Matching Torsion Bars, Leaf Springs and Shock Absorbers

[charliec]

I've spent the better part of a day trying to come up with the best shock absorbers to match the other suspension components on the '68 Dart. I'm probably more confused now than when I started this exercise. I'm using a front suspension from a '73 Duster. I installed new 0.89" bars. The leaf springs are 4-1/2 leafs, the "1/2 leaf" being a short piece that is from the axle forward. I bought the springs from Year1 a long time ago as the stock springs for '68 Dart GTS 340; I have no idea what the spring rate is, but they do have the larger front bushings.
I'm not going to race the car, so that whole class of shocks is out of consideration. However, I don't want to float around like a magic carpet when all is said and done.
I know that no one can tell me in advance what is going to please me; that's a personal preference. But I want a comfortable ride that will still handle reasonably well in turns.
The threads I've read on this board seem to emphasize matching the shocks to the other components. Based on the above, what do you guys suggest?
Follow up: What do you think about NOS shocks? Do they deteriorate sitting in a box for 20 -30 years?

 

[charliec]

...PS
The car has a front sway bar with rubber bushings. No rear bar.

 

[Rat Bastid]

Just bite the bullet and order a set of Viking double adjustable shocks. Buy once, cry once. Cutting corners on shocks is like licking dog poo because it looks like chocolate.

 

[mvh]

I have been happy using KYB Gas-a-just shocks all around for 30-odd years on both stock and modified A-bodies. For a softer ride use Monroe Sensatrac. For higher performance builds use Bilstein or Koni, but you have to do a little homework to source these. Don't sweat it — it's not rocket science. But I would not use NOS shocks — the seals would probably not hold up after all these years.

 

[DAndy ART]

I've spent the better part of a day trying to come up with the best shock absorbers to match the other suspension components on the '68 Dart. I'm probably more confused now than when I started this exercise. I'm using a front suspension from a '73 Duster. I installed new 0.89" bars. The leaf springs are 4-1/2 leafs, the "1/2 leaf" being a short piece that is from the axle forward. I bought the springs from Year1 a long time ago as the stock springs for '68 Dart GTS 340; I have no idea what the spring rate is, but they do have the larger front bushings.
I'm not going to race the car, so that whole class of shocks is out of consideration. However, I don't want to float around like a magic carpet when all is said and done.
I know that no one can tell me in advance what is going to please me; that's a personal preference. But I want a comfortable ride that will still handle reasonably well in turns.
The threads I've read on this board seem to emphasize matching the shocks to the other components. Based on the above, what do you guys suggest?
Follow up: What do you think about NOS shocks? Do they deteriorate sitting in a box for 20 -30 years?

The 0.89 bars will likely be similar to wet spaghetti. I started with PST 1.03 and they were a step change. I now have 1.14 and the car is mint. I have Hotchkis-Fox adjustable shocks. You could easily get the non-adjustable version. No idea about the leaf springs. I have hotchkis leafs.

A swaybar will be money well spent. Period. Same same for chassis connectors.

 

[72bluNblu]

KYB gas-adjusts are hot garbage. If the price is a problem and you really want to run cheap shocks run the OE replacement Monroe’s or Gabriel’s, they’re both better shocks than the KYB’s and cost less.

Bilstein RCD’s are great shocks, so are the Hotchkis Fox shocks (both adjustable and non-adjustable). I haven’t personally run the Viking adjustables but I’ve heard great things about them.

Tossing the KYB’s I had on my Challenger in the trash and replacing them with Bilstein RCD’s might still be in the top ten best modifications I made to my Challenger. Definitely the easiest, tossing the KYB’s made it a whole different car from a ride quality standpoint.

 

[Ironracer]

KYB gas-adjusts are hot garbage. If the price is a problem and you really want to run cheap shocks run the OE replacement Monroe’s or Gabriel’s, they’re both better shocks than the KYB’s and cost less.

Bilstein RCD’s are great shocks, so are the Hotchkis Fox shocks (both adjustable and non-adjustable). I haven’t personally run the Viking adjustables but I’ve heard great things about them.

Tossing the KYB’s I had on my Challenger in the trash and replacing them with Bilstein RCD’s might still be in the top ten best modifications I made to my Challenger. Definitely the easiest, tossing the KYB’s made it a whole different car from a ride quality standpoint.

