Help with Temp, Gas, Oil Alt gauges FREE VIDEO INCLUDED!

[66DartSedan]

So, making some progress here: video here:

My temp, gas or Alt gauges are not working.

I installed a Electronic Solid state Regulator from furygt on Ebay here: Mopar Voltage Regulator - Electronic Solid State with Correct Restoration Look | eBay


NOW I'm getting "movement" from the gas gauge but as you see in the video it, pings all the way up and then goes back down, even though I have a FULL tank of gas.

However Im getting no movement from the Temp gauge. I had a little time yesterday and I used a circuit tester https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003UHNMMS/?tag=joeychgo-20

But I saw NO light in the test on the circuit when testing the temp gauge.

My next move was to replace my voltage limiter in the dash with this: Image:Ivr4limiter.JPG - rte

After that, what should be my next test?

 

[67Dart273]

The amp / alt gauge has nothing to do with the rest. If the headlights work, and if turning them on with everything else off does not show a bit of movement to the left, then someone has bypassed the gauge, or it is "stuck." It is fed by the large black and large red wires.........BE CAREFUL!!! Full battery current UNFUSED is present on those leads.

I've posted hundreds of things on gauges. Standby.........

67dart273, gauge tester - Google Search

Below someone posted the resistance test values for one of the service gauge testers. With this you can use an ohmeter...........

HERE IS HOW the gauges OTHER than ammeter work:

The cluster is supplied switched power from the ignition switch...........which powers the gauge regulator various called IVR, instrument limiter, etc.............and the output is branched off to fuel, temp, and oil if you have it

ALL THREE GAUGES are identical electrically. That is, a certain resistance at the sender will result in the gauge needle reading the same on any of the gauges

From the gauges, the sender wires lead separately to the oil, temp, and fuel senders TO GROUND

Some things..........

Some problem areas...........

ALWAYS a suspect is broken/ loose/ corrode pins in the cluster/ PC board connector, either a the connector or at the board............

READ THIS

Printed circuit pins repair

Bad connections where the IVR plugs in. On my 67, the pc board traces were not making contact with the spring fingers for the IVR. The thread above shows this repair, solder jumpers across

The studs/ nuts at the gauges may not be making connection to the pc board. Loosen/ tighten the nuts several times, consider replacing the stamped nuts with "real" nuts.

There of course can be a wiring problem with the sender wires. The temp and oil (if present) go through the bulkhead connector, always a problem.

The senders themselves can be bad, inaccurate, or the wire connection loose/ corroded.

If you can scare up some resistors or a rheostat, or even have a spare fuel sender, you can set the resistance using your ohmeter and sub it for the sender to test. As the resistance chart above shows, this will result in 1/2 tank, full tank, etc whatever you set it for

 

[66DartSedan]

The amp / alt gauge has nothing to do with the rest. If the headlights work, and if turning them on with everything else off does not show a bit of movement to the left, then someone has bypassed the gauge, or it is "stuck." It is fed by the large black and large red wires.........BE CAREFUL!!! Full battery current UNFUSED is present on those leads.

I've posted hundreds of things on gauges. Standby.........

67dart273, gauge tester - Google Search

Below someone posted the resistance test values for one of the service gauge testers. With this you can use an ohmeter...........

View attachment 1715141203

HERE IS HOW the gauges OTHER than ammeter work:

The cluster is supplied switched power from the ignition switch...........which powers the gauge regulator various called IVR, instrument limiter, etc.............and the output is branched off to fuel, temp, and oil if you have it

ALL THREE GAUGES are identical electrically. That is, a certain resistance at the sender will result in the gauge needle reading the same on any of the gauges

From the gauges, the sender wires lead separately to the oil, temp, and fuel senders TO GROUND

Some things..........

Some problem areas...........

ALWAYS a suspect is broken/ loose/ corrode pins in the cluster/ PC board connector, either a the connector or at the board............

Okay, thank you !!

Well, tomorrow, I will FOR THE FIRST TIME, try and figure out how to get the dash instrument cover off and swap out the old for the new solid state IVR4. This right here is the best picture I could get underneath. Seem like I just unplug a few wires..........

 

[67Dart273]

You have a factory service manual? Go over to MyMopar and download one/ some for free..........SOME of those there came from the guys right here

EDIT........below is 67 later...........
Drop the column down, remove the battery ground, and remove the cluster screws. Reach up in and undo the speedo cable. 67 has a screw on, I think later ones are all "clip" on.

