Any way to "de-power" a power steering box?

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MRGTX

MRGTX

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Back in the day, I occasionally drove the Dart around with the belt off of the power steering pump. The wide front tires made parking lot handling tiresome...and there was quite a bit of slop in the steering but it was drivable.

Is there a right way to de-power a power steering box without having to install a manual box/steering column?

If so, is there anything that can be done to get rid of some of the play in the system?

I'm guessing that I know the answer...but if it was possible, I'm sure you guys would know. Thanks for any feedback!!

-Mike
 
You can "crank" the pressure down, effectively eliminating the overpowered nature of the stock power steering setup.

Just follow the steps in this article.

[ame]http://www.moparaction.com/tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf[/ame]
 
you can adjust power steering pump. both federal and saginaw.
I have federal pump so i had to dismantle it to lower pressure.
Helped some, not so soft now, better road feel.
slop from PS can be adjusted by adjusting screw top of power steering unit, adjusted mine and it has no slop at all now. ofcoure if your PS unit too worn out you have to rebuild it of get new one

[ame]http://www.moparaction.com/tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf[/ame]
PS pump adjust.

didnt find guide to adjust slop but if you have factory manual there is good guide.

74Dusted beat me to it :)
 
I might add that I recall reading that ideally you should adjust the play out of the input shaft first before adjusting the output (sector) shaft. It is a little harder since tricky to unload the big steel lock nut and screw in the aluminum cap.

When adjusting the sector shaft, jack up the frame so the wheels hang and keep testing the steering going thru "straight ahead" since that is where the shaft should be tightest, and don't over-tighten it.
 
When I redid my Duster I sent the power steering box to firm feel to get rebuilt. I went with the Stage 2 Kit. This tightened up the steering considerably. So when I turn the wheel it is fairly tight. So that took care of most of the problem with the over boosting of the power steering.

In my car the suspension, steering column and the steering coupler were all rebuilt. There is no play in the box but there is some in the Steering coupler. I've considering installing a Universal Joint like the one made my Flaming River. http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0005/s0006/FR1506P

So basically I think there are several areas in you suspension that could result in "Play". You kind of have to deduce it one system at a time. Good Luck!
 
Exellent info, guys... thanks.

What I had in mind was eliminating the pump all together... is that something that can be done safely? Less weight, less drag on the motor, quicker ratio than the standard manual box (I believe)...

If that's not recommended, I will likely go the reduced pressure route as suggested.
 
MRGTX said:
Exellent info, guys... thanks.

What I had in mind was eliminating the pump all together... is that something that can be done safely? Less weight, less drag on the motor, quicker ratio than the standard manual box (I believe)...

If that's not recommended, I will likely go the reduced pressure route as suggested.
Click to expand...

Eliminating the pump will give you the hardest turning manual steering setup ever invented. Ask anyone who's ever had a Power Steering Pump fail.


I had one fail on my Dakota, I swear my arm muscle mass increased more in couple weeks of driving the truck (barely as needed, drove other vehicles most of the time) than it did in 6 months of working out. It turned harder than my 1948 Dodge, 1984 D50 (With 40" Tires) and 65 Cuda combined together...at a complete stop.

By the time I replaced the pump on that truck, I probably looked like The Hulk to everyone else. :tongue5: On that note, it does have benefits, its a hardcore workout program :D
 
Adjust the play out of the gearbox and shim the regulator in the pump as per the article that Dusted provided a link for. 60's and 70's Mopars always had way too much power assist. tmm
 
I know a guy in Cleveland who has been driving his 68 Barracuda with the belt off for 10 years. He claims the steering is fine. It is about the same ratio as the "fast ratio" manual box (I think it's 14.7:1 compared to 16:1). Just don't put one of those dinky aftermarket steering wheels on it.
 
I find that tough to believe. One reason "the belt off" makes them so hard to steer is the gearbox sort of has to push the fluid around. If you drained the fluid, it would be easier. But there is GOING to be more play in the steering, because now you are moving the control valve.

