Who's been there and done that?
Whatcha build for your A body?
Details people!!!
Whatcha build for your A body?
Details people!!!
500 cube engine recipes
- Thread starter rumblefish360
- Start date
-
nitrojunkee
Well-Known Member
'75 440 block 4.360 bore
K1 4.150 Chevy rod pin crank
Scat 6.800" H-beam BBC rods
Diamond custom blower pistons 1.85" CH 33.1cc dish
Edelbrock RPM heads 2.19" intake valves/home port/bowl work
T&D rockers 1.52
Bullet solid roller custom blower cam .626 @ .600 259int & 270exh @.050 .114
M1 intake
CSU blowthrough 750 carb
D1SC Procharger 10lbs of boost
Pump gas
I know, not quite 500"....Still thought I'd share.
K1 4.150 Chevy rod pin crank
Scat 6.800" H-beam BBC rods
Diamond custom blower pistons 1.85" CH 33.1cc dish
Edelbrock RPM heads 2.19" intake valves/home port/bowl work
T&D rockers 1.52
Bullet solid roller custom blower cam .626 @ .600 259int & 270exh @.050 .114
M1 intake
CSU blowthrough 750 carb
D1SC Procharger 10lbs of boost
Pump gas
I know, not quite 500"....Still thought I'd share.
bOb shingler
Well-Known Member
1/2 fill 67 or newer block
bore=4.375"
stroke=4.250"
aluminum rods=7.231" hemi big end
wrist pins= light weight tapered
pistons=flat top with 1.31" ch
gear drive
440-1 heads=fully ported, cut .090" for 14-1 comp
cam=roller .700"+, 280+ dur @ .050"
intake=single plane or t-ram
carb=dominator 1050+ or two of them
oil pan=12qts dual pick-up
bore=4.375"
stroke=4.250"
aluminum rods=7.231" hemi big end
wrist pins= light weight tapered
pistons=flat top with 1.31" ch
gear drive
440-1 heads=fully ported, cut .090" for 14-1 comp
cam=roller .700"+, 280+ dur @ .050"
intake=single plane or t-ram
carb=dominator 1050+ or two of them
oil pan=12qts dual pick-up
400 low deck block, 4.375 bore, 4.25 stroke for 512 cubes. 2.200 chev rod journals on crank. 6.535 H beam rods using .990 pins. 1.32 compression height pistons with enough dish to keep compression where you need it. If you go E85, set it at 13/1 for use with a big cam.
There are two ways to go from here. Small port route for low rpm torque, or big port heads for max power. Indy SR small port heads flow very well, and can also be ported and opened up to max wedge to flow 355 cfm and still use standard offset valve gear. Going up to a 440-1 head allows for another 25 or so cfm and another 50 to 75 hp when max ported using the right cam, etc. The Indy heads have enough meat in them that they can be cut to 62cc if you need to. I have a 528 RB motor with 440-1 heads cut to 62 cc that is at 15.1/1 compression with a dome of only about .060 high.
Chosing a cam carb and intake system will be dictated by where you want the hp and torque, and budget.
For a moderate budget, all out hp build, this is what I would build-
SR heads cut to 62cc, max ported to max wedge port size. Set the heads up for Beehive springs, for the highest lift possible that those springs will handle.
Wiseco 1.32 compression height pistons, Manley 6.535 H beam rods, Ohiocrank crankshaft if they make the 4.25 stroke low deck crank.
Indy single plane intake for a small base holley
two inch Dominater adapter and a 1050 Dominater for the carb.
High ratio rockers, 1.7 preferred. 3/8 heavy wall pushrods.
Good quality lifters with the EDM hole in the center of the base for direct oiling.
Cam specs should be somewhere around 275 degrees duration at .050 on the intake, an additional six degrees on the exhaust. Lobe seperation will be dictated by the total duration to some degree, but most likely 108 or very close. Put it in at 106 to start, or grinders recomendation.
The 1.7 rockers are for getting almost roller cam performance out of a flat tappet.
