approximate effect of torsion bar adjustment

[TT5.9mag]

So I guess you'd just skip those steps?
Just because you don't know doesn't mean someone else doesn't.
If you had nothing to contribute why did you respond at all?

Obviously I can randomly twist the adjuster until I get it where I want it, but I don't go into any job with at least a few questions answered.

The engineers who designed the torsion bar suspension knew exactly the effect of one turn of the adjuster.

Anyone who has adjusted then readjusted theirs knows how much one turn of the adjuster changes the height at the axle.
They make an adjustment, let the car settle, measure the change in ride height, do a little math, then make another adjustment based on the results of the math.

Do you have some aversion to learning things?

You have no idea what I know. Apparently if it’s not on you tube you don’t know how to figure anything out for yourself. Everyone here spent a whole page of replies saying exactly that same thing I told you in the 2nd post. Good luck with your junk. I hope you figure out how to turn a bolt with a wrench, it’s a tough one to figure out.

 

[Dana67Dart]

Personally I want it to be a good road car, and the front end sits too high for my liking; I think the car would look better (and would definitely have a lower CoG and thus less body roll) with the front dropped an inch and a half or so.

ASSUMING the PO raised the front, lowering it an inch and a half might get it closer to spec. IMHO @scudzuki should set the car to spec then go from there.

I think we can all agree there is no chart for how many turns equals how much ride height change and there are too may factors to consider.

Also I think we have beaten @scudzuki up enough for asking a question, no harm in asking questions.

Lastly there are procedures in the FSM (free at mymopar.com) to set the ride height

 

[scudzuki]

You have no idea what I know. Apparently if it’s not on you tube you don’t know how to figure anything out for yourself. Everyone here spent a whole page of replies saying exactly that same thing I told you in the 2nd post. Good luck with your junk. I hope you figure out how to turn a bolt with a wrench, it’s a tough one to figure out.

You are such an insecure child, it's obvious.
I rebuilt my first ICE when I was 14 and my first V8 when I was 20 (39 years ago), using only a book.
I am a better mechanic than you as well, AND I can admit when I don't know OR I'm wrong.
Grow up you pathetic little boy.

 

[TT5.9mag]

You are such an insecure child, it's obvious.
I rebuilt my first ICE when I was 14 and my first V8 when I was 20 (39 years ago), using only a book.
I am a better mechanic than you as well, AND I can admit when I don't know OR I'm wrong.
Grow up you pathetic little boy.

So funny. I will not stoop to your level. No matter how hard you try.

 

[scudzuki]

It really does depend on the spring rate vs how many turns it will need.

Engineers? Ya they know it all, just ask them.

They may not know where to put an oil filter for easy access, but they definitely understand spring rate and mechanical advantage.
Why don't you design a car since you know so much?
You guys really like to pile on, huh?

 

[scudzuki]

So funny. I will not stoop to your level. No matter how hard you try.

You're shitting me.
Emojis IS stooping to a level.
You're pathetic, and I'll beat you in a debate on ANY topic.
Pick a topic you moron.

 

[TT5.9mag]

You're shitting me.
Emojis IS stooping to a level.
You're pathetic, and I'll beat you in a debate on ANY topic.
Pick a topic you moron.

Ok I pick torsion bar adjustment. Ready set go.

 

[scudzuki]

ASSUMING the PO raised the front, lowering it an inch and a half might get it closer to spec. IMHO @scudzuki should set the car to spec then go from there.

I think we can all agree there is no chart for how many turns equals how much ride height change and there are too may factors to consider.

Also I think we have beaten @scudzuki up enough for asking a question, no harm in asking questions.

Lastly there are procedures in the FSM (free at mymopar.com) to set the ride height

There's ONE factor to consider for an approximate (what I inquired about) factor, spring rate, unless 72 Darts came off the assembly line with varying adjuster bolt location and pitch. It's math fellas, math does not lie, is not political, but apparently upsets a lot of people.

 

[TT5.9mag]

but apparently upsets a lot of people.

Only you. Because you didn’t get the answer you wanted.

 

[scudzuki]

Ok I pick torsion bar adjustment. Ready set go.

I already beat you at that.
You replied "I don't know".
You're making my point for me.

Goddamn you are one STOOOOOPID MFer.

Did you even graduate from high school?

 

[ProjectBazza]

Well this one sure went to hell quickly.

Ignore button clicked.

 

[TT5.9mag]

I already beat you at that.
You replied "I don't know".
You're making my point for me.

Goddamn you are one STOOOOOPID MFer.

Did you even graduate from high school?

 

[abodyjoe]

There's ONE factor to consider for an approximate (what I inquired about) factor, spring rate, unless 72 Darts came off the assembly line with varying adjuster bolt location and pitch. It's math fellas, math does not lie, is not political, but apparently upsets a lot of people.

dude. you are seriously over thinking things here.. turn both bars an equal amount and tweak as needed until you get the ride height you want. it is really that simple.. no math needed.. like stated earlier.. what torsion bars effect what each turn does and there were also coarse and fine thread adjusters along the way which will effect how much a turn raises or lowers the car..

