Hemi Question, What would you do

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So I've noticed my Hemi is smoking a little( blue smoke on acceleration). It's a Stanton built 426 and has about 400-500 miles on it. I've been noticing it more and more and I'm not sure what I wanta do. I spoke with Mr Stanton on the phone and he said to send it back if I'm not happy with it and he will take care of it. He seems to be a very stand up fellow who stands behind his work. I live in Colorado and I figure by the time I ship it to him in Kentucky I will have at least 500.00 in shipping. I run a garage and have my own Machinist I've been using for 14 years and he said bring him the short block and he'll rering it and hone it ( Probably looking at 300-500 dollars). The engine only smokes on accel and it seems to have a little blow-by through the breathers and I'm pretty sure it's smoking through the right bank of the engine more then the pass side bank. So I figure I have options, I could keep driving it and hope it clears up but I'm starting to doubt that, I have heard some people say thier Hemis smoked for 500-1000 miles before clearing up but that just doesn't seem right to me. I could send the engine back to Stanton and let them deal w/ it or I could take it apart myself and figure it out w/ my machinist. I havn't done a leak down or anything but it smokes and seems to have blow-by so I figure no matter what it probably needs to come apart. Anyone have any experience w/ a smoking Hemi. What would you guys do. I figure if I use my Machinist then he can check for anything else that may not be up to snuff while he has it. One more thing, Engine runs strong, is not noisey, has 30wt w/ a zync additive in it. What do you guys think?
 
If your machinist touches it, Stanton's responsibility regarding that engine ENDS.

Have another problem down the road..... It will be 100% your problem.

Just something to keep in mind.
 
Whether you ship it or send it back you're out about $500. IMO, send it back & let the builder worry about it. I would do a leakdown test on it before you ship it, though........
 
i was once told that during break-in... jackrabbit starts damage rings and high rpm's egg the bearings.

if you havent been doing either of those i would give it to 1000 miles. take it for rides where you can vary the speeds, accelerate and decelerate off and on. like a highway cruise.

if it's still smokin at 1000 i would send it to the builder
 
hemicop said:
Whether you ship it or send it back you're out about $500. IMO, send it back & let the builder worry about it. I would do a leakdown test on it before you ship it, though........
Click to expand...


X2 But wait till you have a 1000 mi first.
 
Well, I got off the phone w/ Gary Stanton this mourning. I would like to say he seems like a very stand up guy and is willing to warrenty my engine. He also said the engine was dynoed, rings seated and cam broke in at his shop before engine ships. He seems to think it's rings also. The car smokes good and there is no doubt about it. I know this could be the wrong thing to do but I'm gonna pull the engine tomorrow and get it down to a short block and send it to my machinist. He has built a few big blocks for me and has done all the work for my shop in the last 20 years and I have never had a come back on any of his work. He has built some of the pikes peak hill climb engines and has built alot of the performance engines running around on the front range. I'm hoping to keep this cheap as possible and I think this is the route to go. I will keep this thread updated and evryone please keep your fingers crossed for me. This is my fist Hemi and I want to enjoy it for many years to come.

P.S Moparlover that's cool your in Hagerstown, I grew up in Williamsport and graduated High School there in 1996.
 
^just wondering if you asked Mr. Stanton whether he'll still warranty the engine if you have this done?

(just in case something entirely unrelated goes wrong down the road)
 
I'd take plenty of good digital photographs during tear down and
email them to Stanton.

With good documentation, maybe he will send you new rings and
gaskets and pay the machining bill.

I would ask....and ask first.
 
moparlover said:
i was once told that during break-in... jackrabbit starts damage rings and high rpm's egg the bearings.

if you havent been doing either of those i would give it to 1000 miles. take it for rides where you can vary the speeds, accelerate and decelerate off and on. like a highway cruise.

if it's still smokin at 1000 i would send it to the builder
Click to expand...

I second this. I've seen them not smoke at initial startup, smoke during break in and then stop. Give it more time. If it has moly rings, they can take a while.
 
Well, I got it apart today. I knew it was smoking pretty bad and I really didn't think it was gonna go away. This mourning I had my wife drive it down the highway and I followed her. I did this to make sure it was only smokoing out of the Drivers side exhaust and it was, no doubt about it. So, when we got home I tore into it. When I pulled the Drivers side header it was obvious that 1 and 5 was the smokers, the tubes were soaked in oil. I got the engine on the stand and got the heads off once again it was obvious I have a problem. 1 and 5 were clean as a whistle, the cylinder walls look great so I'm figuring something is wrong w/ the oil rings. Not gonna dig any deeper, short block and the head off this bank will go to my machinist on Monday mourning. I really don't think it will be in the head cause of the symtoms but I guess we could be dealing w/ some sort of exhaust valves problem. Here are two pics of all 8 cylinders and you can see 1 and 5 are the clean ones. If all goes well, I'll have this thing back together next weekend and be cruising again be the following week w/out a smoke screen behind me.
keystone033.jpg

keystone032.jpg


Some of you are probably wondering why I didn't ship it back to Stanton but I have my reasons.
1. Probably looking at 800.00 shipping one way
2. He out sources his heads, so if it is a head problem who knows how long it will take to get it fixed?
3. I trust my Machinist
4. I get to see what's going on, where if I would have sent it back to him I don't.
5. I think this will be the cheaper route in the long run

