under the bridge now though.

 

[Johnny Mac]

That would have been the way to go. It’s water under the bridge now though.

Right, thats why i didn't chime in originally. Seems like you're most of the way there.
Keep us in mind if you need any ignition or fuel parts! i sell all that stuff too now!

 

[doogievlg]

Right, thats why i didn't chime in originally. Seems like you're most of the way there.
Keep us in mind if you need any ignition or fuel parts! i sell all that stuff too now!

Will do.

 

[doogievlg]

Just got the final nunber no sticker shock and he was right around where he quoted me. It was a bit more but not enough to give me sticker shock.

 

[yellow rose]

Better to buy heads than have your old one done. Until you do the seats , guides , Valves, springs for the new cam, retainers , and labor the cost is the same. That is without bowl blending or any porting. You can buy RPMs for the same price. They come ready to install. . Scat rods are cheaper than getting your old rods resized. A neutral balance crank don't cost that much. If you get $5000 into a used motor with all the old parts but the cam and lifters you got Taken big time. Get a invoice.
I had Ryan Shadey Dell do a motor for me. It came apart on start up. He charged me to CNC fly cut my Pistons $450. He used a drill and a file through my heads while it was assembled. His brother let the cat out of the bag by accident. He paid for a new motor and heads.

Most shops are in it for the money not the hobby. If you have them install a bigger cam than stock it is now a race motor no guarantee. They are your freind as long as the cash is flowing their way . Let something go wrong and then see how freindly they are. Watch your self and don't be afraid to ask a lot of questions and get everything they do described in detail on the reciept. All clearances and a build spec sheet. Its your motor and you need to know what was done for future reference for repair.

And the mopars are more money is a bull **** story. everyone pays the same. It goes by the number of cylinders and parts cost. labor is the same unless you getting screwed.

Do you do you job for the hobby or the money? WTF? This is a JOB not a F'ing hobby. It may be a hobby for you but not for the machine shop.

I know what I charge and the OP's 5k is close if not a bit shy. He is getting port work done. Geezus some people don't get it. It's not a hobby. This is why many quality small shops are closing up. You customers think we should build your **** because YOU think it's fun. BULLSHIT.


Back to the OP...like I said, the 5k number isn't outrageous. I charged $750 to assemble a complete engine, which includes degreeing the cam, checking P/V clearance and all the other little things you see on the build sheet, like bore diameters, shaft diameters, piston diameters, all the clearances and all that. It takes time and time is money.

A race engine started at $1500 and went up from there. It depends on how much went into making it all come together. BTW, it's not unusual to assemble and engine 7-8 times before it finally goes together. Some may take more than that.

 

[rustycowll69]

Just got the final nunber no sticker shock and he was right around where he quoted me. It was a bit more but not enough to give me sticker shock.

when they quote you a price, it's probably based on best case scenario. And there are almost always some problems.
If they aren't a SB Mopar fluent shop, make sure they have ALL the oil gallery plugs re-installed. I'm afraid it is an all too common mistake to leave at least one of the plugs out. That, and not clocking the rocker shafts correctly .

 

[doogievlg]

when they quote you a price, it's probably based on best case scenario. And there are almost always some problems.
If they aren't a SB Mopar fluent shop, make sure they have ALL the oil gallery plugs re-installed. I'm afraid it is an all too common mistake to leave at least one of the plugs out. That, and not clocking the rocker shafts correctly .

They are basically a mopar only shop. I knew I was in the right place when I saw this small block mopar.

 

[moper]

I guess I am still curious why the initial post was made, given the shops reputation and the lack of a quoted figure. Not trying to be difficult, but why drop it off and not get a quote? I give quotes before I ever take delivery of it...lol. There's always some flexibility required cuz **** happens, but I would tell everyone - get a quote. If they won't quote, move on. If you're comfortable with the engine going in with no written quote, it's kind of foolish to worry when it's on the pump.
Glad it worked out. A ring and bearing job with some extras and what I consider as all parts new will end up higher than your $4K number. A performance rebuild will go $*K plus, more for a stroker. If you want good results, you have to pay a good guy a fair wage, and use good parts. Pretty simple formula...lol

YR - I liked your comments in that regard.

