1973 Plymouth Duster repair and rebuild

[JohnFM3]

So I purchased a 1973 Duster to keep myself busy as my 69 Barracuda build (here) has been halted. In a thread of mine titled "What are my options (harmonic balancer)" found here, the thread started to progress off topic justifying starting this new thread.

More to come as I try to sum up the information in the other threads and provide details on whats next.

As purchased delivered by tow truck. Had sat under a tree for the last 10 yrs.

Following the first wash with a pressure washer and wash mit.

Starting to polish and buff the body.

Meanwhile, I have done a crap load of work on the engine. More to come.

Thanks

 

[JohnFM3]

Ok, so lets start describing the mess I have gotten my self into...

Start with the good. This car is a Cali car, and the floor boards look like it. I have never had floor board with no rust holes. My trunk on this car is even the correct color and not rust red and brown. And thats where the good ends. In a fantastic body. And the price point I paid for it is well worth it.

So lets start with today's little adventure. You notice this Z Bar, keen eyes will see JB Weld on both ends which kind of defeats the purpose of the bar. Except with the prior owner of this car who thought it would function well for the B&M floor shifter cable to fasten to the hole towards the 904 trans and connect the cable to the shift arm... yeah. It was creative. Who ever installed this shifter went far enough to switch the steering column out for a manual version.

 

[abdywgn]

congrats on a solid floor car! everybody's dream. solid a Challenger to a friend. he calls up and says he pulled the carpeting up and thought he was gonna be sick. nothing but red rust dust. turned out, it was red dirt. floors were perfect. looking forward to this project's progression.

 

[JohnFM3]

Ok, so more on the background of the car. The prior owner bought it 10yrs ago and has fought getting it running since. It has a number matching slant six with a 904 auto transmission. He had thrown all kinds of money, including a new fuel tank. But left it under a tree for all this time beside a house. Worst yet uncovered, as you can kind of tell in the picture of it coming home on the tow truck.

It looks like he tried to replace the original single barrel with a new one. Then bought a Super Six 2 barrel manifold with the correct 2 barrel carb, only it appears most of what was purchased was cheap off amazon (coming from china). And the carburetor was no different. We can confirm the Alternator is confirmed to not be cheap.

So the first thing I did is follow the HEI conversion and gave the car a stand alone ignition system. Removing the factory wiring from the equation. In a following post, I have a question on this. I bought a 4 pin Pertronix HEI 3 control module with multi-spark and rev limiter, along with a late 90s GM suv/truck with v8 external controller/coil/bracket package and wired them together and straight to the distributor. Gave it 12v and ground, cranked the engine and it started right up with a bit of fuel down the carb. Cranked it a couple more times with a bit of fuel, and then it sustained itself.

This absolutely a great modification, and flexible for use with any magnetic trigger ignition system. Multi-spark with rev limiter factory set at 5500rpm.

 

[JohnFM3]

In prep'n for completing the install of the ignition system, currently I am connecting the 12v and ground straight to the bat to ensure clean power. I will be buying a power distribution block in the future. What I need is a wire which goes to 12v at run and start. I dont have access to a wiring diagram as of yet, but I have 2 wires from the orginal ignition system I think can work if there are no reasons to combined them.

There is a wire in each of these plugs which go hot at some time in the run and start of the ignition switch, the top one is hot when the ignition is on. The bottom plut has 1 wire which goes hot during start. The brown one.

My thought is to connect both those wires to the trigger on a 4 pin relay. Does anyone have any knowledge on these wires and explain to me if this is a bad idea?

In following work, I will be removing alot of un needed wires from the engine harness and building my own. This will start when I buy a single wire alt which will eliminate the need for all the wires going to the passenger side of the engine except for engine temp, and I probably will do something custom for that.

 

[mygasser]

if you use those 2 wires to switch 2 relays that should keep things safe.
neil.

 

[JohnFM3]

if you use those 2 wires to switch 2 relays that should keep things safe.
neil.

Thanks, but what your thought on using both wires to connect to the same trigger plug on 1 relay?