Now, I admit, this was a GM box, but I well remember "one weekend" ruining the belt in my old Landcruiser. That thing was a ***** to steer, and I was young and in shape, back then.
 
Just drive it with power, and set your caster right, I promise you you'll dig it. Especially if you 'Pump it down'. Google it.
 
PoisonDart74 said:
Just drive it with power, and set your caster right, I promise you you'll dig it. Especially if you 'Pump it down'. Google it.
Click to expand...

That's my plan "coming up" this spring. I am barely getting by with man'well in the shape I'm in. Parking lots are a PITA. 25MPH and faster, OK
 
67Dart273 said:
I find that tough to believe. One reason "the belt off" makes them so hard to steer is the gearbox sort of has to push the fluid around. If you drained the fluid, it would be easier. But there is GOING to be more play in the steering, because now you are moving the control valve.

Steering box in 71 swinger kept blowing up PSpumps and hoses. Have been driving it for several thousand miles without PS pump or fluid in gearbox. Not that hard to steer. Lots of play (box was shot to begin with I believe). Hard to stay in one lane (only on bad roads) only when I let off the gas LOL. Probably not safe? Been trying to find a manual gearbox and shaft forever. Car has v8 K member out of ?. with disk brakes LBP. Don't even know what I really need (for manual setup). I'm too cheap to buy flaming river or Firm feel box. Keep driving it cause it smokes the tires and runs consistent 15.00 at the track LOL. 2nd place street legal drags 2013 season. 2.5 hours each way to the track.
Can you drive it this way. Yes. Is it grinding or making noise? No. Is it safe? Will it fail? haven't found out the hard way yet!!!!
Click to expand...
 
You can put a manual box in yours using the power shaft. I actually modified and welded two power couplers to make up the difference, and you can buy u joints / adapters to use your old shaft.

One thing to watch out for is the big/ small pinion shaft, which is going to screw things up with the center link / pitman arm
 
If you want manual steering, convert your car properly to it.
Don't fool around with taking the belt off etc. on power steering because it's brutally unsafe.
If you get into an accident with the car and they discover the car is modified to defeat the power steering, you'll be going to jail or fined. (Or both!)
You might as well defeat the front brakes as well while you are at it, the car will still stop using the rear brakes, so why not remove the front brakes? Think of the weight you'll save!
DON'T DO IT!
 
I ran my car with power steering not hooked up for almost a year before I converted to manual it was not really bad.
 
When we were kids we would put a bypass hose on the steering box. Just a loop of hose from input to output fittings on the pump. That way the fluid could still circulate and not hydro lock the box.

Not proper but it worked fine when we didn't have $$ for new pump!!!
 
im going to be upgrading to power steering soon with new box and pump i have read about the pump it down before .should i do the mods before i even put the stuff in the car or see how it is first
 
dvav,
I would do it before installing, or it would never get done. If retired, you might have time for a with & without comparison. I liked the low-effort steering in my 1969 Dart, being able to turn the steering wheel with 1 finger. That was the marketing angle when power steering came out in the 1950's. Steer w/ the left arm and snuggle the babe in the right. I might still be single if not for easy power steering. The article can be found on-line, Mopar Action by Rick Ehrenberg. It applies to the Saginaw pump, but the concept might work w/ a Federal or TRW pump.
 
BillGrissom said:
dvav,
That was the marketing angle when power steering came out in the 1950's. Steer w/ the left arm and snuggle the babe in the right. I might still be single if not for easy power steering.
Click to expand...

LOL... Those were the days. I found that cranking +2º of caster and -1º of camber into the front end made a world of difference in my 73. Steering effort is higher but not enough to make parking a chore.
 
"De-powering" the steering is pretty popular with Mazda miatas. We did it in my friends car and it wasn't very noticeable. But it's small, light, and rack and pinion. Probably an Apple's to oranges comparison. I tried it on my 97 BMW and love it. Been daily driving for 2+ years with a de-powered rack. You have to actually pull it all apart and remove seals inside so you aren't trying to pump air or fluid when you turn. I would give it a shot and see how it feels when properly de-powered. If it sucks then buy a manual box.
 
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