The lobe design would be chosen for as much lift as the new design Beehive springs will allow. It is also important to make sure the rate of lift is for a .904 lifter to get the advantage this whole package is after.
If you want to upgrade to a roller cam, then set the spring installed height high with +.100 retainers and also +.050 locks if you need to. Shoot for 2.00 to allow over .800 lift. Better rocker arms are needed, along with thicker pushrods to handle the seat pressure that you will need. Again, use 1.7 rockers. Seat pressure can very some depending on which springs you use. If you go with a big triple like a comp 947 they install at 2.00 with 340 on the seat. Trust me, you need this much spring to run an aggressive roller cam. I picked up 40 hp switching from "enough spring" that had 225 on the seat to these monsters. There are better double race springs out there also that will fit the application. For an off the shelf cam I used an Isky RR735 for my 528 on the first dyno session. It made 847 hp with alky, and is not that big of a cam at 280/288/110 . To get the best out of this cam, a higher ratio rocker should be used on both sides. I had 1.55 Jesels on mine, but Isky said I could go to 1.65 ratio for .808 lift. They might even agree to 1.7, but you need to call them and check.
At this level of roller cam (aggressive,and or +.800 lift) it is pushing the limits of the cam core size, and you will notice that the cam flexes as you rotate the motor to set lash! I see .003 in spots. Keep that in mind when you select intake valves. If there is a hollow stem steel intake valve available, I would install them. If not, a Titanium valve will help make more power because it will reduce deflection in the valve train and won't bounce as badly when it lands on the seat.
For valve train maintenance with a radical roller, I use the eight point checking method. Set the motor on exactly (or within say five degrees) of the 90 degree interval. check the lash at room temp to maintain exact numbers. Use a standard number (.020 with aluminum heads?) for both sides. Keep records to see trends. If you see a change of .003 or more, it is most likely something is going away. Count on it. You can reset the lash and try another couple of passes, and if it moves again, guaranteed you have something hurting. Start by looking at the rocker, then the pushrod tip, and then the lifter roller. One of them will be bad.
For the oiling system you will need at least a 9.5 quart pan and an external pickup to properly feed this animal. For safetys sake, use good 20w50 RACE oil. Set the oil pressure from 65 to 75 psi max.
Headers can be 2 or 2 1/8 inch by 32 long with 3.5 inch to four inch collecters. It would be best to run the PIPEMAX program to pick out the header sizes.
Rpm range will be about 6800 to 7,000 shift points. This combo should make somewhere between 725 and 750 hp and still be relatively cheap(if that is possible!) to build.
I have run the Mopar 590 cam using L88 chev springs with 1.75 rockers on a stroker in the past, up to 6,000 rpm. The lift with that deal was a theoretical .688, or .662 after lash. The new Beehive springs are said to extend that range 1,000 rpm with the same or less seat pressure. When the cam is chosen, be sure the guy that you talk to to select the cam wants to run a fast, high lift exhaust lobe. That has proven to work much better than the low lift long duration lobes that were the rage in the past.
There are two ways to go from here. Small port route for low rpm torque, or big port heads for max power. Indy SR small port heads flow very well, and can also be ported and opened up to max wedge to flow 355 cfm and still use standard offset valve gear. Going up to a 440-1 head allows for another 25 or so cfm and another 50 to 75 hp when max ported using the right cam, etc. The Indy heads have enough meat in them that they can be cut to 62cc if you need to. I have a 528 RB motor with 440-1 heads cut to 62 cc that is at 15.1/1 compression with a dome of only about .060 high.
Chosing a cam carb and intake system will be dictated by where you want the hp and torque, and budget.
For a moderate budget, all out hp build, this is what I would build-
SR heads cut to 62cc, max ported to max wedge port size. Set the heads up for Beehive springs, for the highest lift possible that those springs will handle.
Wiseco 1.32 compression height pistons, Manley 6.535 H beam rods, Ohiocrank crankshaft if they make the 4.25 stroke low deck crank.