My main fear is not knowing what is before these 2 wires on the plugs which shouldnt have power. I am going to get my relay installed next.

 

[Chuter]

Looks a lot better than my '73 duster did back in the late 70s! The lower quarter panels were rusted to the point you could only put stuff in the middle of the trunk!

 

[JohnFM3]

So more info on the car.

As discussed in the harmonic balancer thread (link found in first post), after getting it started I jumped into dealing with timing. I found mass amounts of slack in the cam/crank timing setup which warranted a replacement. As such, I ended up going with JP Performance Double Roller timing chain set. The only reason, I wanted it. And there is a possibility it may come in useful in the future. I have it locked in at factory for the time being. There's a possibility this engine has been rebuilt and may have a RV cam. After getting it running, I will spend some time and investigate that with a degree wheel.

With the timing chain done, I got the car together and set initial timing and was thrown for a loop. With the harmonic balancer set to 8 degrees advanced, and the distributor locked in at #1, I expected to see the engine running at roughly 8 degrees. Or at close enough to dial it in.

What I found was the engine was at 60 degrees advanced.

After going over it with a fine tooth comb to make sure mechanically it was correct. Listening to the car which sounded great and good throttle response, I had to assume it was the timing light. Getting ready to buy a modern one to replace my old basic light with dial back, my neighbor loaned me his. And I got the same numbers. Now I believe the new distributor the car had may have been amazon cheap. So I bought a new distributor and installed the same way I have always done in the past, and got the same result.

In complete frustration and thinking its still a timing light issue as my neighbors was advertised as not multi-spark compatible, he came over and took a stab at it. We lifted the distributor, rotated the rotor back 1 tooth, dropped in and started. Dialed it in to 8 degrees and we are golden. Ran the engine up in high rpms and saw the mechanical advance work. Plugged the vacuum advance in, and saw it work again.

This morning, I tried starting it with no choke and 2 pumps of the throttle. And it started. I am really happy with the modified HEI ignition setup.
In all, happy.

 

[JohnFM3]

Crud... I neglected to explain why we moved the rotor back 1 tooth. There is the concept of leading edge vs trailing edge trigger ignition system. And its assumed that we went from a leading edge to a trailing edge ignition system. And as such, the delay in triggering it could have impacted the resulting running timing. But ran it back 1 tooth, and it started up and idled smooth.

 

[JohnFM3]

More to the history... Were almost able to move forward with current work being performed.

After getting it starting and believing the engine was somewhat solid, I opted to start digging into fuel management and taking a look at the carb that was on it. As with other items on this car, it was found that the carburetor seems to be a amazon special and not a authentic Mopar 2bbl holley. More importantly, the super six intake and exhaust manifold were only attached by the 1 stud. And there was no attempt to seal the 2 parts. The other 2 bolts were completely missing, and 2 little bolts were coming from underneath the exhaust holding a throttle bracket on.

Yeah, about the throttle. The cable was attached with zip ties. And it was not the correct setup for the Super Six.

Yanked off the amazon special carb, and was given a Holley 2300 350cfm 2 bbl from my neighbor. Promptly tore it down, soaked in the sonic tank, and rebuilt it with a new rebuild kit. The carb came with 63 jets, my neighbor believes it needs to be toned down. I am not so sure taking it down to 59 was the best idea. But it will go to a local dyno shop and be tuned correctly.

The fuel line is 1/4 in. With a break in the rubber line between the main fuel line and fuel pump, I will be replacing all the lines to 5/16 and installing a summit racing fuel pump and regulator with psi gauge. More on that when it happens.

Make note of the throttle and kickdown linkage. I bought the 2 Lokar kits and the cable bracket. A quick change to the bracket, sand blast, and paint. Looks like it was purpose built.

As you can see in this picture, the red cable is a shifter cable. I will go into that disaster in a future post.