 

[superchargeddrt]

when they quote you a price, it's probably based on best case scenario. And there are almost always some problems.
If they aren't a SB Mopar fluent shop, make sure they have ALL the oil gallery plugs re-installed. I'm afraid it is an all too common mistake to leave at least one of the plugs out. That, and not clocking the rocker shafts correctly .

Yep, My builder left the pressed in plug that goes under the oil pump out. Luckily he realized that he'd forgotten it and called me. I took it out of the old block I had. He said he would reinstall it when we dynoed the engine but I wanted to get the bottom end buttoned up.

 

[doogievlg]

I guess I am still curious why the initial post was made, given the shops reputation and the lack of a quoted figure. Not trying to be difficult, but why drop it off and not get a quote? I give quotes before I ever take delivery of it...lol. There's always some flexibility required cuz **** happens, but I would tell everyone - get a quote. If they won't quote, move on. If you're comfortable with the engine going in with no written quote, it's kind of foolish to worry when it's on the pump.
Glad it worked out. A ring and bearing job with some extras and what I consider as all parts new will end up higher than your $4K number. A performance rebuild will go $*K plus, more for a stroker. If you want good results, you have to pay a good guy a fair wage, and use good parts. Pretty simple formula...lol

YR - I liked your comments in that regard.

In post #12 I stated that he gave me an estimate of 4-5. Not a very detailed quote but he was in the neighborhood

 

[Oldmanmopar]

Do you do you job for the hobby or the money? WTF? This is a JOB not a F'ing hobby. It may be a hobby for you but not for the machine shop.

I know what I charge and the OP's 5k is close if not a bit shy. He is getting port work done. Geezus some people don't get it. It's not a hobby. This is why many quality small shops are closing up. You customers think we should build your **** because YOU think it's fun. BULLSHIT.


Back to the OP...like I said, the 5k number isn't outrageous. I charged $750 to assemble a complete engine, which includes degreeing the cam, checking P/V clearance and all the other little things you see on the build sheet, like bore diameters, shaft diameters, piston diameters, all the clearances and all that. It takes time and time is money.

A race engine started at $1500 and went up from there. It depends on how much went into making it all come together. BTW, it's not unusual to assemble and engine 7-8 times before it finally goes together. Some may take more than that.

When I read his heads were getting ported, Right there I knew he was at the wrong shop. Why not buy new aluminum heads. Oh yeah keep the shop in business. Why pass any savings onto the customer when you can charge for Guides or liners, Harden seats , grind the valves and seats, cut the heads, Clean the heads, port the heads. Chase the threads . And he will still have old iron out of date heads.

And $450 for a cam and lifters? That's doubling your money. You can use all the profanity you want it only shows how ashamed of you are of yourself. 7-8 times putting the motor together and taking it apart LOL

Shady Dell had the Same show room with tons of shiny motors. But when I picked my motor up I saw his shop . His mill was a harbor freight drill press mounted on concrete blocks . He subbed work out because he didn't have the machines to do the work himself. But he still charged for work not done by the spec sheet.


You talk a good game but Charging someone to port old heads instead of telling him to buy new tells me what kind of guy you are. LOL

This 340 had X heads. They were sold for $200 with the intake. not worth the time unless its a resto. That was the difference for new Edlebrock heads. You talk like this was my first rodeo. We live on small blocks here.

 

[doogievlg]

When I read his heads were getting ported, Right there I knew he was at the wrong shop. Why not buy new aluminum heads. Oh yeah keep the shop in business. Why pass any savings onto the customer when you can charge for Guides or liners, Harden seats , grind the valves and seats, cut the heads, Clean the heads, port the heads. Chase the threads . And he will still have old iron out of date heads.

And $450 for a cam and lifters? That's doubling your money. You can use all the profanity you want it only shows how ashamed of you are of yourself. 7-8 times putting the motor together and taking it apart LOL

Shady Dell had the Same show room with tons of shiny motors. But when I picked my motor up I saw his shop . His mill was a harbor freight drill press mounted on concrete blocks . He subbed work out because he didn't have the machines to do the work himself. But he still charged for work not done by the spec sheet.


You talk a good game but Charging someone to port old heads instead of telling him to buy new tells me what kind of guy you are. LOL

This 340 had X heads. They were sold for $200 with the intake. not worth the time unless its a resto. That was the difference for new Edlebrock heads. You talk like this was my first rodeo. We live on small blocks here.