 

[TT5.9mag]

Did you even graduate from high school?

Yup, I looked up how to get a diploma on the internets and gots me one.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Have you ever looked at this chart?

View attachment 1716433803

Lowering the car 2 1/4" and you lose a whopping .018" of toe !

View attachment 1716433804

That chart was probably printed with bias ply tires in mind. With radials, those amounts of toe change are likely even less.

 

[TT5.9mag]

dude. you are seriously over thinking things here.. turn both bars an equal amount and tweak as needed until you get the ride height you want. it is really that simple.. no math needed.. like stated earlier.. what torsion bars effect what each turn does and there were also coarse and fine thread adjusters along the way which will effect how much a turn raises or lowers the car..

No need to keep saying it. He’s off the rails for some damn reason.

 

[TT5.9mag]

Hey @toolmanmike you should probably lock this one up before someone starts to cry.

 

[33IMP]

ASSUMING the PO raised the front, lowering it an inch and a half might get it closer

I think we can all agree there is no chart for how many turns equals how much ride height change and there are too may factors to consider.

This.
Op is looking for an answer to a question that doesn't exist.
There are WAY too many variables for ANY chart to be a definitive answer. Probably why there isn't one.
Will five turns on my 3200 lb car with six cylinder bars result the same as five turns on my 3900 lbs car with 1.08 bars? Nope.
Either set it to the FSM spec, or experiment. As many have said, it's the only way to get it where you want it.
No matter how much the OP hates it, post #2 is the correct answer.

 

[Dave999]

the fatigue and "set" of the torsion bars over the years means they will be clocked slightly different on all cars, even if they all started in more or less the same place.
the spring rate of the bar makes little odds here as we are not flexing the bar
we are just altering the angle very slightly of the lower arm in relation to the bar
there is a spring constant involved. spring twisted same amount you are just adjusting the position of the thing on the spring

I would expect the amount of adjustment you get to be dependent on how close to one extreme or the other, the lever on the side of the torsion bar socket is at, as it bears on the adjuster to maintain your ride height.

the variance will be very small because the lever is short we are talking slightly different position on the end of the adjuster bolt. the movement of it to make a change is small due to the lower arm being quite long

manufacturing, materials and torsion bar hex end clocking tolerances, will be why they just specify from bottom of lower ball joint housing to ground or whatever it is... no two cars exactly the same no two adjusters exactly the same no two torsion bars exactly the same weight distribution in a car with aircon or power steering different

all that stuff

2 turns one side 3 and half the other to raise it equally by 1/2 an inch etc etc

Dave

 

[junkyardhero]

You are such an insecure child, it's obvious.
I rebuilt my first ICE when I was 14 and my first V8 when I was 20 (39 years ago), using only a book.
I am a better mechanic than you as well, AND I can admit when I don't know OR I'm wrong.
Grow up you pathetic little boy.

BFD. i was born dick first with wrench in hand and a snap on double stack attached to my umbilical cord.

i'll wrap a ratchet around your head quicker than you could start a lawnmower.

60 years old and you're trying to state bona fides on a damn internet forum with people you don't have the slightest idea about. how's it feel to be that old and still a corncob MF'er?

 

[RustyRatRod]

BFD. i was born dick first with wrench in hand and a snap on double stack attached to my umbilical cord.

i'll wrap a ratchet around your head quicker than you could start a lawnmower.

60 years old and you're trying to state bona fides on a damn internet forum with people you don't have the slightest idea about. how's it feel to be that old and still a corncob MF'er?

That was a goodun! LOL

 

[72bluNblu]

Wow. Just wow.

All this nonsense, and not a single correct answer.

The torsion bar adjusting bolt sets the angle between the LCA and the torsion bar adjusting lever. The length and thread pitch of the adjusting bolt control how much you can move the lever. So, if someone wanted to do the math, you just calculate how much one turn on the adjuster changes the angle of the adjusting lever, and then do the geometry to figure out how much the end of the LCA moves for that change in angle. Easy right? Well...

The change in the angle of the adjusting lever to the LCA will be pretty much constant based on the thread pitch of the bolt (there are course and fine thread adjusting bolts as I recall). The lever rotates around the pivot, but, the adjusting block also rotates in the half moon cut out in the LCA. So the thread pitch to the angle of the lever change should be fairly consistent.

But the actual ride height change will depend on the angle of the LCA to start with. The LCA moves in a circle but the ride height only cares about vertical change, so, the amount the ride height changes per turn of the adjuster will be greatest near where the LCA is parallel to the ground, and the amount the ride height changes per turn will decrease as you get closer to the ends of the LCA's travel. The LCA is at a more severe angle and the angle changes more than the vertical height of the ball joint does.

So yes, it's just math, and someone could totally calculate this.