Sort of "tip" the cluster down at the top ....the rear of the speedo sort of "hooks" over the lower part of the dash frame

 

[gdizzle]

Welcome to the fun o f removing that cluster. Is this a 67? It looks earlier to me, like 66.
if it is 66 you will first have to remove the radio, heater panel, which means all the heater control knobs and radio knobs come off. Also the ash tray. Removing that panel gains you access to the right 2 screws which hold the cluster to the dash.

 

[67Dart273]

Welcome to the fun o f removing that cluster. Is this a 67? It looks earlier to me, like 66.
if it is 66 you will first have to remove the radio, heater panel, which means all the heater control knobs and radio knobs come off. Also the ash tray. Removing that panel gains you access to the right 2 screws which hold the cluster to the dash.

You are right I forgot he had the earlier.................

 

[66DartSedan]

Yes It is a 66 dodge dart sedan, But I dont have a radio, heater panel I assume is where the heater core was....ugh not looking fwd to that.

Welcome to the fun o f removing that cluster. Is this a 67? It looks earlier to me, like 66.
if it is 66 you will first have to remove the radio, heater panel, which means all the heater control knobs and radio knobs come off. Also the ash tray. Removing that panel gains you access to the right 2 screws which hold the cluster to the dash.

.

 

[stillrunners]

Yes It is a 66 dodge dart sedan, But I dont have a radio, heater panel I assume is where the heater core was....ugh not looking fwd to that.

.

thanks 67Dart

 

[67Dart273]

I'm slippin.................I believe your instrument regulator is inside the fuel gauge.................(has 3 terminals)

 

[66DartSedan]

I'm slippin.................I believe your instrument regulator is inside the fuel gauge.................(has 3 terminals)

Ive heard people say that, but in the photo you see on my instrument cluster a little square plug that looks exactly like a instrument limiter

 

[RedFish]

Ive heard people say that, but in the photo you see on my instrument cluster a little square plug that looks exactly like a instrument limiter

Well sir, your eyes are better than mine. I do not see a instrument voltage limiter in that photo. If your fuel gauge has 3 mounting posts, the limiter is housed inside.
As for the fuel gauge peg and off condition.... whatever regulator you've installed is sensing a overload or some fault condition and going off for a time. This would eventually kill the gauges.

 

[66DartSedan]

Well sir, your eyes are better than mine. I do not see a instrument voltage limiter in that photo. If your fuel gauge has 3 mounting posts, the limiter is housed inside.
As for the fuel gauge peg and off condition.... whatever regulator you've installed is sensing a overload or some fault condition and going off for a time. This would eventually kill the gauges.

Ah I see, thanks, yeah its a new voltage regulator electronic solid state.

 

[barracudadave67]

According to my 1966 Dodge FSM, the IVR is located on the back of the instrument cluster, on 66 Darts and Coronets. I couldn 't remember on the 66 Darts, cause I havn't had it out in a while, so I had to go look.

Dave

 

[RedFish]

One more thing I'll mention. I really couldn't tell in the video if the instrument panel was actually attached to the dash with screws, or just sitting in place. If it isn't attached to the dash with those screws, it wouldn't work right. If your replacement regulator has a ground wire attached to the inst' panel, it wouldn't work right either. The instrument panel harness doesn't contain a ground wire. The current might find a weak/intermittent ground path through the speedo cable attached. To add a ground wire is a wise move.

 

[66Dvert]

Yes It is a 66 dodge dart sedan, But I dont have a radio, heater panel I assume is where the heater core was....ugh not looking fwd to that.

.

don't forget to unhook the battery!!!!!!!!! Sparks fly everywhere!

this is what he is referring to (the bezel panel.)

here is the back side of a radio delete so you can see how that is attached (those nuts take the place of the radio shafts)

which lets you access the 2 hidden screws on the instrument cluster. here

and the last 2 on the left side of the cluster. the lower left one on the main housing is usually broken unless your are lucky.

better view of the right side.

 

[gdizzle]

Wow, I never knew you had the option to have the white background in the cluster, instead of the black. awesome.