They run stiff. I kinda dig it. The Monroe and Gabriel's I've ran on my old 66 Sat. Eh....

 

[72bluNblu]

They run stiff. I kinda dig it. The Monroe and Gabriel's I've ran on my old 66 Sat. Eh....

Just run stiffer bars, the car will actually handle better instead of just riding stiffer because it’s overdamped with lousy shocks.

 

[autoxcuda]

I've spent the better part of a day trying to come up with the best shock absorbers to match the other suspension components on the '68 Dart. I'm probably more confused now than when I started this exercise. I'm using a front suspension from a '73 Duster. I installed new 0.89" bars. The leaf springs are 4-1/2 leafs, the "1/2 leaf" being a short piece that is from the axle forward. I bought the springs from Year1 a long time ago as the stock springs for '68 Dart GTS 340; I have no idea what the spring rate is, but they do have the larger front bushings.
I'm not going to race the car, so that whole class of shocks is out of consideration. However, I don't want to float around like a magic carpet when all is said and done.
I know that no one can tell me in advance what is going to please me; that's a personal preference. But I want a comfortable ride that will still handle reasonably well in turns.
The threads I've read on this board seem to emphasize matching the shocks to the other components. Based on the above, what do you guys suggest?
Follow up: What do you think about NOS shocks? Do they deteriorate sitting in a box for 20 -30 years?

New HD Gabriel or Monroe would be better than NOS. NOS would be lots of money for something that could spring a leak tomorrow from sitting on the shelf.

My recommendation would be Bilstein RCD non adjustable.

The expense of adjustable shocks doesn't fit what you are doing.

 

[Rat Bastid]

Looks like the Bilstein is 152 bucks and the Viking is 205. That’s 608 dollars for a non adjustable shock. 820 for a double adjustable shock.

Saving 53 dollars a shock for something that isn’t adjustable is stepping over a donut to pick up a dog turd.

I’ve never heard someone complain that something was too adjustable.

 

[Ottmundr]

I've spent the better part of a day trying to come up with the best shock absorbers to match the other suspension components on the '68 Dart. I'm probably more confused now than when I started this exercise. I'm using a front suspension from a '73 Duster. I installed new 0.89" bars. The leaf springs are 4-1/2 leafs, the "1/2 leaf" being a short piece that is from the axle forward. I bought the springs from Year1 a long time ago as the stock springs for '68 Dart GTS 340; I have no idea what the spring rate is, but they do have the larger front bushings.
I'm not going to race the car, so that whole class of shocks is out of consideration. However, I don't want to float around like a magic carpet when all is said and done.
I know that no one can tell me in advance what is going to please me; that's a personal preference. But I want a comfortable ride that will still handle reasonably well in turns.
The threads I've read on this board seem to emphasize matching the shocks to the other components. Based on the above, what do you guys suggest?
Follow up: What do you think about NOS shocks? Do they deteriorate sitting in a box for 20 -30 years?

Stinkbug look is the way to go with some Goodyear polyglass tires.
C.B. whip antenna with a raccoon tail.
8 track blasting Johnny Cash or Motorhead.
Thrush sticker and either Yosemite Sam Back Off! Mudflaps or that green furball dude flipping the bird mudflaps.
Wallet chain, Jeans, tshirt, workboots and muttonchops/pornstache, pack of Marlboros and a zippo.

That's what I suggest.

All joking aside, what kind of ride do you like? Figure that out first, then build towards that the best you can. The way I read your question is like a guy asking what cam to pick without nailing down what he wants the car to do.

We at least eliminated the floating down the road on a cloud.
Reasonably well in turns.
Honda civic?
Porsche 914?
Ford Taurus?

I kinda get the feeling that you want it to handle like a modern car. And remember, handling/feel is subjective.

 

[autoxcuda]

Looks like the Bilstein is 152 bucks and the Viking is 205. That’s 608 dollars for a non adjustable shock. 820 for a double adjustable shock.

Saving 53 dollars a shock for something that isn’t adjustable is stepping over a donut to pick up a dog turd.

I’ve never heard someone complain that something was too adjustable.

I thought the Bilsteins were a little over $400 for a complete set. www.firmfeel.com lists them for $500. But I may be behind the times on pricing.

For another $200, I would do it. But some may not want to or have skills to figure out what to adjust them to.

Heck for around $100, the OP may be happy with Monroe's from the parts store. He's just got a stock suspension setup with 383 torsion bars.

