Please share with us the quote of whoever made that claimThat’s pretty cool how they welded that aluminum lower radiator support to the steel frame rails and sheet metal. You can actually see the welds in the pictures of the Cuda build.
LOL!
Well there are exactly 2 K-members for these cars that have had FEA, and they would be the factory K and the XV. Your claim is unsupported, and I suspect incorrect. Vomit all you like, but if you don't like that aluminum K it's only your own ignorance fueling your opinion, not anything based in engineering principles. On another high horses are we? Hell the swing arm on my '07 Triumph Speed Triple is welded cast aluminum, it's almost like it isn't a problem. Does the qualifier "to be heavily reverse loaded at high cyclic rates." mean anything to you? Please educate me, exactly how many welded cast alum pieces made up the XV IFS system? The reason you don't see more welded aluminum is only because it requires a higher level of design, engineering, and skill of construction than the aftermarket companies that make suspension for these cars want to put into their products. Really? Which is why the XV stuff was so expensive, which is part of why they went out business (that and poor customer service, but, that's not a design problem Did I ever claim otherwise?).
As for your overly dramatic "nailing to the cross", well, yeah, you're wrong Don't make me cry . XV was alive and kicking in 2010, and still sending out publications. Check the copyright date on their XV magazine attached below.
You're the one that made up the facts to support your opinion Your horse is getting higher, I just happen to have the evidence Really, all I have read here are unsupported empty claims.
Aluminum!? How dare you!
Hey if you've got the engineering analysis to back up not having a gusset, have at it I have no idea what your reference to a "gusset" refers to here.
LOL!
See below.
And then in post #233 you snidely I was trying to be gentle responded to Blu’s comment that it was steel tubing with “if you say so”, as if it wasn’t steel. It was not a point worth debating, I was trying to move on.
Technically, you didn’t say it was welded to the frame, Technically you are correct but seeing as how easy it was to see in the article I must have assumed you did your homework I clearly stated "if I remember correctly" from an event that took place 14+ years ago online and what you seem to be focused on is one article, there is development history with XV products that predated the later article you hold so dear and logic would support that maybe a quickly fabricated beefier Alum rad crossmember to fortify a discovered insufficient OEM steel crossmember was fabricated to test its improvements is a normal design path, I believe a pic of that protype in alum is what I remember seeing, that obviously never made it into production in alum and was later built out of steel shown in your beloved article.. I suspect this possible timeline does not fit your bent on building a case to inaccurately belittle me, and that is fine, the source of the disrespect has already gained a well-earned reputation from my viewpoint and actually read it before responding rather than just assuming I assumed nothing you knew what you were talking about and you have not proved me wrong, yet. If you had, maybe we could have avoid some of the back and forth since it is painfully obviously it isn’t aluminum and isn’t bolted to anything because it was welded on. Give it a rest, I never said, nor implied alum was welded to steel, ever
‘Nough said. You don’t like XV. I never said that, technically This thread isn’t even about their stuff nor are they even around anymore. And I didn’t bring it up so we could rehash a dead product line. Let’s move on. Now you want to move on?Your reply here does not indicate that.
yes....it is a file photo. No pics of the two inch yet. I'm not sure I want to post any of the 2"....someone will want a gusset on it.
QA1 do homework? No, thy just buy the other kid's (who stole it from another kid) class project and market it. Especially when it comes to Mopar I don't think they really know what their doing. The only thing they have that is organic to them, concerning Mopar, is that leaf spring thing and I don't see that on their site anymore. I'm no fan of theirs or Gerst anything.
So that tubular LCA solution they offer is what then, just more light weight something shiny throw it at the wall marketing hype for the gullible? Note, I am using a tad of reverse? sarcasm here.
Are you certain?
Actually no. FEA was around in the '40's. The math behind it was around even before then. It wasn't widely used until computers could be used to carry out the modeling, because it's a long and tedious process to carry out all the calculations, especially as the mesh gets smaller. Check out the "history" section here...
Finite element method - Wikipedia Dude you are only stating the obvious and expanding on what I already shared
And you know what? Maybe the factory didn't specifically use FEA in the narrow sense you want to define it. Fine- maybe I was too broad with my statement, that was my mistake. We agree But the factory did absolutely engineer the K frame, calculating loads etc. I never said they didn't They didn't just carry out physical testing. Regardless, besides XV, no one has carried out that level of engineering. And that was my point. Which remains again, an unsupported claim
I don't care what the program cost, You cared enough to quote it I was just quoting what XV said. Why, I and others can read it ourselves Hence the quotations in my post. If you'd like to offer proof of XV's unverified claims, I admit, its hard to prove something that is not there LOL feel free. I doubt they'll be more egregious than any other aftermarket suspension manufacturers claims. Whatever
My mistake, I said "billet" when I meant extruded. I fixed my post to reflect the extruding tubing construction. Not sure it really matters, because you just said "welded aluminum", which was pictured, which is not everything which covers pretty much everything.
I have the feeling you've never welded cast aluminum, based on that comment. Your feelings would be incorrect I have, and welding extruded tubing is definitely easier. We were not discussing the ease of welding, we were discussing the ease at which a suitable welded connection can be made depending on the final welded properties of the materials to be joined And since you'll go bezerk,of course the metallurgy of the specific alloy also has an effect there. But with the widely used alloys that I've encountered, that's held true.
But you're trying to move the goalposts here. You didn't say anything about "current technology" or materials engineering, or any of that. You said- We were discussing a product designed and produced over 17 years with all its shortcomings, today different rules may apply for a number of reasons, and using the goalposts analogy, they have actually been moved literally, things change, thanks for noting that
And that, as I said before, and have shown since, is absolute horse puckey. How immaure Your claim was very generic, intentionally and any suspension components made in decent numbers which then excludes XV that are made from welded aluminum disproves it. Regarding the Bimmer front IFS alum cradle prior posted, I'd be curious what BMW sells that for, likely that one piece costs more than the entire IFS upgrade they were offering, comparing apples to oranges.
You don't like XV's welded aluminum K, We agree even though you have absolutely no evidence to show it's less up to the task than any of the other aftermarket K's. I'd say prove your claim, but none of the other aftermarket K's have published the engineering, if they've even done it. So it's just your unfounded opinion. I have made my case, we agree
When did "if I remember correctly" become a catch all to bury us in bullshit? When you will not admit it is a legit qualifier to in advance warn others not to assign undue importance to the dates being shared or other precise details, what you call "bullsjhit", if I remember correctly You go nuts
Well, newsflash, you don't remember correctly. Sorry, I'm human, and I know it. Question then becomes, do you have anything to remember real time from this saga 17+? years ago, and is your memory more accurate than mine?
The only lower radiator support that XV ever sold was steel tubing that welded to the bottom of the frame rails in place of the factory lower support. I believe I have not disputed that revelation Even if there was an aluminum prototype (to be attached how?) bolted?, that's not what any of us were talking about. Why then the constant obsession here? Get over it.
prototype, It's not what's in the article. Or the magazine. Or anything relevant to this thread. That is your opinion.
It appears mostly cosmetic, it's better than nothing, there is market demand, and it is a tough nut to crack for anyone.