 

[66DartSedan]

One more thing I'll mention. I really couldn't tell in the video if the instrument panel was actually attached to the dash with screws, or just sitting in place. If it isn't attached to the dash with those screws, it wouldn't work right. If your replacement regulator has a ground wire attached to the inst' panel, it wouldn't work right either. The instrument panel harness doesn't contain a ground wire. The current might find a weak/intermittent ground path through the speedo cable attached. To add a ground wire is a wise move.

It does have two screws on the left hand side. IM about to go to my car, to start some work on it. Now, call me crazy but in the photo below I think that is the IVR and maybe , just maybe i can pull it out and plug in the new one without taking the cluster off...

 

[gdizzle]

Yes that is the IVR. Issue is, there is also a small terminal wire from the condensor that routes and plugs in WITH one of the terminals on the IVR. Like 2 terminals into 1 hole. Not sure how you can manage that. But maybe if you are real careful you can get it back on. you better have some skinny, flexible, long fingers. have fun. That IVR is gonna take some shimmy in order to remove it. rock it back n forth.

 

[66DartSedan]

Yes that is the IVR. Issue is, there is also a small terminal wire from the condensor that routes and plugs in WITH one of the terminals on the IVR. Like 2 terminals into 1 hole. Not sure how you can manage that. But maybe if you are real careful you can get it back on. you better have some skinny, flexible, long fingers. have fun. That IVR is gonna take some shimmy in order to remove it. rock it back n forth.

Can you tell me whybrhe alternator has a plastic washer? Wouldn' that defeat the connections?

 

[gdizzle]

i dont think you want full volts running through the body of the alternator, since you'll be grounding it.??

 

[RedFish]

Your eyes are infact better than mine. I see it now. So there's a noise suppression cap' there somewhere also. It has its own single wire lead with a male spade terminal. That is poked into the center one of the 3 females with the limiter. Those who lay in the floor, remove the drivers seat/whatever it takes, to reach under and blind exchange a limiter sometimes let that additional terminal fall out and leave it out. A loose connection can result since that female terminal did have 2 male terminals in it for a very long time.
the alternator and amp gauge...There is no printed circuit board connection there. These posts should not contact anything but the wires. Thus the isolators. Current path is ring terminal to nut to post.

 

[gdizzle]

I think the last picture he is showing is the actual squareback alternator. Although you are correct on the ammeter the washers are not metal, they are some composite matieral so as not to energize the entire cluster body and fry everything. thus the reason most folks bypass that dumb gauge.

 

[66Dvert]

Wow, I never knew you had the option to have the white background in the cluster, instead of the black. awesome.

heh,heh,heh....nope you never did have that option. that is a one off setup I did for my dart.... I might have the pattern somewhere on my computer. it does look good though.

 

[66DartSedan]

Your eyes are infact better than mine. I see it now. So there's a noise suppression cap' there somewhere also. It has its own single wire lead with a male spade terminal. That is poked into the center one of the 3 females with the limiter. Those who lay in the floor, remove the drivers seat/whatever it takes, to reach under and blind exchange a limiter sometimes let that additional terminal fall out and leave it out. A loose connection can result since that female terminal did have 2 male terminals in it for a very long time.
the alternator and amp gauge...There is no printed circuit board connection there. These posts should not contact anything but the wires. Thus the isolators. Current path is ring terminal to nut to post.

Okay, I spent the last few hours, getting under and taking the dash cluster off. WOW, what a pain in the ***. and I didnt break anything! *pat on my back* Here's what I found:

One question i have is, if you look at where the Ignition plugs in, its missing a connection , i believe it's to the battery, So im confused as to how the car seems to turn over, with no issue

 

[RedFish]

So your harness connector for ignition switch leaves a switch terminal unused. I would ignore that. Just for the sake of saying, or FYI .... The aftermarket produces a replacement for later model column mounted switches and attaches a wire to every terminal routed to that switches remote connector. So go to a body with that switch and you have 1 wire more, one wire too many, and in the wrong positions too. This added wire makes a headache when installing that switch where the extra wire wasn't. I'll bet that if your model switch had its on short harness to a remote connector, the aftermarket would put a wire on every terminal. Anyway... Focus on the problem at hand and the hacked wires.
The large red and black should have been tied directly together. Why someone thought hiding a pizzy little blade fuse behind the inst' panel was a good idea? Damned if I know. Current to everything in the car travels that little Z. the wipers, brake lamps, turn signals, cig' lighter, you name it.