Indy single plane intake for a small base holley
two inch Dominater adapter and a 1050 Dominater for the carb.
High ratio rockers, 1.7 preferred. 3/8 heavy wall pushrods.
Good quality lifters with the EDM hole in the center of the base for direct oiling.
Cam specs should be somewhere around 275 degrees duration at .050 on the intake, an additional six degrees on the exhaust. Lobe seperation will be dictated by the total duration to some degree, but most likely 108 or very close. Put it in at 106 to start, or grinders recomendation.
The 1.7 rockers are for getting almost roller cam performance out of a flat tappet.
The lobe design would be chosen for as much lift as the new design Beehive springs will allow. It is also important to make sure the rate of lift is for a .904 lifter to get the advantage this whole package is after.
If you want to upgrade to a roller cam, then set the spring installed height high with +.100 retainers and also +.050 locks if you need to. Shoot for 2.00 to allow over .800 lift. Better rocker arms are needed, along with thicker pushrods to handle the seat pressure that you will need. Again, use 1.7 rockers. Seat pressure can very some depending on which springs you use. If you go with a big triple like a comp 947 they install at 2.00 with 340 on the seat. Trust me, you need this much spring to run an aggressive roller cam. I picked up 40 hp switching from "enough spring" that had 225 on the seat to these monsters. There are better double race springs out there also that will fit the application. For an off the shelf cam I used an Isky RR735 for my 528 on the first dyno session. It made 847 hp with alky, and is not that big of a cam at 280/288/110 . To get the best out of this cam, a higher ratio rocker should be used on both sides. I had 1.55 Jesels on mine, but Isky said I could go to 1.65 ratio for .808 lift. They might even agree to 1.7, but you need to call them and check.
At this level of roller cam (aggressive,and or +.800 lift) it is pushing the limits of the cam core size, and you will notice that the cam flexes as you rotate the motor to set lash! I see .003 in spots. Keep that in mind when you select intake valves. If there is a hollow stem steel intake valve available, I would install them. If not, a Titanium valve will help make more power because it will reduce deflection in the valve train and won't bounce as badly when it lands on the seat.
For valve train maintenance with a radical roller, I use the eight point checking method. Set the motor on exactly (or within say five degrees) of the 90 degree interval. check the lash at room temp to maintain exact numbers. Use a standard number (.020 with aluminum heads?) for both sides. Keep records to see trends. If you see a change of .003 or more, it is most likely something is going away. Count on it. You can reset the lash and try another couple of passes, and if it moves again, guaranteed you have something hurting. Start by looking at the rocker, then the pushrod tip, and then the lifter roller. One of them will be bad.
For the oiling system you will need at least a 9.5 quart pan and an external pickup to properly feed this animal. For safetys sake, use good 20w50 RACE oil. Set the oil pressure from 65 to 75 psi max.
Headers can be 2 or 2 1/8 inch by 32 long with 3.5 inch to four inch collecters. It would be best to run the PIPEMAX program to pick out the header sizes.
Rpm range will be about 6800 to 7,000 shift points. This combo should make somewhere between 725 and 750 hp and still be relatively cheap(if that is possible!) to build.
I have run the Mopar 590 cam using L88 chev springs with 1.75 rockers on a stroker in the past, up to 6,000 rpm. The lift with that deal was a theoretical .688, or .662 after lash. The new Beehive springs are said to extend that range 1,000 rpm with the same or less seat pressure. When the cam is chosen, be sure the guy that you talk to to select the cam wants to run a fast, high lift exhaust lobe. That has proven to work much better than the low lift long duration lobes that were the rage in the past.
That is a lot of fantastic information.
moparmarkk
Well-Known Member
good info,keep them comming
On crankshafts, the stock cranks Ma Mopar makes, and most companys sell, are not center counter weighted simply to save money. While this works well in most applications the displaced balance load winds up on the center three bearings. And take a guess where cap walk and broken blocks happen. I have a Mega block designed (supposedly) to handle a lot of power. It had cap walk even with studs and four bolt main caps. I bought a center weighted crank for the last build, and the problem is gone. That tells me that a center weighted crank would really help a stock block live a long life if it is filled and has good main caps. On top of that, the crank will live a lot better as well. That first crank was cracked at 100 passes making 880 hp. So if you can fit it into your budget, or run across one that fits your needs, it would really be worth considering.
