TF & Speedmaster Flow Tests

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Here are a few thoughts on a few different fronts.

If someone is building a high rpm 340/360 or a stout street 408/416 and budget is a consideration, these are a great option out of the box. Maybe the best option for the money. In my opinion ported Edelbrocks or Speedmasters could be just as good, but it takes a lot of work to get them there. The TF has a nice valve job with valves already back cut. The throat size is 89%-90% which leaves a little wiggle room. The fit between the valve and guide is right. The combustion chamber design seems better than the other options. It's a nice head.

With that said, I was a little disappointed with them. That is probably a result of my expectations being too high or misguided from the beginning. I'm not knocking the TF's - these are nice heads. But I was hoping to have an aha moment with the TF that would help me fix the flow issues that I experience on all SBM heads I've played with so far - flow separation and back up above 0.550 or 0.600 lift. But, it seems that TF suffers from the same issues. I'm sure a little clean up work around the guide and in the bowl would help. I suspect there is flow to be gained by working on the head bolt bulge and PRP. It would be interesting to know how 50 degree seats would change things. I'm sure this head can go 300-310 cfm with the 2.02 valve. I also think an Edelbrock/Speedmaster can get there. In the end, it seems the tight push rod pinch, low port, 18 degree valve angle and head bolt locations just create some insurmountable issues. You're not going 350 cfm without major changes.

What I have spent the most time thinking about is the anti-swirl port design. I've become more convinced that the twisted bowl is not about fuel shear and not about increasing cfm. I think it is about reducing swirl. Here's my understanding of swirl. In a production car or a low rpm street car swirl can increase low end torque and reduce emissions. In a performance car swirl starts being counterproductive. It takes energy to swirl the air/fuel mixture, and that energy could have otherwise been used to get more air into the chamber. So, high swirl reduces volumetric efficiency. High swirl can also centrifuge the heavy fuel to the cylinder walls, throwing it out of suspension. That creates fuel washing and rich/lean conditions which can cause poor combustion and even detonation. So it seems the reduction in swirl in the TF heads would be a good thing. But look at how the swirl reduction was acheived. It was by forcing the air to go where it does not want to go, and by making the air/fuel mixture turn more than natural. In my mind these things are not efficient for dry flow, but even more detrimental to wet flow. I'd really like to see A/B dyno and track testing TF against others. Maybe the design is great for power and performance. I really don't know.

PBR, I know you have extensive experience with the Eddy's and at least some with the TF (maybe a lot). What's your opinion of the performance potential of both?
I'm about to find out what an experienced and knowledgeable head porter can get out of my TF heads. Had I read this before shipping them, I might have changed my mind about doing it. Hopefully there are some gains to be made and he finds them.... lol
 
One of the things I like a lot about the TF head is the 2” installed height that the roller spring package has.
Ootb, that head will accommodate a .700” lift roller cam.

That’s a fairly expensive upgrade on an RPM or SM head.
 
One of the things I like a lot about the TF head is the 2” installed height that the roller spring package has.
Ootb, that head will accommodate a .700” lift roller cam.

That’s a fairly expensive upgrade on an RPM or SM head.
And that was the very reason why I went with these heads to begin with.
 
The TrickFlow heads have almost nothing to gain at the pinch with the odd shaped pushrod hole. I used my sonic checker and was getting a strange reading that I didn’t interpret right and went through. I didn’t care as I was going to weld them up and run a .350 offset rocker Harlan Sharp made for me. But of course it’s easier to weld before you get a hole but I got her done. Following TrickFlow for over 10 years of running my fingers through their ports even before they offered any Mopar heads I’m very disappointed finding advertised 300 cfm ports flowing a turbulent 285 or worse. I’ve gotten 343 cfm out of a stock location pushrod Edelbrock head with a 2.08 valve. If you read that link I posted what did he get out of a TrickFlow head with a 2.08 valve??? Something like 308 right. I’ll modify them and make a nice set of heads but in the end I doubt if I’ll ever run them. One of my stupider purchases. One of these Sundays I’ll grab one and throw it on my porting bench and do some quick testing.
I've been doing lots of pitot testing both in the port and in the chamber on the SM head. Bruce at PTS has made me a couple of custom tubes. He's been great to work with. Don't know if I'll get to 310 cfm with the 2.02 valve, but I'm determined to get to 300. It's a good challenge. The SSR holds its secrets well, but I think I'm gaining on it. 343 with a 2.08 is impressive. That also lets me know what is possible.
 