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I confused by your post. If I am the “he” you are referring to then I am not using iron heads. The heads they are working on are aluminum edelbrock heads. My mistake on the cam. The item I was looking at was for a new timing chain, gears, and even lifters I believe . Looks like the cam by itself was around $220.

I am sure you both have much more experience than me considering I am not a machinist and I have simply just assembled engines. I don’t want to get in the middle of this debate but I just wanted to clear up the facts on my engine.

 

[Dartswinger70]

Yeah man, its like handing over a blank check...

 

[Oldmanmopar]

I confused by your post. If I am the “he” you are referring to then I am not using iron heads. The heads they are working on are aluminum edelbrock heads. My mistake on the cam. The item I was looking at was for a new timing chain, gears, and even lifters I believe . Looks like the cam by itself was around $220.

I am sure you both have much more experience than me considering I am not a machinist and I have simply just assembled engines. I don’t want to get in the middle of this debate but I just wanted to clear up the facts on my engine.

I read this above and saw heads getting mag'd assumed they were iron

ocal machine shop very reputable not custom engine builder just accurate. 360 build 2016 prices
degrease parts 72
mag heads 26
replace gudes 62
valve job 94
resurface heads 78
head plugs r&r 10
set installed height 80
mag crank 28
grind crankshaft 119
bore 267
hang pistons 34
cam bearings 40
core plug r&r 24
mag block 45
hone main line 177
install studs 20
asss 500
parts
eagle rods 270
main stud 90
main bearing 93
comp cam & lifters 228
valve springs 65
locks18
retainers55
cam bearings51
core pugs 11
tower bushing 8
shims 20
gasket set 84
oil pump 97
timing set 25
rings 65
pistons 480

 

[Dartswinger70]

Do you do you job for the hobby or the money? WTF? This is a JOB not a F'ing hobby. It may be a hobby for you but not for the machine shop.

I know what I charge and the OP's 5k is close if not a bit shy. He is getting port work done. Geezus some people don't get it. It's not a hobby. This is why many quality small shops are closing up. You customers think we should build your **** because YOU think it's fun. BULLSHIT.


Back to the OP...like I said, the 5k number isn't outrageous. I charged $750 to assemble a complete engine, which includes degreeing the cam, checking P/V clearance and all the other little things you see on the build sheet, like bore diameters, shaft diameters, piston diameters, all the clearances and all that. It takes time and time is money.

A race engine started at $1500 and went up from there. It depends on how much went into making it all come together. BTW, it's not unusual to assemble and engine 7-8 times before it finally goes together. Some may take more than that.

Yup. there is no money in it, or should I say not servicing every Tom, Dick and Harry off the street. I remember people wanting me to work on their cars for beer money, I was like, "I already have a refrigerator full of beer, you'll have to do better than that"

 

[73dartswingerlover]

Well i hope you are happy with what you get as imo a thing is only worth what someone is willing to pay.

A service is only worth what someone is willing to accept in payment.

 

[yellow rose]

When I read his heads were getting ported, Right there I knew he was at the wrong shop. Why not buy new aluminum heads. Oh yeah keep the shop in business. Why pass any savings onto the customer when you can charge for Guides or liners, Harden seats , grind the valves and seats, cut the heads, Clean the heads, port the heads. Chase the threads . And he will still have old iron out of date heads.

And $450 for a cam and lifters? That's doubling your money. You can use all the profanity you want it only shows how ashamed of you are of yourself. 7-8 times putting the motor together and taking it apart LOL

Shady Dell had the Same show room with tons of shiny motors. But when I picked my motor up I saw his shop . His mill was a harbor freight drill press mounted on concrete blocks . He subbed work out because he didn't have the machines to do the work himself. But he still charged for work not done by the spec sheet.


You talk a good game but Charging someone to port old heads instead of telling him to buy new tells me what kind of guy you are. LOL

This 340 had X heads. They were sold for $200 with the intake. not worth the time unless its a resto. That was the difference for new Edlebrock heads. You talk like this was my first rodeo. We live on small blocks here.

