Pro Flo 4 Timing

Electrical and Ignition

  1. TurboGLH

    TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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    There was more than enough adjustment in the rotor to account for all the movement I wanted, plus some. So I guess it doesn't matter either way, but I'm just as happy not having to pull the distributor. It's after 8 here, and I try not to annoy my neighbors. I'll post up results tomorrow after a test start/drive.
     
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    • Mopar73340

      Mopar73340 Well-Known Member

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      So did you advance the rotor or retard it? I ordered the adjustable rotor yesterday so it won’t be here for a couple days. Interested to hear how it works on your engine.
       
    • TurboGLH

      TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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      I moved it the rotor CW until it was centered on the #1 post when the motor was set at 25deg BTDC. That's the middle of my timing range (15initial, 35 total) not including any vacuum advance. There was still more room for adjustment if I find there's still an issue at high vacuum part throttle (where I was having issues) when the timing will be as high as 40-45.
       
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      • Ivan Baez

        Ivan Baez 426 SB daily driver

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        but also Edelbrock should have tested it no?,seems weird, just like the fact the 426 map did not work on my application but had to go a lot higher for the system to behave ok all across the RPM range. If the the vaccuum advance issue is the problem because of how the ECU reads the MAP sensor value thet should be an easy settings fix, even if not orthodox.

        Lets see how the rotor alignment works out for TruboGLH
         
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        • Ivan Baez

          Ivan Baez 426 SB daily driver

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          if possible take pictures on how it looked as stock and how it looks once you corrected it with the adjustable rotor cap
           
        • Ivan Baez

          Ivan Baez 426 SB daily driver

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          This may be useful information from the edebrock EFI forum by on of the Edelbrock tech guys:

          "You're close but there are a couple other details to keep in mind. First, the vacuum advance is applied across the full vacuum scale. This means that vacuum advance is minimum at lowest vacuum (like when near atmospheric pressure) and maximum at highest vacuum (-30 inHg). If your vacuum advance is set to 5° and you're idling at -10 inHg of vacuum, your actual vacuum advance is only going to be 1.67°. The point of vacuum advance is to apply more ignition timing in low load cruise where you're going to have a lot more vacuum than just sitting at idle. The idle control timing is for timing control at idle - see next paragraph.

          If you're checking your timing while in idle, you're going to see significant changes in ignition timing because the ECU is using a corrective timing trim to help control idle engine speed. It's much quicker to control engine speed using ignition timing than it is to try and move the idle air control plunger in and out to control air flow. You would need exit idle (apply a little throttle to increase engine speed) to see what the timing is doing without the idle ignition trim being active. One step you should have done was to lock the timing in the app to 12° in order to set your base timing. By locking the timing, you disable the idle and vacuum advance trims and run at a fixed 12° advance. You can check it again in Advanced Tuning>Base Timing. Any variance you see in timing at the crank with a timing light with the timing locked is due to cam and distributor drive slop."

          I hope is useful.

          So basically if you are above your start time increase threshold and the ECU is not reading zero the vacuum advance is being partially added to your base timing. This becomes very important if the MAP is not reading zero at full throttle, because it will be adding some vacuum advance portion to your highest timing setting even if under hard acceleration.

          At least the vacuum advance seems to be linear, so you can make a pretty easy calculation on how both should combine to not screw up and have your desired top atiming advance at full throttle.

          Take care,
           
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          • TurboGLH

            TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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            In order, 25 deg of advance stock, 25 deg of advance adjusted, 35 deg of advance stock, 35 deg of advance adjusted.

            25degStock.jpg
            25degAdjusted.jpg
            35degStock.jpg
            35degAdjusted.jpg
             
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            • Ivan Baez

              Ivan Baez 426 SB daily driver

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            • Cal Tonsley

              Cal Tonsley Well-Known Member

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              Ivan, thanks for sharing your videos, that is one very nice looking and speedy Barracuda!!
               
              Last edited: Apr 21, 2021
            • BergmanAutoCraft

              BergmanAutoCraft FABO Vendor FABO Vendor

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              If you turn the rail around and use Edelbrock’s rail mounted regulator it makes for a tidy installation.

              A1D61FE6-18F4-4260-9910-39032D05CAE3.jpeg

              F5485E1E-9086-4E28-8526-13479AC5392F.jpeg
               
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              • Ivan Baez

                Ivan Baez 426 SB daily driver

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                that looks cool, I ran the edelbrock EFI fuel pum kit and the regulator is already integrated into it.
                 
