Starter clicks using the key, engine starts by jumpering the relay

[Dana67Dart]

So here is what we know.

1. No wiring changes till after the problem came to a head.
2. With right turn signal on the key will crank the engine and start but it won't stay running.

Now we know the following is good

1. The starter works fine.
2. The starter solenoid works fine
3. The starter relay works fine
4. The NSS cir works fine.

Problem...

1. The key should not require the turn signal to be on to start.
2. With the key in the run position and the turn signal on there is no power to the ignition.

I suspect that with the previous "giggle wires under the dash" allowed the engine to start that there are bad connections and maybe shorted wires under there.

 

[Righty Tighty]

So here is what we know.

1. No wiring changes till after the problem came to a head.
2. With right turn signal on the key will crank the engine and start but it won't stay running.

One addition to #2 - the engine will start and stay running now. But still only with either the left or right turn signal engaged. Once the engine is running, I can disengage the turn signal and the engine will stay running.

Now we know the following is good

1. The starter works fine.
2. The starter solenoid works fine
3. The starter relay works fine
4. The NSS cir works fine.

Problem...

1. The key should not require the turn signal to be on to start.
2. With the key in the run position and the turn signal on there is no power to the ignition.

I suspect that with the previous "giggle wires under the dash" allowed the engine to start that there are bad connections and maybe shorted wires under there.

That is my hunch, that the problem is somewhere in or near the bulkhead. But then again, I’m the one asking for help here, haha.

I don’t know if this is related, but I’ve blown a couple fuses recently: the stop lamp fuse and the emergency flasher fuse. I replaced them and they haven’t blown since. I also don’t have any tail lights when the headlights are on. Brake lights, no tail lights. I think I may just need to rip all of the wiring out and start fresh, as mentioned before.

 

[67Dart273]

Here's what I would do: UNPLUG the turn signal switch until you find the problem, as that should remove the odd feedback whatever it is that is doing that.

My "wild guess?" You somehow (or someone) got a couple or more wires crossed up in the bulkhead connector

 

[Dana67Dart]

I think you first need to trace out all the circuits as mentioned earlier and become familiar with how these cars work, before you go to the trouble of rewiring the car. (Mostly because some of the wires will be difficult at best to reach under the dash)


I suspect you will find wires that are melted to each other in the bundle. And melted plastic connectors that are not allowing terminals to make good contact.

 

[Righty Tighty]

Quick update. My plan of attack was to unwrap the harness under the dash and then disconnect the turn signal switch as suggested, then test, test, test.

I had always known this car's wiring was janky AT BEST, but after taking a good long gander under the dash, boy is it bad!! Loosely connected splices, bare wire, wires crudely twisted together....ALL very poor connections. The car is a '74 but the dash is a '70. I assume the harness is also a '70, so there are wires with connectors that go nowhere. And on and on and on.

The dash pad is so badly cracked, that I decided to buy a replacement last year. Found a '71-74 complete dash in much better condition and had planned on starting fresh with that one (new harness, etc.). No time like the present, so I'm going to start on it as time permits.

I haven't gotten to unplugging the turn signal switch yet, maybe today or tomorrow. However, I've noticed the problem changes as the position of the fuse box changes. Still only starts with the turn signal engaged, but sometimes I have to keep the key turned or else it will die, other times the engine only cranks, other times no crank at all.

I don't see any wires melted together or any obvious damage yet, but I'm going to keep digging. Even though I'll be replacing this dash/harness, I'd still like to know where the heck the issue is. Thanks for the help so far.

 

[67Dart273]

Well with that info, it becomes somewhat more clear WHY you are having such problems. If indeed someone has morphed a 70 and 74 harness, that is even more trouble.

Frankly, I see no way out at this point other than either repop replacement harness or starting over with a universal harness

Thing is, either you or we, not even knowing what harness is there, and all chopped up, you can't really go by a diagram

 

[Righty Tighty]

I had been hesitant to pull the trigger on a new harness due to cost, but after realizing the condition of everything under there, I decided it’s time. So a couple days ago I bought a complete under dash harness from Year One. Let’s see how long it takes, I’m anticipating it’ll take several months considering the state of parts supplies these days.