But when it was all said and done, you wouldn't have a result like "1 turn = x ride height change". You'd have a table based on the angle of the LCA, and it would only tell you how much the ride height would change, not what the actual overall ride height is. Because like the factory ride height adjustment in the FSM, the table would be independent of tire height, torsion bar diameter/hex offset, etc and would depend only on the angle of the LCA.

Which is why you won't find a "number of turns changes the ride height this much" that anyone's calculated. Because it would still depend on what the starting LCA angle is of the car in question, and those are gonna be all over the map because the torsion bar hex offset is going to control the angle of the LCA for a given ride height measurement if you measure from the ground to a point on the body/chassis.

 

[toolmanmike]

Wow. Just wow.

All this nonsense, and not a single correct answer.

The torsion bar adjusting bolt sets the angle between the LCA and the torsion bar adjusting lever. The length and thread pitch of the adjusting bolt control how much you can move the lever. So, if someone wanted to do the math, you just calculate how much one turn on the adjuster changes the angle of the adjusting lever, and then do the geometry to figure out how much the end of the LCA moves for that change in angle. Easy right? Well...

The change in the angle of the adjusting lever to the LCA will be pretty much constant based on the thread pitch of the bolt (there are course and fine thread adjusting bolts as I recall). The lever rotates around the pivot, but, the adjusting block also rotates in the half moon cut out in the LCA. So the thread pitch to the angle of the lever change should be fairly consistent.

But the actual ride height change will depend on the angle of the LCA to start with. The LCA moves in a circle but the ride height only cares about vertical change, so, the amount the ride height changes per turn of the adjuster will be greatest near where the LCA is parallel to the ground, and the amount the ride height changes per turn will decrease as you get closer to the ends of the LCA's travel. The LCA is at a more severe angle and the angle changes more than the vertical height of the ball joint does.

So yes, it's just math, and someone could totally calculate this.

But when it was all said and done, you wouldn't have a result like "1 turn = x ride height change". You'd have a table based on the angle of the LCA, and it would only tell you how much the ride height would change, not what the actual overall ride height is. Because like the factory ride height adjustment in the FSM, the table would be independent of tire height, torsion bar diameter/hex offset, etc and would depend only on the angle of the LCA.

Which is why you won't find a "number of turns changes the ride height this much" that anyone's calculated. Because it would still depend on what the starting LCA angle is of the car in question, and those are gonna be all over the map because the torsion bar hex offset is going to control the angle of the LCA for a given ride height measurement if you measure from the ground to a point on the body/chassis.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Ya, what he said.

 

[TT5.9mag]

Wow. Just wow.

All this nonsense, and not a single correct answer.

The torsion bar adjusting bolt sets the angle between the LCA and the torsion bar adjusting lever. The length and thread pitch of the adjusting bolt control how much you can move the lever. So, if someone wanted to do the math, you just calculate how much one turn on the adjuster changes the angle of the adjusting lever, and then do the geometry to figure out how much the end of the LCA moves for that change in angle. Easy right? Well...

The change in the angle of the adjusting lever to the LCA will be pretty much constant based on the thread pitch of the bolt (there are course and fine thread adjusting bolts as I recall). The lever rotates around the pivot, but, the adjusting block also rotates in the half moon cut out in the LCA. So the thread pitch to the angle of the lever change should be fairly consistent.

But the actual ride height change will depend on the angle of the LCA to start with. The LCA moves in a circle but the ride height only cares about vertical change, so, the amount the ride height changes per turn of the adjuster will be greatest near where the LCA is parallel to the ground, and the amount the ride height changes per turn will decrease as you get closer to the ends of the LCA's travel. The LCA is at a more severe angle and the angle changes more than the vertical height of the ball joint does.

So yes, it's just math, and someone could totally calculate this.

But when it was all said and done, you wouldn't have a result like "1 turn = x ride height change". You'd have a table based on the angle of the LCA, and it would only tell you how much the ride height would change, not what the actual overall ride height is. Because like the factory ride height adjustment in the FSM, the table would be independent of tire height, torsion bar diameter/hex offset, etc and would depend only on the angle of the LCA.

Which is why you won't find a "number of turns changes the ride height this much" that anyone's calculated. Because it would still depend on what the starting LCA angle is of the car in question, and those are gonna be all over the map because the torsion bar hex offset is going to control the angle of the LCA for a given ride height measurement if you measure from the ground to a point on the body/chassis.

The right answer came in post 2 and it’s what we’ve all done for years and years. Turn the bolt. If it’s not low enough turn it more. If it’s too low turn it back. I’m not sure why this guy went so Gary Busey on the easiest solution.

 

[TT5.9mag]

BFD. i was born dick first with wrench in hand and a snap on double stack attached to my umbilical cord.

i'll wrap a ratchet around your head quicker than you could start a lawnmower.

60 years old and you're trying to state bona fides on a damn internet forum with people you don't have the slightest idea about. how's it feel to be that old and still a corncob MF'er?