View attachment 1715173986

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This entire post is nuts. Think what you want. It's not a HOBBY for some of us. Pay hobby prices, get hobby work. As for buying an aluminum head and saving money your dead wrong. I won't use an out of the box head because 99 times out of 100 the guides are too tight, the valve job is outdated (at best) the chambers require work (even the highly vaunted CNC junk), I won't use their seals or springs.

Don't step over a donut to pick up a dog turd. If you can't afford your HOBBY, why should someone else pay for it? Pay for it yourself.

 

[Oldmanmopar]

At age 65 I don't have to make the big money on people. My son has full time job . I'm retired and collecting a pension and the members that stop in lend a hand. I call it a "Hobby". All the equipment here is paid for and I enjoy making things go fast and seeing smiles on faces.

 

[mario03srt]

Doogie,

What did it do on the dyno?

FYI, Mike charged me 650.00 to assemble the long block, mani to oil pan. I supplied the paint, he cleaned and painted the block. I paid extra for working the new Indy X heads, clearancing the PRW SS Quotient roller rockers, etc. No telling how much the whole motor cost but we only kept the block, crank, resized the rods, everything else was tossed. Some day I'll add it up......no maybe not lol.

Maybe your guys work scope contains things that others do not to include a dyno run. A local shop wanted 500-750 to run mine in across from Cincy Speed. F that, I put on my big boy balls, triple checked everything and let er rip. After the header smoke cleared I finally exhaled . Very stressful, but my builder was right there! BTW he does builds on the side and it was 16 months from machining to firing it up! Equally, stressful!

Good Luck.

Marion

 

[mario03srt]

Doogie,

What did it do on the dyno?

FYI, Mike charged me 650.00 to assemble the long block, mani to oil pan. I supplied the paint, he cleaned and painted the block. I paid extra for working the new Indy X heads, clearancing the PRW SS Quotient roller rockers, etc. No telling how much the whole motor cost but we only kept the block, crank, resized the rods, everything else was tossed. Some day I'll add it up......no maybe not lol.

Maybe your guys work scope contains things that others do not to include a dyno run. A local shop wanted 500-750 to run mine in across from Cincy Speed. F that, I put on my big boy balls, triple checked everything and let er rip. After the header smoke cleared I finally exhaled . Very stressful, but my builder was right there! BTW he does builds on the side and it was 16 months from machining to firing it up! Equally, stressful!

Good Luck.

Marion

Resized Rods and hanging the pistons were 250.00 too.

 

[doogievlg]

Doogie,

What did it do on the dyno?

FYI, Mike charged me 650.00 to assemble the long block, mani to oil pan. I supplied the paint, he cleaned and painted the block. I paid extra for working the new Indy X heads, clearancing the PRW SS Quotient roller rockers, etc. No telling how much the whole motor cost but we only kept the block, crank, resized the rods, everything else was tossed. Some day I'll add it up......no maybe not lol.

Maybe your guys work scope contains things that others do not to include a dyno run. A local shop wanted 500-750 to run mine in across from Cincy Speed. F that, I put on my big boy balls, triple checked everything and let er rip. After the header smoke cleared I finally exhaled . Very stressful, but my builder was right there! BTW he does builds on the side and it was 16 months from machining to firing it up! Equally, stressful!

Good Luck.

Marion

I went and looked at the motor yesterday. They really did a top notch job. Replaced a lot of things that were pretty worn out that I would have left on the engine. Distributor was rebuilt, water pump, oil pump, oil pick up, and gas pump was replaced. New line was run from the pump to a regulator to the carburetor with an Earl’s in line filter. New breather was installed and new valve installed in the back of the valve cover instead of the front. That was just the small things I could see by looking st the engine. Dyno day cost $500 and it is going down on Tuesday.

 

[yellow rose]

I went and looked at the motor yesterday. They really did a top notch job. Replaced a lot of things that were pretty worn out that I would have left on the engine. Distributor was rebuilt, water pump, oil pump, oil pick up, and gas pump was replaced. New line was run from the pump to a regulator to the carburetor with an Earl’s in line filter. New breather was installed and new valve installed in the back of the valve cover instead of the front. That was just the small things I could see by looking st the engine. Dyno day cost $500 and it is going down on Tuesday.

I'd rather have a customer be pissed off over the price than pissed off over cutting corners and not doing all the little details.

This is awesome. Can't wait to see the dyno numbers.