440outlawdart
Well-Known Member
I love this info,but being a broke bracket racer wish I could do any of this
moper
Well-Known Member
505" RB wedge:
'69 440 block - oil passage/drainback mods, stock pickup size, main studs, stock caps, deck set at 10.700, bore 4.350
Melling std oil pump w/high pressure relief spring
MP windage tray
Stock Hemi pan
4.25 stroke Source crank
7.1" Source rod
17cc dished Source pistons
Speed Pro file-to-fit rings
internally balanced (not by Source)
RPM heads - Stage I cleanup, Serdi valve job, gasket matched intake ports, minor chamber shaping, 80cc chambers
10.8:1 static, 8.4:1 dynamic, .034" quench distance
Crane 1.5 rockers
Smith Bros push rods
Felpro Performance head gaskets
Engle custom solid flat tappet 260/268ish duration @ .050, .600ish lift.
Edelbrock six pack intake, new Holley carbs w/Promax plates
MSD distributor/hidden 6AL
Installed with TTi headers in E body makes around 490tq 475hp to the tires on pump 91. Assembled, run to break in cam, retorqued heads, installed inner valve springs, oil changed & ready to drop in and run $10,500.00 with his block.
'69 440 block - oil passage/drainback mods, stock pickup size, main studs, stock caps, deck set at 10.700, bore 4.350
Melling std oil pump w/high pressure relief spring
MP windage tray
Stock Hemi pan
4.25 stroke Source crank
7.1" Source rod
17cc dished Source pistons
Speed Pro file-to-fit rings
internally balanced (not by Source)
RPM heads - Stage I cleanup, Serdi valve job, gasket matched intake ports, minor chamber shaping, 80cc chambers
10.8:1 static, 8.4:1 dynamic, .034" quench distance
Crane 1.5 rockers
Smith Bros push rods
Felpro Performance head gaskets
Engle custom solid flat tappet 260/268ish duration @ .050, .600ish lift.
Edelbrock six pack intake, new Holley carbs w/Promax plates
MSD distributor/hidden 6AL
Installed with TTi headers in E body makes around 490tq 475hp to the tires on pump 91. Assembled, run to break in cam, retorqued heads, installed inner valve springs, oil changed & ready to drop in and run $10,500.00 with his block.
nitrojunkee
Well-Known Member
I notice the 8 degree split on that camshaft. How tight is that? 110? Also, what was the compression height on those pistons?
nitrojunkee
Well-Known Member
2x WOW!!! Would like to see some pictures of your mean machine.
I've contemplated putting up a build thread on it. But not sure if I will or not.
HOT dam,rumble I see you looking in to some big boy pants.haha lmao,,well if your serious I have a brand new one fresh off the dyno if you what to put it in and try!!!! only it doesn't come with charmin haha.complete carb to pan,fan to trans yoke.tighten the rockers down and its race ready,,you do remember how to get where don't you??..better come soon it was snowing here this morrning........Artie lol!!!!!!!
Thanks Artie, just swishing the water around with my big toe wondering what people are building/doing/running.
Current, I have a 400/727 in a '71 Duster. The current 2.94's will be swapped out for 4.88's once I do the tub's for tires. For the mean time, I'll just (heavily) cam the 400 and use the just received M1 single and a large TQ for the street. The B body headers will do for now I to the 2-1/2 exhaust pipe.
I may just stick with a high reving 400.
I still need to rewire it , fuel line, rims/tires and get a driveshaft for it. Then I'm good to go. Oh, and a drivers seat. The milk create is a little ruff on the bottom side.