              • JoesEdge

                JoesEdge Well-Known Member

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                By any chance, did you post this to the Edelbrock forums too? Doing so may light a fire under their butt to fix it or offer the part as well as a work around solution.
                 
              • JoesEdge

                JoesEdge Well-Known Member

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                @GMachineDartGT I'm assuming the fuel hoses come up along the firewall? Do you have any pictures of how you ran those? No worries with the heat from the headers? What type of hoses are you running? Thanks!!!
                 
              • Ivan Baez

                Ivan Baez 426 SB daily driver

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                This is my setup, using a high flow edelbrock mechanical pump feeding the edelbrock EFI pump, using the stock line (orange) on the mechanical one.

                The stock lines are close to the headers, about 2 inches or so

                WhatsApp Image 2020-09-18 at 4.48.54 PM (6).jpeg
                 
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                • TurboGLH

                  TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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                  I posted that it worked, but not how much it corrected the rotor position. I'll post the before/after photos when I get home.

                  It was late, my neighbors are old, and the car is loud. I'll know more tonight if the weather holds out.
                   
                  Last edited: Apr 21, 2021
                • TurboGLH

                  TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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                  I'm running 3/8" nicopp front to back, flared ends, aeroquip fc355 line, aeroquip fittings, and sniper EFI in cell fuel pump.

                  IMG_20201003_101104.jpg IMG_20200920_121058.jpg IMG_20200514_202036.jpg IMG_20200519_181849.jpg
                   
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                  • TurboGLH

                    TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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                    Raining here, but cold start was better. I would have to feather the throttle for a bit no matter what I did before, now it cranks and idles right where it's supposed to. I changed the TPS as well, the old one would refuse to return to zero and I'd end up at 2% TPS and no idle speed control (AIS motor is disabled above 1% throttle position). So i need to get it out in the driveway and warmed up, then redo the idle speed adjustment.
                     
                  • BergmanAutoCraft

                    BergmanAutoCraft FABO Vendor FABO Vendor

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                    I presented this on the forum. One of the guys who pretends to be the moderator just tried to belittle me. After the fact the real moderator asked for photos of the distributor after it was installed. I posted the photo of slotting the shutter wheel. I emailed a reply to efi tech with my findings. No reply. Great product but another big company with crappy service.
                     
                  • JoesEdge

                    JoesEdge Well-Known Member

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                    I blame the crappy service because Edelbrock is pulling their headquarters out of California (probably doesn't make a difference, but I'm bitter). Some of the foundries are still here in California though, like 2 hours south of me.

                    It used to be nice when they were down the street. Actually, it was nice when Vic Jr. was still alive and we could all go to his annual car show at Vic's Garage. I miss that! :(
                     
                  • BergmanAutoCraft

                    BergmanAutoCraft FABO Vendor FABO Vendor

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                    I think its sign of the times. Large companies with employees that have a high work load. Not bad people but its the way they run.
                     
                  • Mopar73340

                    Mopar73340 Well-Known Member

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                    This doesn’t surprise me. Overall I have had good conversations with the actual forum moderator except when it comes to this topic a couple of years back now. Since I’ve been living with the low amount of timing for a couple years now I’m thankful for the work you and TurboGLH have put into finding a solution.

                    Now I can’t wait for the rotors I ordered to arrive.
                     
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                    • BergmanAutoCraft

                      BergmanAutoCraft FABO Vendor FABO Vendor

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                      Nate was a great source of knowledge, but he left.
                       
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                      • Mopar73340

                        Mopar73340 Well-Known Member

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                        I beg to disagree with this. While he may have had lots of information, he was a total ass. He deleted many of my posts and banned me (blocked my IP address) from the site because he disagreed with me on some of these issues. This topic included. I even agreed to disagree with him and asked why my posts were deleted and that post was deleted. I’m glad he’s gone.
                         
                        Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
                      • BergmanAutoCraft

                        BergmanAutoCraft FABO Vendor FABO Vendor

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                        I didn’t know that.
                         
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                        • TurboGLH

                          TurboGLH Well-Known Member

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                          Weather hasn't been great the last two days, still no test drive yet. Car starts and idles much better is all I know so far.
                           
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