 

[rustycowll69]

I know these are probably rarer than hens teeth, especially now 40+ yrs afterwards, but I have used the 76 fleet/police factory optional rear sway bar for a-bodies. I highly recommend it. It's not crazy thick, but it just works. I'm sure there are aftermarket sway bars out there, but I can't personally vouch for any of them. Whereas, the factory bar is simple yet elegant and I know it works great on my 66 cuda.

 

[supertruck]

Unless you're an experienced road racer / circle track driver, then IMHO spending for adjustable shocks is wasting money. 90% of all drivers with a street machine will not tell a difference with adjustable shocks unless they happen to go way too far one way or the other with the adjustments. Get a good set of non-adjustable, save some money, and motor down the road.

 

[charliec]

Stinkbug look is the way to go with some Goodyear polyglass tires.
C.B. whip antenna with a raccoon tail.
8 track blasting Johnny Cash or Motorhead.
Thrush sticker and either Yosemite Sam Back Off! Mudflaps or that green furball dude flipping the bird mudflaps.
Wallet chain, Jeans, tshirt, workboots and muttonchops/pornstache, pack of Marlboros and a zippo.

That's what I suggest.

All joking aside, what kind of ride do you like? Figure that out first, then build towards that the best you can. The way I read your question is like a guy asking what cam to pick without nailing down what he wants the car to do.

We at least eliminated the floating down the road on a cloud.
Reasonably well in turns.
Honda civic?
Porsche 914?
Ford Taurus?

I kinda get the feeling that you want it to handle like a modern car. And remember, handling/feel is subjective.

Not a Honda, Porsche or Taurus. It's a '68 Dart!

 

[Rat Bastid]

Unless you're an experienced road racer / circle track driver, then IMHO spending for adjustable shocks is wasting money. 90% of all drivers with a street machine will not tell a difference with adjustable shocks unless they happen to go way too far one way or the other with the adjustments. Get a good set of non-adjustable, save some money, and motor down the road.

I disagree. How hard is it to understand the concept of bump And rebound and which way to turn one of two knobs?

I can’t believe it’s damn near 2023 and guys still can’t see the value of double adjustable shocks.

 

[72bluNblu]

I disagree. How hard is it to understand the concept of bump And rebound and which way to turn one of two knobs?

I can’t believe it’s damn near 2023 and guys still can’t see the value of double adjustable shocks.

Honestly I’ve had adjustable shocks, I understand bump and rebound and what it means to have a critically damped suspension. And you know what? Those adjustables have almost always ended up set pretty close to middle of range for the street. If you buy the right shocks for your application to begin with then on a street car the adjustment shouldn’t need to be all the way at one end or the other. And if you’re not changing springs, ride height or alignment then once they’re set they’re not going to need to be readjusted.

Now, if you’re altering your set up for different tracks, or going back and forth between street and track all the time then being able to adjust the shocks makes sense. But for primarily street use they’re not necessary.

I run non-adjustable Hotchkis Fox shocks on my Duster (bought them second hand, probably would have bought adjustables if I was buying new) - and they’ve been awesome. I honestly can’t say I would have changed them even if they were adjustable. High quality shocks should have enough valving and be set up well enough to work on the street right out of the box.

 

[Rat Bastid]

Honestly I’ve had adjustable shocks, I understand bump and rebound and what it means to have a critically damped suspension. And you know what? Those adjustables have almost always ended up set pretty close to middle of range for the street. If you buy the right shocks for your application to begin with then on a street car the adjustment shouldn’t need to be all the way at one end or the other. And if you’re not changing springs, ride height or alignment then once they’re set they’re not going to need to be readjusted.

Now, if you’re altering your set up for different tracks, or going back and forth between street and track all the time then being able to adjust the shocks makes sense. But for primarily street use they’re not necessary.

I run non-adjustable Hotchkis Fox shocks on my Duster (bought them second hand, probably would have bought adjustables if I was buying new) - and they’ve been awesome. I honestly can’t say I would have changed them even if they were adjustable. High quality shocks should have enough valving and be set up well enough to work on the street right out of the box.

I looked and couldn’t tell exactly which shock you have. Just for my benefit do you mind posting a link to them? I want to check them out.