And now that I think of it, since I like creating these kind of threads, here's the new one---> http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?p=1970220403#post1970220403
Current, I have a 400/727 in a '71 Duster. The current 2.94's will be swapped out for 4.88's once I do the tub's for tires. For the mean time, I'll just (heavily) cam the 400 and use the just received M1 single and a large TQ for the street. The B body headers will do for now I to the 2-1/2 exhaust pipe.
I may just stick with a high reving 400.
I still need to rewire it , fuel line, rims/tires and get a driveshaft for it. Then I'm good to go. Oh, and a drivers seat. The milk create is a little ruff on the bottom side.
And now that I think of it, since I like creating these kind of threads, here's the new one---> http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?p=1970220403#post1970220403
Mad Dart
Nothing to see Here!
Nice! What Compression?
13.5:1
440dartsport
Well-Known Member
77' 440 block
Bore - 4.375"
Stroke - K1 4.15" crank 2.2" journals
Rods - K1 6.76" ARP 2000 bolts
Pistons - Ross flat tops .990" pin
Pistons are .007" in the hole with .047" quench
11/1 compression
2275 gram bobweight
Hughes main girdle with stock caps
Milodon external oiling
Comp solid flat cam and EDM lifters
Intake .662" lift 267 duration at .050"
Exhaust .672" lift 271 duration at .050"
110 centerline degreed at 106
Harland sharp 1.6 rockers
Heads are Indy EZ-1 set up and ported by Modern Cylinder Head
84cc closed chamber
Titanium retainers
Indy single plane intake with 1000HP carb run on 93 pump gas.
749hp at 6,500
669tq at 5,300
Bore - 4.375"
Stroke - K1 4.15" crank 2.2" journals
Rods - K1 6.76" ARP 2000 bolts
Pistons - Ross flat tops .990" pin
Pistons are .007" in the hole with .047" quench
11/1 compression
2275 gram bobweight
Hughes main girdle with stock caps
Milodon external oiling
Comp solid flat cam and EDM lifters
Intake .662" lift 267 duration at .050"
Exhaust .672" lift 271 duration at .050"
110 centerline degreed at 106
Harland sharp 1.6 rockers
Heads are Indy EZ-1 set up and ported by Modern Cylinder Head
84cc closed chamber
Titanium retainers
Indy single plane intake with 1000HP carb run on 93 pump gas.
749hp at 6,500
669tq at 5,300
I have a cupel of good cams you can try if you wont them all for stock rockers and highdrallic and I also have a set of the old crane roker arms if you need them??call me if you still have my ########I cant find yours or Id call ya!let me know..........Artie
and check out that web sit that's selling the circle track stuff I just bott a 3 core griffin rad for $50.00 with a removable scren for the boys car!!!off there...and those nascar teams only run that kind of stuff for one race then sell it for pennies on the dollar that's were I get 90% of my stuff
nitrojunkee
Well-Known Member
That's a sweet combo! :thumleft:
Nice engineering going on! If I had the coin... Nice idea for a thread,Rumble!
Thanks man. It may be a while before I get into a 500. I'm not In A rush. I'll probably call Artie up next week and see what he has Laying around for the 400.
But I have no idea what a decent 500 street, street strip combo is. So, I figured this thread could help more than myself since I have not noticed one of its kind. Trying to remember who did what in what thread is just to much for me these days.
Now we have a 500 recipe thread! I hope it can become worthy of a sticky for all and a quick click to look up a target build for someone to copy or build in a similar way.
That was the whole idea of the stickies I made as MOD way back for what it takes to run a certain time. Hence the 12 sec thread and on down. There not all my idea but it only took one for a little inspiration.
But I have no idea what a decent 500 street, street strip combo is. So, I figured this thread could help more than myself since I have not noticed one of its kind. Trying to remember who did what in what thread is just to much for me these days.
Now we have a 500 recipe thread! I hope it can become worthy of a sticky for all and a quick click to look up a target build for someone to copy or build in a similar way.
That was the whole idea of the stickies I made as MOD way back for what it takes to run a certain time. Hence the 12 sec thread and on down. There not all my idea but it only took one for a little inspiration.
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