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I'm about to find out what an experienced and knowledgeable head porter can get out of my TF heads. Had I read this before shipping them, I might have changed my mind about doing it. Hopefully there are some gains to be made and he finds them.... lol
Please report when you get them back. I'd love to hear what he accomplished.
 
I’m not big on porting “ported” heads…….. but I’ll def be following along.:thumbsup:
I'd be thinking a little cleanup is all I'd want to do on a CNC ported head.
 
The TrickFlow heads have almost nothing to gain at the pinch with the odd shaped pushrod hole. I used my sonic checker and was getting a strange reading that I didn’t interpret right and went through. I didn’t care as I was going to weld them up and run a .350 offset rocker Harlan Sharp made for me. But of course it’s easier to weld before you get a hole but I got her done. Following TrickFlow for over 10 years of running my fingers through their ports even before they offered any Mopar heads I’m very disappointed finding advertised 300 cfm ports flowing a turbulent 285 or worse. I’ve gotten 343 cfm out of a stock location pushrod Edelbrock head with a 2.08 valve. If you read that link I posted what did he get out of a TrickFlow head with a 2.08 valve??? Something like 308 right. I’ll modify them and make a nice set of heads but in the end I doubt if I’ll ever run them. One of my stupider purchases. One of these Sundays I’ll grab one and throw it on my porting bench and do some quick testing.
I stopped getting excited about the TF heads about the same time you did. When the rumors started swirling of an OOTB 300 CFM head, knowing what it takes to get a set of Edelbrocks or there, it seemed too good to be true. The first few 408 builds i saw using them making "ok" ish HP, and then when real flow numbers started getting published by users, my optimism faded and I wasn't sure what they were really offering, that you couldn't get elsewhere....15 years ago?
 
I'd be thinking a little cleanup is all I'd want to do on a CNC ported head.

These heads will easily hit their 300 cfm advertised numbers but it’s a shame you have to spend 10 minutes on 8 ports to get there. I know what needs done but to tell Someone what needs done shouldn’t have to happen. Ill
Try to find my old numbers and see were I ended up but I’m thinking 308-309 with the stock valve.
 
A tiny bit of perspective, if I may.....
300 cfm from a small block mopar head is 60-80 cfm better than a stock 906 440 head.
And better than a few out-of-the-box aftermarket big block heads.
 
A tiny bit of perspective, if I may.....
300 cfm from a small block mopar head is 60-80 cfm better than a stock 906 440 head.
And better than a few out-of-the-box aftermarket big block heads.


But we want more. LOTS MORE
 
Us poor SBM suckers need something like this Mayhem head package from Straub … 330cfm as cast and potential to get into the high 300s with porting…

Straub Technologies
 
Please report when you get them back. I'd love to hear what he accomplished.
I know for us, when we build a 408 hyd. roller deal, pump gas, I have to make changes to the intake porting on the TF head if we want more than 540HP. Those changes allow 575+ at a real 10.6:1 compression! And the port doesn't really end up flowing much more air...you have to remember the QUALITY of airflow is what makes power...I don't give a **** if the port flows 280 or 310...but it has to make power.
 
I know for us, when we build a 408 hyd. roller deal, pump gas, I have to make changes to the intake porting on the TF head if we want more than 540HP. Those changes allow 575+ at a real 10.6:1 compression! And the port doesn't really end up flowing much more air...you have to remember the QUALITY of airflow is what makes power...I don't give a **** if the port flows 280 or 310...but it has to make power.
How much cam to hit those numbers ?
 
A dyno test of the heads with and without the swirl vane might be interesting.

The SBM’s I’ve tested that were over 550hp used RPM heads(TF’s didn’t exist yet), which don’t have the vane.
 
A dyno test of the heads with and without the swirl vane might be interesting.

The SBM’s I’ve tested that were over 550hp used RPM heads(TF’s didn’t exist yet), which don’t have the vane.
So far I've left the vane in, but if I ever do an E85 engine with them, I'll remove it.
 
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