TIA

 

[RogerRamRod]

Hotchkis nonadjustable by Fox Hotchkis Tuned 1.5 Street Performance Series Shock 4 Pack MOPAR A/E Body

 

[72bluNblu]

I looked and couldn’t tell exactly which shock you have. Just for my benefit do you mind posting a link to them? I want to check them out.

TIA

RogerRamRod posted them already, I have the Hotchkis Fox non-adjustables. Looks like Hotchkis updated them (or at least the graphics) since I bought mine, mine match this picture and listing.

1974 DODGE DART Hotchkis Sport Suspension 79020015 Hotchkis Sport Suspension 1.5 Street Performance Series Shock Kits | Summit Racing

 

[Johnny Dart]

KYB or Monroe's !!!!!!​

With all the money you saved, you can take that beautiful woman out to a nice steak and lobster dinner !!!!!
Think about it, you'll be a hero !!!!!!!!

In all seriousness, I have 3 Darts, and everyone of them have KYB's. The car feels nice and firm with them. Not to soft, not to firm. Everything I need in a shock, for these old dinosaurs.
Just a nice shock at a fair price. Even the Monroe's are right there in quality and ride.
Steak and Lobster never tasted so good !!!!!!!














.

 

[72bluNblu]

KYB or Monroe's !!!!!!​

With all the money you saved, you can take that beautiful woman out to a nice steak and lobster dinner !!!!!
Think about it, you'll be a hero !!!!!!!!

In all seriousness, I have 3 Darts, and everyone of them have KYB's. The car feels nice and firm with them. Not to soft, not to firm. Everything I need in a shock, for these old dinosaurs.
Just a nice shock at a fair price. Even the Monroe's are right there in quality and ride.
Steak and Lobster never tasted so good !!!!!!!














.

I drive my Duster entirely too much to run trash KYB’s. They’re terrible. Even on cars with small torsion bars they’re just cheap garbage, but if you run decent sized torsion bars the KYB’s are completely inadequate.

If you’ve never run anything better, you don’t know any better.

 

[rustycowll69]

I drive my Duster entirely too much to run trash KYB’s. They’re terrible. Even on cars with small torsion bars they’re just cheap garbage, but if you run decent sized torsion bars the KYB’s are completely inadequate.

If you’ve never run anything better, you don’t know any better.

Not a big fan of KYB's. I think they are well-made, especially for the price, and they last a long time, but they are way too harsh for me.
I don't have much experience with aftermarket shocks recently, except for Bilsteins on my 02 Ram 2500. I really preferred my oem rear shocks on it, but they were both beginning to leak after 120k miles, so I stepped up. Meh. Maybe I'd like them better if I did the fronts, too, but I dunno.
I really loved the old hydraulic Konis. I've had them on A-bodies, & E-bodies, and they never disappointed me.

 

[Johnny Dart]

I drive my Duster entirely too much to run trash KYB’s. They’re terrible. Even on cars with small torsion bars they’re just cheap garbage, but if you run decent sized torsion bars the KYB’s are completely inadequate.

If you’ve never run anything better, you don’t know any better.

Do you ever read the full post from a member, or do you just see shocks, and scream Hotchkiss or Fox or Koni !!!!!!!
Because I don't think you do.
He stated that he "wasn't going to race the car, so that whole class of shock is out of consideration".
Did you read that part ?
I didn't think so, because suggesting a set of $600.00+ shocks is probably what he meant by, "whole class of shock".
What I get from his post is he is looking for a decent all around shock, that doesn't break the bank.
Maybe I'm wrong, and he has no problem putting $600.00+ shocks on his car. But from what I'm reading that is not what he is looking do. And for that matter, a set of KYB' or Monroe's would fit the bill just fine.

 

[charliec]

Do you ever read the full post from a member, or do you just see shocks, and scream Hotchkiss or Fox or Koni !!!!!!!
Because I don't think you do.
He stated that he "wasn't going to race the car, so that whole class of shock is out of consideration".
Did you read that part ?
I didn't think so, because suggesting a set of $600.00+ shocks is probably what he meant by, "whole class of shock".
What I get from his post is he is looking for a decent all around shock, that doesn't break the bank.
Maybe I'm wrong, and he has no problem putting $600.00+ shocks on his car. But from what I'm reading that is not what he is looking do. And for that matter, a set of KYB' or Monroe's would fit the bill just fine.

You nailed it , Johnny. I've enjoyed reading the discussion. And I've issued "thanks " emojis to most all of them. But you got the message.