Thanks

 

[JohnFM3]

Ok, so I am digging into the brake work. I have a story to tell about the shifter cable I just installed. I will get to that later. But for the meantime, where can I find the bolt that holds the brake power booster push rod to the brake pedal? Of course I found out the hard way that the manual brake bolt is different. I am about to chuck it up in my lathe and perform some light surface passes to turn it to size.

Also, some new things to share about the fun of removing the steering column. Right now too frustrated to get it out of my mind.

Thanks,
John

 

[JohnFM3]

If anyone has any pictures of the booster to pedal, I would like to see it. Copilot is saying it is a Pin.

 

[v8dve]

Looking forward to that Steering Column info John, as may need to remove mine, as I just cant see how to get the existing manual brake pedal swapped out for an auto brake pedal....

 

[JohnFM3]

Looking forward to that Steering Column info John, as may need to remove mine, as I just cant see how to get the existing manual brake pedal swapped out for an auto brake pedal....

It is far easier to work on the brake pedal with the column out. Luckily the steering comes out pretty easily so long as the joint on the steering box comes free.

 

[abdywgn]

I think I used the tie rod end pickle fork to "pop" it loose.
Is there enough material to ream out the brake pushrod? or change the end to a heim joint?

 

[JohnFM3]

I think I used the tie rod end pickle fork to "pop" it loose.
Is there enough material to ream out the brake pushrod? or change the end to a heim joint?

When it comes to brakes, seat belts, and seats I try to keep fasteners as close to factory. Your suggestion of a helm joint is one I haven’t thought of. And I really like it. I will back to you on this.

As far as material to cut, I would be more likely to do a spring pass on my lathe on the bolt.

I will be back with new details in a day or so.

 

[JohnFM3]

Ok, I am trying to get a handle on the input shaft of the power steering box. My search found that it may be a 3/4 36 spline. Now I am seeing the possibility of 11/16 36 spline. And anyone fill me in on the what a factory power steering car with 10in drums should be?

 

[JohnFM3]

Is it as simple as measuring the outside diameter of the input shaft of the steering box when identifying the correct joint size?

 

[JohnFM3]

Could it be a 5/8 x 36 spline? My measurement from the micrometer is between .633 & .634 which works out around 5/8.

 

[JohnFM3]

Ok, so here is the challenges I am met with dealing with attaching the power booster to the brake pedal.

side note: 1 solution is to cut down the shank of the factory bolt to match the power booster rod end. Probably less than 1/16 OD (so very light)

To go the heim joint route.

• The shank thread size of the booster is 3/8 by 24 pitch
• The bolt hole size in the pedal is .438 (roughly 7/16)
• In general, when buying a 3/8 shank heim you will get a 3/8 bore size (.375) which is much smaller than the minimal .438 needed to allow a 7/16 bolt to fit the pedal hole with out welding a smaller washer to the pedal.
• There is 1 heim joint which matches the 3/8 and 7/16 measurements required, but is 3/4 inch too short. That is the amount of threads exposed after a nut and sleeve is added to the power booster joint.

I could weld a heim joint bung to the rod of the push rod going to the booster to make up the 3/4 inch needed. While doing this, I could weld a 7/16 bung. This seems like a bad idea to me.

I am really thinking turning down the shank on the factory bolt (even a new one at $20) is probably the safest thing to do. There isnt enough room to cut the push rod end. And again, a small amount of lathe work is all that is required. Would spend more time chucking it up true than making the light passes.

V8DVE, if you have any insight on this please comment.

 

[abdywgn]

I can almost picture what is written but do see that the trimming a little material off is going to be alot less time consuming than trying to reinvent the wheel.

 

[JohnFM3]

Ok, I will admit that there is far more meat to remove from the rod end that I originally remembered. And there is far more than the original push rod. Drilling it out over touching the factory bolt is the better option.

 

[abdywgn]

when you drill, could you offset it toward the rod end?

 

[JohnFM3]

when you drill, could you offset it toward the rod end?

If i had a mill with a End Mill Bit, yeah I could. And I really may need to buy a mill. But being unemployed is no allowing for that. But I have a machine shop local enough where I could get this done.

I own a metal lathe and could cut the bolt on my own.