I'm gonna contact Stanton and see if he will cover Gasket set and rings if that's what it ends up being. If he don't, no hard feelings. This is part of owning a car of this kind and I will deal w/ it. Thanks for everyones feed back and I will keep this thread updated!
 
Maybe I'm mis-reading something here, but if the cylinder walls look good, what makes you think it's a ring issue? With a bad cylinder I'd expect to see scuffing, scoring, uneven wear somewhere on the walls. Judigng from the pic, the poster that said bad intake gasket or valve seals may be the most accurate. I know big-block Chevys are hard on valve seals & I suspect the Hemi is no different due to its size & weight. I think I'd re-inpect your intake gaskets first, then check valve sealing THEN turn to the block/rings as your problem
 
And, thinking back to the early 70's, the rings wanted a long time to seat, like stated. and would just run like crap, and smoke, if putt putted around. I worked at a gas station/mech shop. A woman that had a 67 gtx hemi,(husband on deplotment), bought gas there, then complain about the engine, drop it off fore a tune-up.

Like all they cars in that neighborhood, carboned up; owner would tell me to try to blow it out first. So, take it out 20 miles on I-10, then start some fun, blowing crap out, engine loved it. But, hers was burning oil too. Until several episodes of me having fun, and getting paid for it.

Then it stopped burning oil.. Maybe from a dead stop and getting to 130 real fast seated the rings? It takes combustion pressure to make the rings come out of the piston grooves, and push on the cylinder wall.

I've had my last 340 do that. Needed a piston and rings. Fire it up, oil smoke, rev heck out of it; rings won't seat. Drive it, and dog it, put the load on the rings? Fine now.
 
Intake gaskets looked fine, was the 1st thing I pulled off and checked. The main reason I'm leaning towards rings is it doesn't smoke on start up, it only smokes on accel and going down the highway, not to mention I have smoke coming out my breathers. Looks like my engine is smoking a cigarette. In all my years of working on cars those are symtoms of rings. maybe I'm wrong. Engine will be at the machinist in the mourning.
 
$800 for shipping? Holy cow. I've shipped a Hemi from wisconsin to Cali for $200. Sounds like its time for a new shipper.

If I were Stanton, it'd be the end of the warranty as soon as you opened it up. Hopefully your machinist finds the problem, and you don't have any more.
 
200.00 for shipping, I don't have time to wait for the mule and buggy to come by, LMAO.

Anyways, My guy got the heads apart and the guides and seals look great. As I mentioned, Intake gaskets looked great also. Today or tomorrow their suppose to get the short block apart and inspected. I spoke w/ Mr. Stanton and him and my machinist are pretty sure it's the rings. Gonna get up w/ him on Monday once everything is inspected and see what he'll do for me. Hoping he'll cover rings and gaskets, if not, no biggie I'll get it taken care off. I'll keep things updated.
 
I cannot for the LIFE of me imagine WHY YOU DID NOT take the time to do some diagnostics, IE

compression test

leakdown test

look at fuel mixture IE is it running rich enough that fuel is washing the walls down.
 
You know, i don't know what to say. It's not rocket science. I've worked in a garage for 14 years. What's a compression check gonna do, the engine ran great and didn't miss, I have a 30,000 dollar scope in the shop that I used to tune and jet it with CO and HC readings.
It smokes on cruise and accel, that right there is enough for me to know it's rings.
Really don't care about leak down either cause that's about the same as a compression check other then you can find w/ it's leaking off to.
Truth is I think some of you guys think way to much, not to mention your not here to see what exactly is going on.
My question to everyone was how would you deal w/ Stanton Racing. I was also asking if anyone w/ a Hemi has had this problem and I don't think one person that has replied mentioned that they have a Hemi. As I was just thinking maybe a hemi had something wierd that I hadn't considered going on. As far as diagnosing my problem, that's why I'm the mechanic!

Just for anyone reading this, hear are some tips:
Smoke on decel or after you run your car and it sets for a while, I would think thats probably seals or guides, maybe intake.
Smoke on start up, same thing
These are high vacumm situations

Smoke on accel and cruise is probably gonna be rings most of the time.
Low Vacumm

There are acceptions to everything?
 
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